Randolpin

Is Quantum Fluctuations has a Cause?

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Randolpin    24

For my curiousity sake, I want to ask this question to you guys who are scientifically inclined individuals.

Is Q.F has a cause or not?

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Strange    2543

The probabilistic nature of quantum theory and, specifically, the Heisenberg Uncertainty Principle.

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Randolpin    24

The probabilistic nature of quantum theory and, specifically, the Heisenberg Uncertainty Principle.

Then,base on this observation,is it has a cause or not?

Edited by Randolpin

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Strange    2543

What do you mean by "cause". The Heisenberg uncertainty principle (and quantum mechanics, more generally) is a description of how the world works.

 

Are you asking why the world is the way it is? If so, that is a question for philosophy (or religion) not physics.

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MigL    526

What Strange gave you are properties of QM which 'allow' things to happen.

Basically anything that could possibly happen has a probability of happening.

No repeatability and no direct link between events.

 

That is not the standard definition of 'cause'.

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So quantum fluctuations can arise out of nothing or do they originate out of something?

 

My father always told me that something cannot originate from nothing. So is my father wrong or not?

Edited by seriously disabled

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Mordred    930

quantum fluctuations require some energy source to perform the work in creating the virtual particle pair. They do not arise out of nothing. Your father is right.

 

For example virtual particles can arise from temperature such as the blackbody temperature of a BH. (Hawkings radiation)

 

potential differences between two plates with an insulator (Casimir effect)

 

To understand the Casimiir effect you must first understand quantum vacuum

 

A vacuum is not simply nothing at all, but is best pictured as a superposition of many different states of electromagnetic field. In the instance specifically of the Casimiir effect. Were not concerned with other fields for the Casimiir effect. However every field has fluctuations.

 

These fluctuations give rise to quantum fluctuations via the Heisenburg uncertainty principle. It is not free energy.

Edited by Mordred

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AshBox    0

quantum fluctuations require some energy source to perform the work in creating the virtual particle pair. They do not arise out of nothing. Your father is right.

 

For example virtual particles can arise from temperature such as the blackbody temperature of a BH. (Hawkings radiation)

 

potential differences between two plates with an insulator (Casimir effect)

 

To understand the Casimiir effect you must first understand quantum vacuum

 

A vacuum is not simply nothing at all, but is best pictured as a superposition of many different states of electromagnetic field. In the instance specifically of the Casimiir effect. Were not concerned with other fields for the Casimiir effect. However every field has fluctuations.

 

These fluctuations give rise to quantum fluctuations via the Heisenburg uncertainty principle. It is not free energy.

Agree with you. The quantum effects are not determined. Therefore, a quantum fluctuation has no "cause." I can also say that, this is one of the big dramatic problem which is still unsolved.

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J.C.MacSwell    182

So quantum fluctuations can arise out of nothing or do they originate out of something?

 

My father always told me that something cannot originate from nothing. So is my father wrong or not?

Arguably your father was in a superposition of right and wrong... >:D

 

Seriously I don't think at base level there are causes as we know them...there is something unknown to us at that level such that nothing is predetermined as an inevitable cause.

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Arguably your father was in a superposition of right and wrong... >:D

 

Seriously I don't think at base level there are causes as we know them...there is something unknown to us at that level such that nothing is predetermined as an inevitable cause.

So are you saying that according to quantum field theory something can indeed be produced from nothing under certain conditions?

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MigL    526

Zero point energy may be the source of such things like virtual particles ( borrowed energy ), but the effect is not reproducible ( probabilistic ) so, can you really say it is 'caused' ?

Sometimes you get effect A, sometimes you get effect B, and there is even a slim chance of getting effect C, D, E...

That is not the standard definition of cause, Mordred.

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Mordred    930

I wasn't defining cause, Nothing doesn't really exist under QM. Doesn't really fit in physics. The closest definition of nothing is the ground state of a vacuum. At least under physics. You always have a quantum vacuum due to the Heisenburg uncertainty principle.

