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What is faith?

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1 hour ago, beecee said:

I doubt that. You will certainly I believe keep on making threads as long as you are able [your crusade ] but inevitably you will still have no real evidence to show either any reality with your spaghetti monster, nor your numerology woo. 

 

 

Debating/arguing unscientific nonsense such is being discussed in this thread, can be rather challenging when the person pushing the woo position refuses to listen to contrary evidence, and just keeps repeating the same old nonsense post after post after post. It will though inevitably reach a stage where action of some sort will need to be taken. I would welcome that in this particular boring repetitive subject matter and the person pushing this woo.

Obviously the subject of any form of ID is unscientific nonsense and that has been shown many many times over different threads.

This new woo on numerology and how anyone can accept it is truly mind boggling!

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Numerology

Numerology is any belief in the divine or mysticalrelationship between a number and one or more coinciding events.[2] It is also the study of the numerical value of the letters in words, names and ideas. It is often associated with the paranormal, alongside astrology and similar divinatory arts.[3]

extract:

 

Lack of evidence]

Skeptics argue that numbers have no occult significance and cannot by themselves influence a person's life. Skeptics therefore regard numerology as a superstition and a pseudoscience that uses numbers to give the subject a veneer of scientific authority.[2]

Two studies have been done investigating numerological claims, both producing negative results, one in the UK in 1993,[10] and one in 2012 in Israel. The experiment in Israel involved a professional numerologist and 200 participants. The experiment was repeated twice and still produced negative results.

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It is really not woo if it involves a higher power of some sort. Are you going to call the beliefs of the billions of people who believe in a higher power woo?
A higher power is an acceptable idea to believe, and it doesn't have to be categorized as woo. 

Numerology or synchronicity are consistent with the idea of a higher power. It doesn't have to be scientific to be true.

I will definitely be making threads about this, and I will have a basis for my ideas, whether reasoning or otherwise.

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9 minutes ago, Endercreeper01 said:

It is really not woo if it involves a higher power of some sort. Are you going to call the beliefs of the billions of people who believe in a higher power woo?
A higher power is an acceptable idea to believe, and it doesn't have to be categorized as woo. 

Numerology or synchronicity are consistent with the idea of a higher power. It doesn't have to be scientific to be true.

I will definitely be making threads about this, and I will have a basis for my ideas, whether reasoning or otherwise.

I just submitted to a higher power: a forum moderator. 

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8 minutes ago, YaDinghus said:

I just submitted to a higher power: a forum moderator. 

Seriously? Religion has it's place to be discussed on this forum. Even woo has a place in the speculations to be discussed.

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10 minutes ago, Endercreeper01 said:

Even woo has a place in the speculations to be discussed.

No it doesn’t, read the rules.

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14 minutes ago, Endercreeper01 said:

Seriously? Religion has it's place to be discussed on this forum. Even woo has a place in the speculations to be discussed.

Yeah, seriously. See this: my serious face :angry:

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19 minutes ago, Endercreeper01 said:

Seriously? Religion has it's place to be discussed on this forum.  

!

Moderator Note

Not in this thread, though. The question before you is "what is faith?" Postulating the existence of a supreme being would seem to be beyond the scope of the discussion (though belief in said being would be within it, but that belief does not require the actual existence of the being)

 

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4 minutes ago, swansont said:
!

Moderator Note

Not in this thread, though. The question before you is "what is faith?" Postulating the existence of a supreme being would seem to be beyond the scope of the discussion (though belief in said being would be within it, but that belief does not require the actual existence of the being)

 

I was only responding to questions asking the basis of my beliefs.

Besides, I already have stated that I would be discussing the existence of a higher power in a different thread when asked such.

7 hours ago, Endercreeper01 said:

I haven't really fully explained my reasoning in detail yet. I am making threads about the topics soon, so it will show how and why there is a basis for what I am saying.

 

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53 minutes ago, Endercreeper01 said:

I was only responding to questions asking the basis of my beliefs.

Besides, I already have stated that I would be discussing the existence of a higher power in a different thread when asked such.

 

 

1 hour ago, Endercreeper01 said:

The rules don't mention woo. 

 

 

1 hour ago, Endercreeper01 said:

Seriously? Religion has it's place to be discussed on this forum. Even woo has a place in the speculations to be discussed.

