Tesseract Posted May 31, 2004 Share Posted May 31, 2004 Can someone please move this if its in the wrong forum. Question:Could Archimedes really have used mirrors to set the roman ships on fire in Syracuse, 214 b,c ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cap'n Refsmmat Posted May 31, 2004 Share Posted May 31, 2004 If he had good mirrors, and focused them, it would be as easy as frying an ant with a magnifying glass. Except more satisfying! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Crash Posted May 31, 2004 Share Posted May 31, 2004 I believe it very well could have been done like that, the only problem was getting the large amount of glass.......... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Glider Posted May 31, 2004 Share Posted May 31, 2004 I doubt it. He would have had to use either parabolic mirrors with adjustable focal lengths, or many, many individual mirrors all focussed on the same point (acting like a parabolic mirror). Finding enough glass would have been the least of his worries. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
admiral_ju00 Posted May 31, 2004 Share Posted May 31, 2004 I doubt it. He would have had to use either parabolic mirrors with adjustable focal lengths, or many, many individual mirrors all focussed on the same point (acting like a parabolic mirror). Finding enough glass would have been the least of his worries. what is that thing called that looks like a satellite receiver/dish but is made up of many mirror pieces? could he have used one of those? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Crash Posted May 31, 2004 Share Posted May 31, 2004 Yea thats what i was thinking, it wouldnt of been to hard, mainly that amount of mirrors....depending on how expensive they were Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fafalone Posted May 31, 2004 Share Posted May 31, 2004 Wouldn't you need a lens rather than just mirrors to do that... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
admiral_ju00 Posted May 31, 2004 Share Posted May 31, 2004 Wouldn't you need a lens rather than just mirrors to do that... you're right, and nowadays this would be perfectly doable. take that dish thingie to collect sun light and then place a lens towards teh center but at a distance from the dish so that all the light is focused as a fine line of light........ but to do so back then, that is the question......... by the way, i'm still hoping that someone will enlighten me on what that dish thing is called. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
swansont Posted May 31, 2004 Share Posted May 31, 2004 I believe it very well could have been done like that, the only problem was getting the large amount of glass.......... Why glass? Polished gold or silver make pretty good mirrors. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
swansont Posted May 31, 2004 Share Posted May 31, 2004 Wouldn't you need a lens rather than just mirrors to do that... No. A bunch of mirrors made to approximate a spherical or parabolic mirror acts as a lens. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cap'n Refsmmat Posted May 31, 2004 Share Posted May 31, 2004 I believe it very well could have been done like that, the only problem was getting the large amount of glass.......... Glass mirrors are just panes of glass with aluminum or silver behind them, just using silver itself would work. I don't see why you need a lens, I know that people use mirrors to cook things. In fact, I think YT set up a competition for it, and all you need is a mirror (or a group of mirrors). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dave Posted May 31, 2004 Share Posted May 31, 2004 No. A bunch of mirrors made to approximate a spherical or parabolic mirror acts as a lens. I would assume this was probably the greatest problem. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cap'n Refsmmat Posted May 31, 2004 Share Posted May 31, 2004 http://www.scienceforums.net/forums/showthread.php?t=3907 YT2095's challenge to make a solar cooker, probably with a mirror. No lenses included. How is it the biggest problem? With some guesswork and mathematics, you could take mirrors based a good distance apart and focus them to burn a ship. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dave Posted May 31, 2004 Share Posted May 31, 2004 You're going to need a lot of mirrors if the ship is a fair distance away, and Archimedes didn't have the modern day trigonometry like we do today. I highly doubt he did it myself. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
YT2095 Posted May 31, 2004 Share Posted May 31, 2004 it would have been hard to say the very least to have set fire to the Hull of the ship, but canvas sails? easy peezy I`ve done it to news paper 40+ foot away using aluminised mylar sheeting in a crochet hoop 2 foot diameter with a peice of string at the back in the middle of the sheet to adjust the focal length, it`s really THAT EASY! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cap'n Refsmmat Posted May 31, 2004 Share Posted May 31, 2004 And, I assume, you didn't need advanced trigonometry. That shows that a good group of maybe 10 large mirrors, if he set a point to adjust them to and had them synchronised perfectly (hard enough) it would be easy. Getting them all focused without controlling all at once would be hard, so they would have to be highly trained to do so. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dave Posted May 31, 2004 Share Posted May 31, 2004 I still have my doubts Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
swansont Posted May 31, 2004 Share Posted May 31, 2004 I still have my doubts I don't, about the logistics. Each team points their mirrors toward one target, as identified by the commander. You can see the reflections, and correlate them with your own mirror - if you aren't aiming correctly, you move the mirror. No trig involved. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dave Posted May 31, 2004 Share Posted May 31, 2004 You're all probably right, it's just I'm very cynical and don't believe a lot of what people say they did in history; mainly because they tend to brag a lot. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tesseract Posted May 31, 2004 Author Share Posted May 31, 2004 You're all probably right, it's just I'm very cynical and don't believe a lot of what people say they did in history; mainly because they tend to brag a lot. Well Syracuse must have been saved somehow. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dave Posted May 31, 2004 Share Posted May 31, 2004 True; but there's other ways of destroying ships without pointing lots of mirrors at them. For all we know, he could have used a group of specially trained woodpeckers to peck holes in the side of the boats and sink them that way Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tesseract Posted May 31, 2004 Author Share Posted May 31, 2004 True; but there's other ways of destroying ships without pointing lots of mirrors at them. For all we know' date=' he could have used a group of specially trained woodpeckers to peck holes in the side of the boats and sink them that way [/quote'] I dont know why he used mirrors if he could just shoot flaming arrows at the ships... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Glider Posted May 31, 2004 Share Posted May 31, 2004 what is that thing called that looks like a satellite receiver/dish but is made up of many mirror pieces? That would be a parabolic mirror. It's used to collect sunlight from a relatively large area and focus it on a very small area, heating, cooking or burning whatever is at that point. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tesseract Posted May 31, 2004 Author Share Posted May 31, 2004 That would be a parabolic mirror. It's used to collect sunlight from a relatively large area and focus it on a very small area, heating, cooking or burning whatever is at that point. Strong enough to burn ships I suppose? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dave Posted May 31, 2004 Share Posted May 31, 2004 I suppose a big enough one would be, yes. It would have to have a focal point quite some distance away though. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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