MigL

Why are we even talking about maximal entropy systems where there is a source of useable energy ? It doesn't happen because the core provides energy ( radiative heat ) causing motion due to differential heating. What does happen in a 'dead' asteroid is stratification according to density. That's exactly how gravity works. Are we not discussing maximal entropy, as in the 'heat death' of the universe ? A system in a state without flux of energy through its boundary, that is in its lowest possible energy would tend to, and eventually have no choice but, to be in equilibrium. For such a state to be dynamic it would need an influx of energy. For such a state to be unstable it would not be in its lowest possible energy.

I didn't think I had to ... Really ? Is that the lowest energy state ? Or is this ??? Not if we both learn something 🙂 .

Thanks Swansont. Was just about to reply that the energy states @studiot talks about are already occupied, and in equilibrium with gravity ( a conservative force ). To access any other independent states, or degrees of freedom, you would need to add useable energy. The same can be said for @sethoflagos planet and atmosphere example. They are in equilibrium with gravity; where are the other independent states, or degrees of freedom, that are available ?

If the energy of the system has a path to another state ( an independent degree of freedom ) then that 'dilutes' the energy available, and entropy increases. If there is no path to another state, then the system is in equilibrium at maximum entropy. The example I previously used was proton decay, as we are not sure it can happen. If it does decay ( no sooner than 1034 years ), then it provides a path to another state, and proton decay may well provide the 'last' useable energy of the universe, before 'heat death'.

The only solution seems to be a mix of Capitalism ( for a viable economy ) and Socialism ( for protection of the vulnerable and 'structure' for society ). The US used to have a pretty good mix until the 70s-80s. It has gone downhill since, and fallen off the cliff last january. Canada seems to have a decent mix ( why I live here ), but there are grumblings that some want to change the current Capitalism/Socialism mix. I guess every country has people that want a 'change of mix', and some ( Russia, China, Iran, NKorea, the US and others ) have very valid reasons.

Could be; he doesn't seem human.

You may see entropy from a Chemistry viewpoint @sethoflagos , I see it from a Physics viewpoint ( subtle difference ). Entropy is a measure of the number of ways, or degrees of freedom, that energy/particles can be arranged in. Maximal entropy is when all possible states are occupied and there are no further paths to other independent states. I don't see the relevance of 'structures'. I believe the Equipartition Theorem is a valid example

Machines could conceivably travel among stars at light-speed. Here's the scenario ... A machine intelligence transmits plans for a sufficiently advanced civilization to build a copy of itself on another system. It then transmits its 'software' to the copy machine at the speed of light. It then 'looks around', and when satisfied, beams its consciousness/software back to its origin. The plans to build the copy could be hidden or in plain sight, depending on whether its purpose was nefarious, or not. Maybe the Government already got those messages, and is busy building AI Data Centers which in, a few decades, will contain the 'consciousness' of alien invaders ....

Kind of shocking that in some ways ( wealth distribution ) things were better for black people in the 60s. It would be even more enlightening if an inflation graph was superimposed on those charts. I would be willing to bet that they have also fallen behind in 'purchasing power' even more than other groups. And that would affect whether they can afford food to stay healthy, purchase housing, or retirement savings.

As i see it, even if we moved away from a Capitalist system, to a fully Socialist, or even Communist system, but kept the practice of wealthy individuals/companies being able to lobby, or otherwise influence Government, we would be in exactly the same situation. The wealth discrepancies are no less pronounced in states that rebelled and tried the Marx experiment. V Putin is kept in power by Russian oligarchs, and whenever one of them gets 'out of line' it necessitates a push out of the nearest window. Money always talks louder than reason; as Swansont says "Its human nature".

Idolize is too strong a word, but I do admire R Oppenheimer, E Fermi, L Szilard, H Bethe, R Feynman, E Teller, E Lawrence, J Chadwick, G Seaborg, and others who took part in the development of the American atomic bombs that killed over 200000 people on two separate days in 1945. A number of deaths that is 1000 times larger than the Sand Creek Massacre. Can you see my point now, or do I need to elaborate ? I don't think that particular system is the main fault. The bigger problem is that our elected representatives are bought by wealthy individuals and corporations ( who are now 'individuals' in the eyes of the Supreme Court. These permissive laws put another tool in the hand of the corporations who add to the toolbox that enables them to generate massive profits. Neither the politicians or the wealthy ( corporations/individuals ) have any incentive to change the situation, as they both profit at taxpayer/workers expense. My apologies if I say 'our', as I'm not American, but until Jan 2025 when you guys lost your way, I considered myself almost American. Unfortunately Canada is only slightly better, but we are still vulnerable to American economic pressure. I guess we'll just have to join the EU.

