This came up in a different thread when imatfaal tried to use "ignoral" to describe an instance of someone ignoring something. It follows the proper structure, but isn't in the dictionary. What would be the proper usage there?

 

It's an odd case overall, I think, because "ignorance" means you don't know something, but "ignore" means you know about it but refuse to acknowledge it. So if you're guilty of an instance of ignorance, did you know or not? Or are ignore and ignorance not related?

Obtuse?

Not quite. He was trying to come up with a word (a noun) that means "the deliberate ignoring of". For no real reason other than it would have fitted in the sentence. "Ignoring" would probably do; it is the usual way to create a noun from a verb.

 

To me, "ignoral" sounded plausible; it was obvious what he meant by it and I could imagine using it.

 

I wasn't sure initially why that was. I assume because of analogy with other forms (which is one of the main ways we coin new words). But the obvious examples (e.g. season -> seasonal) all seem to go from noun to adjective. So it may not be a standard derivation.

 

Imatfaal asked "is this a word". I say yes, but I guess some people might say that it isn't a word if it isn't in the dictionary.

It's an odd case overall, I think, because "ignorance" means you don't know something, but "ignore" means you know about it but refuse to acknowledge it. So if you're guilty of an instance of ignorance, did you know or not? Or are ignore and ignorance not related?

 

Apparently, ignore originally meant "to not know, be ignorant of". The sense of deliberately choosing not to know is later (although it doesn't say how much later).

http://www.etymonline.com/index.php?term=ignore

QUOTE: A word that means "the deliberate ignoring of".

 

Shun?

QUOTE: A word that means "the deliberate ignoring of".

 

Shun?

 

Shunning, maybe (it needs to be a noun):

 

"we do not allow soap-boxing (which is the continued indifference to / ignoral (*) of any counter-arguments or comments)"

"we do not allow soap-boxing (which is the continued indifference to / ignoring of any counter-arguments or comments)"

"we do not allow soap-boxing (which is the continued indifference to / shunning of any counter-arguments or comments)"

or 'disregarding' then, maybe.

Ignorance should work as the noun, but it doesn't. If we said "we don't allow soapboxing (which is the continued insistence that one is right without offering evidence), insistence works as the noun for insist. But ignore has that pesky qualifier that you're doing it on purpose, whereas ignorance is innocent.

Wilfully ignorant

or 'disregarding' then, maybe.

 

That is better - shunning, to me, seems like something you do to a person, not to an idea (or the idea of a person).

 

But as both shunning and disregarding use the gerund as a noun, this suggests that the best term is probably ignoring.

Wilfully ignorant

 

Wilfnorant.

Ignorance should work as the noun, but it doesn't. If we said "we don't allow soapboxing (which is the continued insistence that one is right without offering evidence), insistence works as the noun for insist. But ignore has that pesky qualifier that you're doing it on purpose, whereas ignorance is innocent.

 

Interestingly, igNORance does sound like it should work (by analogy with insistence) even though the usual pronunciation (IGn'rance) doesn't!

 

So maybe it is the stress (and long o vowel) in ignoral that makes it sound right.

 

Interestingly, igNORance does sound like it should work (by analogy with insistence) even though the usual pronunciation (IGn'rance) doesn't!

 

So maybe it is the stress (and long o vowel) in ignoral that makes it sound right.

 

You're right, I didn't even think about that, even though I was saying igNORance in my head.

Not quite. He was trying to come up with a word (a noun) that means "the deliberate ignoring of". For no real reason other than it would have fitted in the sentence. "Ignoring" would probably do; it is the usual way to create a noun from a verb.

 

To me, "ignoral" sounded plausible; it was obvious what he meant by it and I could imagine using it.

 

I wasn't sure initially why that was. I assume because of analogy with other forms (which is one of the main ways we coin new words). But the obvious examples (e.g. season -> seasonal) all seem to go from noun to adjective. So it may not be a standard derivation.

 

Imatfaal asked "is this a word". I say yes, but I guess some people might say that it isn't a word if it isn't in the dictionary.

 

Apparently, ignore originally meant "to not know, be ignorant of". The sense of deliberately choosing not to know is later (although it doesn't say how much later).

http://www.etymonline.com/index.php?term=ignore

 

A better explanation than I would have given. FYG the analogy I had in mind was refer -> referral which I think fits better.

 

Interestingly, igNORance does sound like it should work (by analogy with insistence) even though the usual pronunciation (IGn'rance) doesn't!

 

So maybe it is the stress (and long o vowel) in ignoral that makes it sound right.

 

Agree again - it is the same intonation / stress pattern as referral which was my pattern

 

the analogy I had in mind was refer -> referral which I think fits better.

 

Perfect!

 

The example here: https://faculty.unlv.edu/nagelhout/ENG411Bs12C/mod1concept1.html

is refuse -> refusal

 

They define the -al morpheme as meaning "act or process of", which fits with your usage.

Wilfully ignorant

That's a good one. My dad uses premeditated stupidity.

They define the -al morpheme as meaning "act or process of", which fits with your usage.

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I don't see it.

 

I would say

Ignoral - stemming from the tendency to ignore, or characteristic of such individuals.

Not quite. He was trying to come up with a word (a noun) that means "the deliberate ignoring of". For no real reason other than it would have fitted in the sentence. "Ignoring" would probably do; it is the usual way to create a noun from a verb.

 

To me, "ignoral" sounded plausible; it was obvious what he meant by it and I could imagine using it.

 

I wasn't sure initially why that was. I assume because of analogy with other forms (which is one of the main ways we coin new words). But the obvious examples (e.g. season -> seasonal) all seem to go from noun to adjective. So it may not be a standard derivation.

 

Imatfaal asked "is this a word". I say yes, but I guess some people might say that it isn't a word if it isn't in the dictionary.

 

Apparently, ignore originally meant "to not know, be ignorant of". The sense of deliberately choosing not to know is later (although it doesn't say how much later).

http://www.etymonline.com/index.php?term=ignore

 

refer -> referral

deny -> denial

peruse -> perusal

 

-al has two uses. noun -> adjective and verb -> noun

 

So you were right the first time.

Like stacks of other words in English, the word "ignorance" has more than one meaning.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Homonym

 

This

"we do not allow soap-boxing (which is the continued indifference to / ignorance of any counter-arguments or comments)"

is perfectly correct.

Unfortunately it's likely to be misunderstood; something else that happens a lot in English.

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I don't see it.

 

Some of your examples are words that just happen to end in -al, not formed from the morpheme -al. In other case, they follow the definition (e.g. post->postal, doctor->doctoral) ... bearing in mind that the semantics of bound morphemes is quite broad.