Raider5678

New Tax Bill Benefits

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12 minutes ago, Huckleberry of Yore said:

Since it is opinion it is to be rejected out of hand?

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Moderator Note

You were asked for facts, so yes.

 
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Per the moderator's request, I added information backing my position.  But the same moderator has chided me for not staying on topic, so feel free to start another topic.

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Moderator Note

You were asked for facts

 
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On topic: according to CNBC this morning, 74% of companies reporting profits recently are beating estimates.  That is regarded as positive economic news.  As I write, I see Apple reported earnings, and the stock is up 4% in after hours.  

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Moderator Note

Really? After Apple warned and the stock dropped, this is a positive?

We expect arguments in good faith. This ain’t it

 

 

1 hour ago, Huckleberry of Yore said:

My pleasure, glad to oblige. 

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Moderator Note

And yet you didn’t. The topic is federal tax, and you gave (dubious) state info.

 
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I was just afraid you might chide me for going off topic again.

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Moderator Note

There’s that, too.

 

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On 1/23/2019 at 7:30 AM, Ten oz said:

@Raider5678

After starting down in the first quarter GDP was up around 2014 levels in the 2nd and 3rd quarters. Here are the final numbers for the first 3 quarters from Dept. of Commerce . Estimates for the 4th quarter are low, Link. Trump promised 6% GDP  when Congress was writing up his for his plan. GDP for the year was only 3%. 

So a year later and deficits are up, the stock market is down, and GDP is flat. Do you feel the tax cut was worthwhile? 

:rolleyes:

15 minutes ago, Huckleberry of Yore said:

Perhaps I am the only one that the "facts only" rule applies?  So noted.

Agreed.

You are qouting me in the absence of the rest of what I said regarding GDP.

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Tax returns are lower on average this year which is catching a lot of people by surprise. The tax cut meant less money was taken throughout the year which means there is less money to be returned. Unfortunately it seems the increases in net pay were small enough or undercut by other types of increases like healthcare to go unnoticed by many. The annual return drop is large enough to be noticed. Millions of people rely on their tax returns each year to pay off credit cards, fund education, and etc. It will be interesting to see what impact smaller returns have on first and second quarter GDP. Link

 

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It’s not just that the withholding dropped, apparently it dropped more than the taxes did, so some of any increase in paychecks were illusory. If they dropped equally, refunds would not have changed. 

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7 minutes ago, swansont said:

It’s not just that the withholding dropped, apparently it dropped more than the taxes did, so some of any increase in paychecks were illusory. If they dropped equally, refunds would not have changed. 

True, the changes impact different people differently. Do you think the reduction in returns will negatively impact spending during the first and second quarter? 

 

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On 1/30/2018 at 2:21 PM, Raider5678 said:

This tax bill was said to be the apocalypse by some.

I'm not sure how much longer we can survive this apocalypse.....

 

The fundamentals of tax are, Its a universal basic income  pension i.e. the more you pay the more you benefit... ;)

It’s true no matter where you are on the ladder

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7 hours ago, Ten oz said:

True, the changes impact different people differently. Do you think the reduction in returns will negatively impact spending during the first and second quarter? 

It’s been a while since income dictated spending. I think it will be used as an excuse to try and cut programs the GOP doesn’t like.

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1 minute ago, swansont said:

It’s been a while since income dictated spending. I think it will be used as an excuse to try and cut programs the GOP doesn’t like.

I think refunds are a bit different that regular income though. I think a lot of people plan on having a return and use it to pay big ticket items all at once like credit cards, vacations, or etc. It isn't smart but lots of people do it. I suspect there will be less new home appliances, cars, and etc bought to kick the year off than average. I do agree that the GOP will spin it as a justification to cut programs they don't like. 

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12 minutes ago, Ten oz said:

I think refunds are a bit different that regular income though. I think a lot of people plan on having a return and use it to pay big ticket items all at once like credit cards, vacations, or etc. It isn't smart but lots of people do it. I suspect there will be less new home appliances, cars, and etc bought to kick the year off than average. I do agree that the GOP will spin it as a justification to cut programs they don't like. 

I thought you meant government spending. Sorry.

Yes, I think it will decrease consumer spending.

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