 

1 hour ago, Endercreeper01 said:

It is really not woo if it involves a higher power of some sort. Are you going to call the beliefs of the billions of people who believe in a higher power woo?
A higher power is an acceptable idea to believe, and it doesn't have to be categorized as woo. 

Numerology or synchronicity are consistent with the idea of a higher power. It doesn't have to be scientific to be true.

I will definitely be making threads about this, and I will have a basis for my ideas, whether reasoning or otherwise.

 

On 6/4/2018 at 7:01 AM, Endercreeper01 said:

You don't understand what trust really is in a religious sense if you don't always have trust in a higher power. It means giving your heart to a higher power, entrusting with that you not only exist, you exist with a purpose and a reason. It is all about giving trust in your existence and reality itself to a higher power and giving yourself to it.

I might have, but I think the OP said something like this:

 

 

19 hours ago, Endercreeper01 said:

My definitions are supposed to be describing faith in a certain way. Faith in a higher power can be described as a trusting in a certain sense.

Faith can still be described with the idea of trust, in a way that describes the way that faith involves a personal connection to a higher power.

 

19 hours ago, Endercreeper01 said:

On a personal level, faith can be described as a trusting in it's existence, as opposed to simply believing in a higher power without any personal relationship or connection.

 

17 hours ago, Endercreeper01 said:

My acceptance of a higher power does not have to based in faith. It can be based on reasoning, and also involve an observation of naturally occurring synchronicity in reality.

 

16 hours ago, Endercreeper01 said:

What I said was there is a difference between evidence in scientific contexts and evidence in other contexts. What may not be considered evidence in science could be considered evidence elsewhere. 

I am referring to synchronicity in reality itself, with a significant alignment, pattern, or number appearing throughout in reality, where it would have a very small probability of occurring without any interference of a higher power.

 

16 hours ago, Endercreeper01 said:

What woo are you referring to? The idea of a higher power is not woo, nor is the phenomena of synchronicity.

 

9 hours ago, Endercreeper01 said:

You can only call what I am saying woo if I am pretending that what I am saying is science, which I am not. The term pseudoscience only applies when something that isn't science is being presented as science, when I am not doing that. I have stated that I am discussing a topic outside of the limit of science, but is still reasonable to discuss.

 

Evidence can be used in a different context to show the validity of an idea without being rooted in scientific thought and still have a basis in reality, which is the point I am trying to make.

It's not about small probabilities, it is about synchronicity that would have had a very small chance to occur without a higher power. I will be making a thread on this soon to explain more where this phenomena appears.

A higher power can be described by it's effects on reality, but it is hard to describe exactly what the higher power itself is, without any other knowledge other than that the higher power has power over reality.

I haven't explained myself yet, I have only explained that I have an explanation that I will and can explain.

I will be making threads explaining synchronicity more, and discussing my reasoning behind a god. For now, I will only say that there is basis for my ideas, which I will be discussing in detail in those threads. 

And I wasn't referring to anecdotes as evidence for synchronicity, if you thought I was.

 

8 hours ago, Endercreeper01 said:

Yes, I will definitely be making threads about this soon. They will go into much more detail and explanation.

It's not that I lack logic. I haven't really fully explained my reasoning in detail yet. I am making threads about the topics soon, so it will show how and why there is a basis for what I am saying.

 

On 6/4/2018 at 6:05 AM, Endercreeper01 said:

Faith is not only about belief, it is about trust. True faith is when you have trust in a higher power and you personally connect with the higher power.

A collection of your contributions on this thread so far. I could let the evidence speak for itself, but I'll say it anyway: you are deliberately obtuse, imprecise and repetitive, sometimes evasive. You don't ever present anything that resembles evidence, only assertions based in a logic that you refuse to lay out. It is beyond frustrating trying to commubicate with you! I could convince a steel concrete wall to fall over before you budge to reason

Edited by YaDinghus

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1 hour ago, YaDinghus said:

A collection of your contributions on this thread so far. I could let the evidence speak for itself, but I'll say it anyway: you are deliberately obtuse, imprecise and repetitive, sometimes evasive. You don't ever present anything that resembles evidence, only assertions based in a logic that you refuse to lay out. It is beyond frustrating trying to commubicate with you! I could convince a steel concrete wall to fall over before you budge to reason

First, the thread was asking me about "what is faith?". I was only responding to the thread with my own post about faith.

