DrP

Actually, I would accept the argument that he can't do it blind and needs to see it... as long as he is clear about when he is using TK and when not. No little wobbles and then quickly saying "I'll move it now" as it rolls off for a turn. That can be worked around whilst still applying decent controls. QUOTE RR:"statistical analysis will tell us the likelihood of being just a chance effect" I would say it is a given that it is a chance effect until proven beyond doubt that it is TK. Even a successful experiment which appears to demonstrate TK will need to be rescrutanised and assumptions must be made that we made an error and we are to look for it.... unless you want to put your head in the sand and not understand what is going on.

lol - is that intellectual snobbery?...... "you know?" is a question... a punctuation in speech that is asking the listener to confirm that they are following the conversation. I don't think it is spaticated. Ya know? "I mean", is there to emphasise that the person is about to say something that they have an opinion on. It is easy to say that people that use language like this are lazy or stupid (or spastic)... but it depends on their social upbringing, just because someone sounds common, has an accent and uses language 'wrongly' doesn't make them stupid or lazy or bad... it is how they have been taught to speak or what they have picked up from what others around them have shown them. We learn by experience.

Further thoughts regarding control: Micro airflow could be restricted by using silicon grease around the seal of the bowl? Like when sealing a desicator.... from using vacuum lines and other gas lines I can say that even this isn't going to keep every molecule out, but should step up the control further and eliminate further air flows.

Just because he writes "These movements are not consistent with air currents or the system finding a new equilibrium" across the screen in big letters..... doesn't make it true.

I'm not sure that works either - the wheel might be a larger mass, but, the way it is balanced is pretty unstable. It might take less air movement to get it rocking slightly than it would to move a polystyrene chip.or a feather. Once moved just slightly it could set it off on a small fraction of a turn or something under its own weight then. Does that make sense? Could it be more sensitive than the lighter, lower density pieces to air currents due to its precarious balancing act? You see, even if you put it under a bowl, left the room, filmed it stationary for 45 mins, tiptoed back in with the film still running, stood there for a few mins to show that tip toeing up to the bowl didn't set it off, indicated precicely when you were going to start trying to move it, then moved it, I would be be skeptical...... but I would admit that it was impressive and look at it closer.

Maybe try your local university? Some uni's run analytical services and will assay your cells for you. Contact their biology dept. and speak to someone there - maybe look at their web page first for names or e-mail addresses - send them a mail out lining what you want to do and they might put you in touch with the right people there.

QUOTE, RR: "suggested using 2 wheels"... But we KNOW the wheels are BS! It is covered in many debunk vids on the net... DO IT WITH A GRAIN OF DUST OR A FEATHER OR SOMETHING THAT ISN'T AS UNSTABLE AS THE PATHETIC, DUMB ASS WHEEL.... sorry for the shouting, but I seem to be ignored. Anything done with the dumb wheel is bull crap, any results attained from it cannot be trusted. Do it properly or not at all. FORGET THE WHEEL. For the last time: - Do it with something stable (not the fdumb wheel). Do it with a bowl covering. Don't cheat or read false positives from the background noise. QUOTE: RR: " seems impossible that one would move and not the other... can you imagine that situation?" Yes - easily.... because they are so unstable and rest in "metastable" resting/equilibrium points that are not reproducible from wheel to wheel. I would say it is quite probable that this would happen - you see one move while the other is stationary or maybe both or maybe none... thus you need to remove the possibility for this error and ditch the wheel entirely - it is too precarious. If it is a genuine phenomenon then the wheel is irrelevant - it would work with ANY mass .... it is NOT a genuine phenomenon though is it? It ONLY works with the wheel because the wheel is too unstable and moves by itself, or through vibration or static or air currents or some other unknown which is different from wheel to wheel.

QUOTE: EE "I looked at it from afar and it is completely still, always" Well that's that then, it must be TK.... solid proof at last!... ....If you can be sure you aren't breathing on it by using the bowl as we suggested, you are using a feather or a seed or something very light to make it easy.... (as we discussed, if you use the BS psiwheel then it's just too unstable and no-one will take you seriously). You have ruled out vibrations by allowing the thing to come to equilibrium... (don't let it settle and walk fast towards it - that will make it spin, even with the bowl the vibrations could set it off... unless you are using the speck instead of the dumb wheel, but I assume you dropped the wheel now or no-one in their right mind will take you seriously)

QUOTE: "certain that...the last 50 years would have gone... no drugs, no misunderstandings, no corruption.." etc. I don't think anyone has said that at all. QUOTE:"will China, Iran, England, France fight for our forests and our energy reserves..?" Whot?

That girl is just part of your personality. I often think in my own voice and then answer (in my thoughts) based on what my brain asumes others will say based on their personality and my experience with them - I have my friends and families voices in my head as voices of reason. I know they are my own mind. Basically I think in ,my voice and in the voices of people I know - it definitely is not telepathy. When I got divorced it took me about 3 months at least to get my ex wife's voice out of my head. It was a hard, emotional process and I went through a period that can only be described as craziness. I hope people don't think I am crazy for sharing this.. I don't think I am crazy (well the doc said I wasn't anyway ;-) ) Just seemed relavent to the discussion.

