zapatos

This thread started with the proposition of humans making contact with an advanced alien race. Unless this race originated in some other universe with different physical properties, then they have been exposed to the same properties of the universe that we have. These properties are the only ones we have to work with to develop communications, a means of travel, a means to do any of the things our technology allows us to do. All I am saying is that if we have the same raw materials to work with (EM, gravity, hydrogen, space, planets, etc.), then we may very well recognize when someone else has manipulated those raw materials for some purpose (such as using EM for communications). I recognize that we might not utilize all of the same properties of the universe, but I would think there would be some overlap. For example, if the aliens traveled here, they may very well have created some type of ship to travel in which doesn't look like an asteroid or travel the same path as an asteroid (for example, it may make a soft landing on a planet). I never said they would use EM radiation for communication, but there is a reason they could use EM radiation for communication. It works. Do you believe that an advanced alien race is unlikely to be aware of the EM that is bombarding them constantly from all directions? And I admit I don't understand how you are using the concept of ALIEN. You seem to be implying that if they are ALIEN, then everything about them MUST be different than everything about us. Why would that be? Why couldn't many of our technologies share the same underlying properties of the universe? I admit that it is possible that we would not recognize other life, but you seem to imply that it is nearly a certainty.

Earthquakes can also occur far from the edges of plates, along faults. Faults are cracks in the earth where sections of a plate (or two plates) are moving in different directions. Faults are caused by all that bumping and sliding the plates do. They are more common near the edges of the plates. http://www.geo.mtu.edu/UPSeis/where.html

From the first link (my bold)... "The magisterium of the Church does not forbid that, in conformity with the present state of human sciences and sacred theology, research and discussions, on the part of men experienced in both fields, take place with regard to the doctrine of evolution, in as far as it inquires into the origin of the human body as coming from pre-existent and living matter—for the Catholic faith obliges us to hold that souls are immediately created by God. However, this must be done in such a way that the reasons for both opinions, that is, those favorable and those unfavorable to evolution, be weighed and judged with the necessary seriousness, moderation, and measure, and provided that all are prepared to submit to the judgment of the Church, to whom Christ has given the mission of interpreting authentically sacred Scripture and of defending the dogmas of faith" (HG 36). This is one of the reasons the church loses credibility with me.

Well, as I tried to explain in an earlier post, I think we would use similar technology because both the aliens and us would have grown up in the same universe. We both are exposed to the same properties of the universe, and while we may not understand all of the universe in the same way or utilize its properties in the same way, I would be surprised if we had no overlap at all. And while I might not recognize an alien as life, if it was altering its surroundings for some purpose, I'd probably give it a closer look.

Fuzzwood: So it would stay that same small size? The gravity of the entire black hole is not necessary to keep it that small? And if it had that mass in a very small space, it could not get close enough to, say, a molecule of hydrogen to pull in that molecule? I think this answers my question. I was wondering if once matter is compressed to the density of a black hole, does that matter retain the properties of a black hole if the massive gravity is removed. That is, can the mass of 1kg stay in that compressed state without the entire gravity of a black hole to keep it that way.

What would happen if a 1kg piece of black hole was suddenly transported to the surface of the earth? Would it retain the properties of a black hole and begin devouring mass that it came close to, sinking into the surface of the earth? Would it expand to something much less dense since it did not have the gravity of the entire black hole to keep it in that dense state? If so, what type of matter would it be? Something else?

So are you saying that you believe that some portion of UFO sightings are indeed aliens? If so, I'd like to hear why you think that. (I promise I won't inflict any bruising! )

It is an impressive tree (or whatever type of organism that has developed) that launches its seed with a velocity allowing it to escape the gravitational pull of its star and move into interstellar space. It is interesting that you suggest this, yet respond to MRlogic's scenario of us being visited by intelligent aliens by saying that "Speculation is futile." Perhaps I misread your posts but it sounded to me like you flatly put down every statement he made, or assumption he wanted to start with. Actually you did. I was trying to be clever by quoting you from your first post. I thought it interesting that you told MRlogic to "abandon thoughts of all SF movies" when he hadn't even mentioned them, and then a few posts later you use SF stories in support of your position. I'll try to be more obvious next time. I thought that was what I had been doing in my posts. One of us should go back and re-read what I said in them.

Yes, I agree that there are many possible scenarios where we could look at each other and not recognize what we are seeing. However, assuming we both grew up with the same laws of physics, with the same physical types of actions going on around us (things affected by gravity, stars giving off radiation, etc.), then it seems likely to me that we would have some overlap in our understanding of the universe. There may be properties of the universe that we utilize that are not utilized by aliens (such as electromagnetic communication), and vice versa. But if we had common use of some of the properties, I would expect that we would most likely at least recognize each other as something significant. Maybe not much of an understanding of each other, but at least recognizing that this other thing is not your normal hunk of rock.