Second, I said that I will be creating threads to address the evidence that has been asked of me to provide, which is where I will address this problem. So evidence is a problem that I will be addressing, so don't say that I am not providing evidence because I will do that in future threads and not in this thread.

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1 hour ago, YaDinghus said:

I could convince a steel concrete wall to fall over before you budge to reason

Therein lies the heart of this thread: faith proceeds regardless of evidence or reason.

We see it as a weakness, but for some religious people it is a strength. I personally have no problem with it, as long as people are honest about it.

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18 minutes ago, Prometheus said:

Therein lies the heart of this thread: faith proceeds regardless of evidence or reason.

We see it as a weakness, but for some religious people it is a strength. I personally have no problem with it, as long as people are honest about it.

The point that I am making is that I do have reason and/or evidence behind it.

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1 minute ago, Endercreeper01 said:

The point that I am making is that I do have reason 

No one doubts you have a reason to want to feel superior, we just have no reason to believe your excuses.

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3 hours ago, Endercreeper01 said:

 

Besides, I already have stated that I would be discussing the existence of a higher power in a different thread when asked such.

 

Please do. If you provide examples, I, and others on this forum, will be happy to explain statistics to you.

Don't expect to fool anyone here, though; we know quite a bit about statistics.

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13 hours ago, Endercreeper01 said:

Yes, I will definitely be making threads about this soon. They will go into much more detail and explanation.

It's not that I lack logic. I haven't really fully explained my reasoning in detail yet. I am making threads about the topics soon, so it will show how and why there is a basis for what I am saying.

Do it, stop threatening to do it... 

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1 minute ago, Endercreeper01 said:

I am making one....

 I await your thread with baited breath.. 

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1 minute ago, Moontanman said:

 I await your thread with baited breath.. 

Save your strenght for yourself and the Missus Moon.

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2 minutes ago, koti said:

Save your strenght for yourself and the Missus Moon.

I'm too old, mean, and ugly to die.. 

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7 hours ago, Endercreeper01 said:

It is really not woo if it involves a higher power of some sort. Are you going to call the beliefs of the billions of people who believe in a higher power woo?
A higher power is an acceptable idea to believe, and it doesn't have to be categorized as woo. 

The beliefs of billions at best are just unscientific. But woo it is and you seem to be its greatest adherent. [You will probably now wear that as your badge of honour] https://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/woo-woo dubiously or outlandishly mystical, supernatural, or unscientific

Quote

I will definitely be making threads about this, and I will have a basis for my ideas, whether reasoning or otherwise.

Make as many as you like, that's your perogative within the rules of course. But you will never show that anything supernatural and/or paranormal is anything more then woo and unscientific. But hey! the ball's in your court...prove me a liar.

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On 04/06/2018 at 1:54 PM, YaDinghus said:

That does seem to be a core psychological aspect of faith and superstition. Some people seem to be more prone to it than others. I couldn't say if it was an universal trait of human psychology, but it seems common enough to be considered a special case if anyone missed it.

However, since there are certainly plenty of people who reject faith and still suffer from confirmation bias, it may be a necessary aspect but not a sufficient one. 

So you don't think think this could be an aspect of faith taken in other direction?

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Maybe it is, maybe it isn’t. The problem here is you’re trying to shoehorn faith into any crevice you can find, force it into places where it isn’t necessary and doesn’t belong, and you’re doing this instead of proactively describing situations where proceeding without faith is impossible. 

I cant think of a single situation (outside of accepting unfounded untenable claims as valid) where faith is actually prerequisite. Can you?

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24 minutes ago, iNow said:

I cant think of a single situation (outside of accepting unfounded untenable claims as valid) where faith is actually prerequisite. Can you?

Excellent point. Tortured definitions for faith that state garbage like "breathing requires faith because you can never know 100% that the air you are about the breath isn't invisible poised gas" ignore the difference between knowing quite a bit facts and no facts at all. 

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6 hours ago, naitche said:

So you don't think think this could be an aspect of faith taken in other direction?

What do you mean by that?

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7 hours ago, YaDinghus said:

What do you mean by that?

I believe the intent is to suggest that the rejection of faith is itself an act of faith, which is IMO self-evidently ludicrous as a position

We can obviously wait for naitche to clarify directly, but I'm not optimistic that clarity will be added

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