It does work, no? We have sorta broke even and we are improving all the time. The Russians are confident and ITER is under construction... Fusion 'works' - we need to better learn to control it, which is what we are working towards. Do you think we will fail in this endeavour?

And they will run out in the end and alternatives will be sought. This fracking may buy us more time to fix fusion power and improve solar.

QUOTE: "maybe EE is different to the others.." How is he different!? He is using the same old psiwheel BS that has been debunked by many. QUOTE: "We are not saying anyone is moving it with their minds.." What!? That is exactly what is being claimed! If not then it is not telekinesis is it!? I'm finished with it, unless he moves a feather under a bowl across a flat surface with out using static or some other cheat.... even then I would be sceptical as to his claim as so many have done this using cheats (for what reason? to get funding? a crap uni place, for shits and giggles?).

Who is Daryl? The guy with the bowl? I already said that it was clear he wasn't moving it with his mind... possibilities include micro air currents, forces from static, vibrations dislodging the thing from its precariously balanced equilibrium (which wasn't reached before he idiotically claimed TK anyway), and I have read other explanation like IR radiation (which I do not think likely - but more so than TK). The only 'convincing' vids I saw were the ones that actually admitted to being fake in further vids. Don't believe all the claptrap you see on the internet, it is full of cheats, liers and complete dolts.

QUOTE RR: "..there is a 50% chance it is real..." Come on RR - what rot.. is this trolling? You have NO basis whatsoever to arrive at that figure. 50%? where did you pluck that figure from? Have you ever studied science at all?

Try passing the lighter under the wheel, not next to it. Careful not to set fire to it though. ;-) All the examples I've watched have been fake or just delusion.... yes it moves, but it is not you moving it.

no, look at the Derren Brown vid - the girl warms her hands and it works much better. It is well explained. Try warming up your hands in hot water before, it should give you a better result.

No bowl - it has already been well explained as to how it works. I found a video of someone using a bowl.... but then they admit they cheat in another video (they used a pin hole in the table with a draft). RRs video looks honest.... but I have explained what I think is going on in that one too, so, no not yet.

Do your thing? With the bowl? After it has had 15 mins to settle. What is this thing exactly? link me to your most convincing vid.

Can you link me to your one with the bowl then? I only saw without the bowl, which is a well explained phenomenon.

The one with the bowl. You put the foil on the stick and it spins off in one direction and wobbles... it sort of comes to a stop as the system is gaining torc for the reverse spin... it settles for a bit and then as it starts to turn back in the opposite direction (as you might expect it to do as it goes past it's equilibrium point, of which there could be many) - you then claim this as TK. After 10 mins by the heater the system comes to a complete rest and moves no more (that is when you should be trying the TK, although, as I said, the wheel is so unstable that even vibration could set it in a spin again).... so, had you done the video with out trying TK I am saying that the wheel would have moved anyway. Thus my suggestion for the feather, or something very light. It should be easier than the wheel to move due to weight and you can rule out movement from vibrations through the precariously balanced system of the wheel. Put it under the bowl, or people will accuse you of blowing it. If you can move that, without cheating and using static, then show us the vid. I am certain you will not be able to move it, not because there is something special about the wheel which is susceptical to TK powers, but because, as I think you will find and probably know deep down, that there is no suck thing as TK that has ever been demonstrated to anyone on earth by anyone ever so far in the history of all mankind. EDIT - in case my point is not clear... you have to try to move an object which will not move on it's own anyway.... which the wheels do.

Then try the feather or something REALLY light that can be blown easily, then, put it under the bowl and try to move that. It will remain stationary. The wheel thing moves about because it is unstable.. I saw some in an art display recently. The wheels were inside light bulbs so no air could get in, but they were all spinning randomly, some at different speeds and directions and some not at all.... then some start up, seeminly randomly. Would be cool if we could do TK - I think it would improve my putting average at golf.

QUOTE TAR: "keep the Soviet Union from invading West Germany with tanks" Impressive feat Tar! - well done. QUOTE:"maintain my beautiful house....etc." nothing stopping you there.. Quote: "want to extend a hand to anyone in trouble" OK - except those that can't find a job or can't afford to pay for their own health care? I understand you want your daughter to do well and finish her Ph.D. I hope she does excellently. some still struggle to feed their daughters and keep then out of the kind of trouble that the depression from being in their situation can lead too. Shame others just think "I'm alright Jack" and do not care (usually from a lack of understanding) about the plight of the lower classes, the people you want to keep from having hospital care and food, you know, the people in the ghettos. You see drug users and pushers and hores and scum where others see human beings in trouble, neglected by the system that ensures they stay where they are regardless of their intelligence or skill or aptitude.

That in itself is debatable. ;-) .. I think I know what the results will be.

Thus my suggestion of leaving it for half hour or so to let it reach it's equilibrium... Do not start the test until it has settled properly and has stopped moving on its own - the movement in his vid is clearly oscillation (with long slow wavelength) as it is coming to balance... the thing that might fool him into thinking he has moved it is that the 'wheel' seems to settle before it starts moving again... this is just torque unwinding or slight vibrations unsettling the thing from it's precariously balanced position - clearly nothing more. This is also why I suggest the feather instead of the unstable wheel. A feather will not move about 'by its self' by being knocked from its balance by vibrations.