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studiot

Life expectancy in UK falls and is expected to fall further

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Wikipedia didn't find any herd immunity from vaccinating the elderly, I'm going with that opinion. 

They also say :  Herd immunity itself acts as an evolutionary pressure on certain viruses, influencing viral evolution by encouraging the production of novel strains, in this case referred to as escape mutants, that are able to "escape" from herd immunity and spread more easily.       https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Herd_immunity#Evolutionary_pressure      

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This was the first year I've ever taken the flu vaccine.
I always felt my immune system was strong enough.
But I've recently turned 60, so I figured it was time to start.

I also recently switched doctors, so I had full testing done, including stool sample.
Unfortunately I didn't read the food restrictions before taking the sample, and the test came back 'microscopic traces of blood' in my sample.
So now I've got a colonoscopy scheduled for January :o.
But like I said, I'm now 60; It's time.

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38 minutes ago, mistermack said:

Wikipedia didn't find any herd immunity from vaccinating the elderly, I'm going with that opinion. 

I think you did not understand the article or the concept of herd immunity. Obviously vaccinating just the elderly does not create herd immunity. Herd immunity is the effect of having a sufficiently large immune population, which inhibits disease spread. This allows passive protection of susceptible populations, such as elderly , even if they are not vaccinated, or when vaccines are less effective. I took a quick look at the article and it actually describes precisely that (which is actually what you quote before, but seemingly misunderstood):

Quote

Influenza (flu) is more severe in the elderly than in younger age groups, but influenza vaccines lack effectiveness in this demographic due to a waning of the immune system with age.[7][26] The prioritization of school-age children for seasonal flu immunization, which is more effective than vaccinating the elderly, however, has shown to create a certain degree of protection for the elderly.[7][26]

Thus having school-age children vaccinated creates herd immunity for the elderly. The above passages are also example of similar effects (e.g. vaccinating children against rotavirus protects older children and adults). One thing that may have thrown you off is the weird phrasing, which is often a bit of an issue with wikipedia as folks often take passages from other sources without adjusting the context properly. However, in the cited publications were discussing whether it is enough to immunize high-risk groups alone (i.e. the elderly) or whether there is a need to increase protection via the herd effect (e.g. via universal immunization). The general conclusion is that herd immunity for influenza is rather crucial and strongly suggest that all health workers should be mandated to be vaccinated for that reason.

 

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1 hour ago, MigL said:

Unfortunately I didn't read the food restrictions before taking the sample, and the test came back 'microscopic traces of blood' in my sample.
So now I've got a colonoscopy scheduled for January :o.
But like I said, I'm now 60; It's time.

I do a stool sample every year. It's free in the UK after a certain age. There's nothing in the instructions on our kits about food restrictions, it must be a different process. It does say that finding blood can be from a range of different causes, so it's not the time to panic, but obviously it wouldn't be wise to skip the colonoscopy. 

My next door neighbour actually got colon cancer a few years ago, he's only about fifty. He was successfully treated and has had no subsequent problems at all. But anyway, hope your results are good. 

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Thanks for the words of encouragement, Mistermack.
The colonoscopy itself doesn't worry me; it's the preparation with the two bottles of Magnesium Citrate, the gallon of water, and sitting on the toilet all night.

Damn this old age !

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8 minutes ago, MigL said:

Thanks for the words of encouragement, Mistermack.
The colonoscopy itself doesn't worry me; it's the preparation with the two bottles of Magnesium Citrate, the gallon of water, and sitting on the toilet all night.

Damn this old age !

Yeah! it's quite the experience. And no eating. After a guided trip up my alimentary canal and back the Endoscopist pointed out an adenoma which he said might go malignant in 10-20 years, so he cauterized it off.

The thing is with this life expectancy stuff statistically, is it just that medicine is keeping more people alive longer but basically we aren't intrinsically healthier as a population?

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17 hours ago, CharonY said:

To make things more complicated there are also trivalent and quadrivalent versions, protecting against three and four strains, respectively. I think the NHS offers mostly quadrivalent vaccines at this point. 

'Valent', yes that was the term I couldn't think of,  thank you for reminding me.
Staff in the NHS are offered the quadrivalent version, patients the trivalent one.

Here is another BBC article about one method of creating flu vaccines you mentioned.

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/av/health-50650495/how-do-eggs-protect-us-from-flu

  

13 hours ago, CharonY said:

I think you did not understand the article or the concept of herd immunity.

 

 

Here is a BBC simple article about herd immunity.

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/av/health-48682113/immunisation-why-we-do-it-and-how-herd-immunity-works

Edited by studiot

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