Great; Just what we needed. A schizophrenic AI.

Yeah, I guess Phi and I had been agreeing too much lately; that's gotta stop. ( and this is meandering a bit off track ) Nobody is 100% good or 100% bad. We admire people for certain things they do, because those things are important to us at certain periods in time, and we ignore unsavory actions they may take, because they are not important to us ... at that point in time. As our sensibilities evolve and change over time so do our priorities, and things we may have ignored hundreds of years ago have now become despicable acts. I don't judge the past with today's viewpoint and sensibilities. And the acts for which they were admired, still deserve admiration. I don't want to get religious, but someone once said "Let he who is without sin cast the first stone." It's highly unlikely, but, who knows, maybe someday even D Trump will be remembered for one good thing he did. ( although I can't think of anything )

Yeah. The Injustice Department released a batch of files also, and they contained references to multiple UCP. ( Unidentified Criminal Perpetrators ) And some of these UCPs may be DJTs. Is there no end to the lengths he'll go to in order to distract from his criminal activities ?

Sure, but the time span I mentioned is 1040 years. How much Rubidium 87 will be left after Ten Thousand Billion Billion Billion Billion years ?

not sure what advantage us gained by increasing the density of the water to a slurry. Sure, you can use a lower height for storage, but the pumping load increases proportionately with the increase in density. I haven't done, or seen, calculations so I'm not sure of any benefits other than convenience of using existing geological formations.

Photons of the CMB have red-shifted from 3500o to 2.7o in 1.4x1010 years. Once all the stars burn out ( say 1020 years ), how long do you think it will take for any of their emitted photons to red-shift to an energy where they can no longer excite fundamental particles? Another 1010 years ? What will they be then ? At that time, the only source of useable energy might come from proton decay ( assuming it actually happens ).

To be clear ... There is no incompatibility between Gravity and Quantum Mechanics; they both work seamlessly at all scales, and have always done so. The incompatibility is in our models with which we describe them. IOW, we need better models, because the current ones are incomplete for some situations.

These Billionaires make their money from investments. That's why D Trump keeps insisting the 'economy' is good; the stock market keeps going up. Their economy is doing great. The rest of us are subject to a different economy, where we have to work, at low wages, to buy food, housing and gasoline at the inflated prices that are fueling the stock market. The rich get richer, and the poor get screwed ... again.

Once protons start decaying at a minimum of 1034 years, I can't imagine any living things to be around ... Omce our galaxy is the only gravitationally bound system in the observable ( causal ) universe, how would you determine growth of the scale factor ? No, I've already had second thoughts about the situation in a previous post. Oscillations between energy levels of fundamental particles ( no decay ) would be governed by the energy/time uncertainty relation, making time an essential factor.

Don't have much time as I have a busy day ( I thought those were over once retired ) but I just had to reply to this. Facts are global ( apply to everyone - objective ); truth is local ( applies to one person - subjective ).

I wasn't thinking of Quantum fluctuations as typically understood, but rather fluctuations around the final equilibrium of the maximal entropy universe. But you do bring up a good point. The Quantum fluctuations due to the Uncertainty Principle cannot be ignored as they are a necessity of Quantum systems. The energy-time uncertainty dictates that their deltas must be greater than , or equal to, h-bar/2. IOW, 'borrowed' energy for the fluctuation must be re-paid within a specific period of time. As this is a process that even maximal entropy cannot stop, time IS still needed.

Interesting question. But keeping in mind that ALL processes would be halted, and QM oscillations could go backwards or forward, there would be absolutely no way to detect the passage of time. If time is redundant, would it still exist indepenently ?

Science based on word play. Who would have thunk it ...

Well ... possibly. Once maximal entropy is reached, and the universe is essentially at equilibrium, no processes can go forward or backward. Sure, there will be some small oscillations about the equilibrium state, because of QM, but how would you measure the passage of time ? ( if this wasn't off topic, it would make an interesting discussion ) Edit - I see you fixed that problem. Thanks.