 

Then again does everything require a cause?

 

"In quantum physics, a quantum fluctuation (or quantum vacuum fluctuation or vacuum fluctuation) is the temporary change in the amount of energy in a point in space,[1] as explained in Werner Heisenberg's uncertainty principle."

 

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Quantum_fluctuation

 

quantum fluctuations can be simply described as a property of a potential field. As a property they don't necessarily require a cause.

 

"The Heisenburg uncertainty principle is an inherent property of all wavelike systems."

Edited by Mordred

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Randolpin    24

under QM the lowest possible energy state is not nothing but a vacuum condition called zero point energy.

 

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Zero-point_energy

 

 

So why q.m characterizes to having the lowest possible energy which is zero point energy?

Why it is uncause? So it means that it doesn't require time or the time dimension is not real?

Edited by Randolpin

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swansont    6251

 

 

So why q.m characterizes to having the lowest possible energy which is zero point energy?

Why it is uncause? So it means that it doesn't require time or the time dimension is not real?

 

 

In the QM solution to the harmonic oscillator, the energy of a state is (n+1/2)[math]\hbar\omega[/math]

 

So even the lowest state, n=0, (i.e. no particles present) has an energy.

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Randolpin    24

 

 

In the QM solution to the harmonic oscillator, the energy of a state is (n+1/2)[math]\hbar\omega[/math]

 

So even the lowest state, n=0, (i.e. no particles present) has an energy.

 

 

Then why even in the lowest state it still have an energy?

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swansont    6251

 

 

Then why even in the lowest state it still have an energy?

 

 

Because there is still 1/2[math]\hbar\omega[/math] of energy in the system. That's what QM tells you.

 

In another basic system, there is one particle, but it still has 1/2[math]\hbar\omega[/math] of energy; the particle is not like a classical system where it would be at rest in the lowest energy state. In atoms, we know the lowest energy state is not one with zero kinetic energy.

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Randolpin    24

 

 

Because there is still 1/2[math]\hbar\omega[/math] of energy in the system. That's what QM tells you.

 

In another basic system, there is one particle, but it still has 1/2[math]\hbar\omega[/math] of energy; the particle is not like a classical system where it would be at rest in the lowest energy state. In atoms, we know the lowest energy state is not one with zero kinetic energy.

 

Sorry but why is it still 1/2...

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swansont    6251

 

Sorry but why is it still 1/2...

 

 

You have to solve the equation to see the 1/2 appear. The point is, in QM, the answer is not zero.

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Randolpin    24

 

 

You have to solve the equation to see the 1/2 appear. The point is, in QM, the answer is not zero.

 

 

Where this quantum fluctuations came from and why it has the property to fluctuate?

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swansont    6251

 

 

Where this quantum fluctuations came from and why it has the property to fluctuate?

 

 

It's how nature behaves.

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Randolpin    24

It is a question science can't answer.I plan to make a way on studying why nature is the way it is.

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swansont    6251

It is a question science can't answer.I plan to make a way on studying why nature is the way it is.

 

 

It's not part of science, which is why science can't answer.

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Randolpin    24

I think this ends our discussion about this topic?


I am not satisfied because science is limited. Is time existed in the domain of quantum mechanics? if not then time doesn't really exist. This reasoning is due to the property of qunatum mechanics which is very different from classical mechanics. According to mainstream science, qm has no cause which contradict the nature of time because "cause" property is a consequence of the arrow of time which is towards the future.

Edited by Randolpin

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Phi for All    4814

I am not satisfied because science is limited.

 

It seems more like you aren't satisfied because science doesn't give "answers" to questions, but rather it offers explanations using a preponderance of evidence to support them. You've misunderstood science, but instead of trying to understand it, you've decided it should look like your misunderstanding of it.

 

You will fail, because what you want isn't the way the universe works.

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