dimreepr

Most people are happy to have a party, even 😣 a themed one... 😉 How does it relate to the topic?

I don't see how that could be true, other than in the aftermath of a revolution. If that's the only stumbling block for you, think of it in term's of the tyre metaphore, you don't need to kick the tyre to inflate it and the tyre is hardly in a position to kick you. Think about, why you felt the need to mention your black friend? It's not an accusation, so please don't get defensive; it's about the insidious nature of what our culture teaches us. It's not the same thing at all, you just didn't get invited to a party; the Windrush generation got invited to a party and when they got there, with a one way ticket, there's a sign on the door "No dog's, No Irish and No Black's", now get to work.

It's like trying to downsize a ponzi scheme, first you have to recognise... 🧐

Sometimes with a slow puncture, it's easier and more cost effective to just pump it up. Nevertheless, it's still glad it wasn't kicked this time.

A tyre doesn't care who inflates it... It's just happy it wasn't kicked this time... 😉

I am in the context of the thread, all the arguments from the defence have been rebutted, so: This thread has ceased to be, gone to meet its maker < snip > this is a dead parrot. If you want me to explain the relevance of Shelly's poem, just ask nicely... 😉 edit. some people accuse me of being cryptic, and that's a lot of pressure, so I like to keep my hand in... Perhaps you should take one; feel free to ask us when you get stuck. 🙂

Indeed, but "Look on my Works, ye Mighty, and despair!" “What’s in a name? A rose by any other name would smell as sweet”

I'm afraid not, because it's nirvana and it's essentially unattainable; society objectifies better, for good and ill, and it's tremendously difficult to say no too ones family/culture. Culture tends to move like a continent, very slowly but with the occasional sudden and explosive jerk's.

Words are important, for understanding to follow.

That's still just kicking the tyre, unless you like to patch a tyre with a tear in your eye? No it doesn't, or at least it shouldn't, that's the point of the quote: “Waste no more time arguing what a good man should be. Be one.” – Marcus Aurelius IOW Don't kneel on a man's throat, unless it's consensual... 😉

It's interesting that you continue to swap out reparation for retribution. Repair = patching the tyre and reinflation. Retribution = kicking the tyre and hopping about with a tear in your eye.

You can dress it up in different clothes, but it's still a Barbie. It's where we always go, it's where we've always been; for instance, I supported Stoke City at school because no-one else did, I chose Stoke City because that's who my uncle supported; all my peers chose from the main contenders, Man united et al, and mostly fell in with their friends choice. It's up to the individual thinkers to probe the consensus for flaws and suggest a better fairer way foward. Only in the abstract... We all know it's not good to kneel on a mans throat, even if he survived it. If everyone in society chucked in a few dollar's, then yes it could.

And as I've said before, better is objectified by society/culture/village/neighbours etc. If only we could find a better way to inject a better attitude, in those that disagree with... Us. 🤔

Oh great, another one that doesn't read my post's 🙄, but thanks for the advice; here's a thought, if you have nothing to argue my point, but yet another OT cheap shot, I wouldn't mind if you just kept it to yourself (less embarrassing all round I think). 😉 This thread reminds me of the gun debate, because there's really only one argument for the defence, "fuck off, don't take my guns.", everything else is just an excuse to keep the status quo.

It's funny isn't it, we're willing to spend untold millions in celabrating the 'triumphs' of the dead, or essentially kaput, WWII et al, and spend untold millions defending/hiding the mistakes of our father's, (edit to add. rather than just say sorry); but we're willing to "spend a penny" (pun intended) on their living victim's. Well I say funny 🤒. But you gotta laugh at something... I'm just trying to promote a better society, what's your excuse?

Nope, read again I asked @Jez to think about it as if he was a victim. Mine too, but I'm not asking for nirvana/utopia (it doesn't exist), just somewhere on the road to it; until the advent of the revolutionary, we use our critical thinking skills, to sort the wheat from the chaff; baby steps will do, until we're ready to take a giant leap. “Waste no more time arguing what a good man should be. Be one.” – Marcus Aurelius. Not at all, I'm grateful for the society, I grew up in, that gave me shelter and free school meals (despite my being a basterd); what I hold society responsible for, is the gradual dimunition of that society to the point that even a hard working nurse, employed by society, is neither guaranteed shelter or a meal and is expected to pay for their education. Besides, why shouldn't I be satisfied with my lot? Wishing for more is like playing the lottery, a voluntary tax on the overly optimistic. 😉

Well, I'm white and grew up with only one black kid in my year at school (and I was poorer than him, I had free school dinner's (one of five, in a school of over a thousand)). That's not an excuse, it's the reason I felt sorry/empathised for him when the teacher called him a black basterd, almost daily (edit to clarify, I was from a one parent family, a white basterd, as it was, back then). Besides, way to miss the point of a point well missed.

What we really need is a cultural revolution/ary. Besides, are you saying you wouldn't vote for that?

Way to miss the point: Firstly, have you been a victim of the system, in the context of this thread? Secondly your solution is to keep the status quo, that's been designed by the elite, to make THE MINIMUM amount of contribution to society, across the board. The very fact that you consider that to be a solution to the problem, means you have never felt a jack boot/knee on your throat. My solution is to think very hard about that and say a little mantra "there but for the grace of <insert belief> goes I" and then think about how high investment in society across the board even helps you (the elite), so you're being kind to yourself, even if you have no intention of being kind to them; and when you've done all that thinking, stop making excuses and vote for the guy/gall that promises to make it happen. You're welcome to test that all ways up... See above, final paragraph.

Have you tested yours?

What, exactly, are you proposing to test?

You mean the laws, designed by the wealthy to keep the poor from their bear tokens? In this context, the 1st Amendment needs amending. I'll try, but you'll have to be more specific about which part of which post you don't understand.

This is what's tripping some people up, retribution, in this context, does not equal revenge, it's more like the library cartoon I posted, "if you can't reach it, I'll get it for you". The problem is also muddied with the introduction of money into the conversation, people assume that means we have to pay for something that's not my fault, exchange my hard earned bear token's for someting I can't see... No chance... And I asked you to read it all again, because it's all there, I'm not going to do the work for you; do it yourself, it's the only way you'll learn anything. 😉

I've tried in several different ways, I've written a synopsis on the topic, a cartoon the sums up a solution to the topic and several posts explaining why you're wrong; it's like you haven't read any of my posts since you joined the conversation and I asked you to please read the thread, before you try to reduce a complicated nuanced question, into a one or two sentence answer (Please, read it all again). And here you are, asking me to do what you clearly couldn't and reduce a complex issue to a single, easy to understand, summary; I've tried, but you don't understand and thats not my responsibility (I can't understand it for you); it's like I'm pointing to the moon and you're saying "is that a wart on your finger". 🙄

OK, So, what's tripping you up ? Who the victim is? And for what reason? Bearing in mind, what an excuse is...