"A rather easier task would be to detect our military radars. The bigger ones typically boast a megawatt of power, and are focused into beams that are a degree or two across. There are enough such radars that, at any given time, they cover a percent of the sky or so. The signal from the most powerful of these could be found at 50 light-years distance in a few minutes time with a receiving antenna 1,000 feet in diameter. Indeed, these military radars are the only signals routinely transmitted from Earth that are intense enough to be detectable at interstellar distances with setups equivalent to our own SETI experiments. Bottom line? With radio technology slightly more advanced than our own, Homo sapiens is detectable out to a distance of roughly 50 light-years. Within that distance are about 5,000 stars, all of which have had the enviable pleasure of receiving terrestrial television. And each day, a fresh stellar system is exposed to signals from Earth." http://www.space.com/searchforlife/seti_shostak_aliens_031023.html And maybe they would be here to mine one of our moons, but if they were in our solar system, wouldn't it be hard to miss us?

But other than some form of life that just happened to be floating by, don't you think that they'd figure out we are alive? Assuming that faster than light travel is not possible and that getting here would take some significant effort, I'd think they'd need a reason to visit, such as wondering about why this solar system was putting out unusual signals (sitcoms, telephone calls, etc.). And even if they couldn't figure out what we were, they could probably figure out it was us causing the signals.

It seems more reasonable to me to assume aliens visiting earth will have intelligence and technology than not. Can you give a scenario for interstellar space travel that does not include intelligence and technology? You only assume they won't. You need to abandon thoughts of all SF movies. Why are you trying to shut down MRlogic? What is wrong with speculating about what might happen? Speculation may be futile for you, but it may be a benefit to others. If you fnd this a waste of time, please move on.

I just won't take it anymore. Since my back is no longer an issue I don't need it for anything. I don't take any illegal drugs (not since smoking pot in college anyway) and have always tried not to take any prescription drugs unless I really needed them. And now I suddenly have some drugs that I don't really need to take, but want to take because I like it, and this makes me feel conflicted. I don't feel it's any riskier than having a drink, but I guess I wonder if it is crossing some line I shouldn't cross. I imagine any illegal drug user is laughing at my conflict, but I was just curious what others thought.

Yes, I obviously should not have made it such a blanket statement. But I tend not to view my regular intake of alcohol, caffeine, sex, and prescribed drugs under a doctor's supervision as very risky. So, given the fact that I could become addicted, should I not take it? Since there is a risk of addiction, should I have have quit taking it prior to my back healing when I could withstand the pain without the medication?

I just meant is there some ethical difference between taking a drug that I can obtain at a grocery store as opposed to a pharmacy. The drug is Tramadol.

I received a prescription for a drug to help with my lower back pain. The pain has since gone away but I have a lot of the drug left. The drug makes me more alert like an amphetamine, makes me feel good, is non-addicting, and costs me next to nothing. I like it. Is there any good reason I shouldn't keep taking it for recreational purposes? Is it any different than drinking coffee or scotch?

Sun and rain simultaneously?

We already have a method to easily produce a wood supply; planting trees. Seems to me the primary advantage to developing a method to create wood in the desired forms, is that we can do away with saws. Not sure it would be worth the effort.

Hmmm... Looks like I stepped into something here. I guess I'll just be moving on to other threads. Sorry to have offended.

I'm not sure what you mean by a "fake account". Sorry if I missed it in your posts, but what is it you are trying to convey?

I'm kind of new here and maybe I just don't understand the culture, but is this a joke? Sounds like some of the things I read on April 1st.

I've posted a few times and for the most part received great answers to my questions. The only thing keeping me from posting more is that I'm too busy reading what everyone else has to say. My ignorance is made obvious to me on this forum. And I have to say that I love the level of discourse here. Such a breath of fresh air after listening to what typically masquerades itself as debate.

So if everything in the universe suddenly reversed direction, it wouldn't eventually end up in the same place? What did the universe look like in the beginning (meaning roughly 13.7 billion years ago)? Are you saying that without the expansion of space, galaxies would no longer be moving away from each other?

An old man goes into the doctor and says there is something that has been troubling him and he has a question. "When I was 20, if my thing was hard I couldn't get it to bend at all. Then when I was 40, I found that I could bend it a little bit. When I hit 50, I could move it around pretty much. And now that I'm 70, I find I can just about bend it in half." "I see", says the doctor, "and just what is your question?" The old man replies, "Just how strong am I going to get?"

If there is no cash, how will people in areas of the world with no networks/phones/electricity/etc. purchase things?