Bettina

Descent III .....online multiplayer. I'm a lieutenant.

Well you sound like your getting close to understanding. Well you're certainly right I could be lying and so could anyone else. Trust is something that has to be built and certainly no one here other then Denver01 knows me well enough to say what degree I maybe lying or not. However acceptance of pedophiles as a group does not mean blind trust of individuals. We decide' date=' every time we meet someone or every time events give the opportunity for a relationship to move to a new level, how much we trust someone, the same would be true for pedophiles.

 

Sounds to me like you have already accepted me in your own way.[/quote']

 

My dad and I like to watch science fiction and one particular star trek episode had Mr. Spock telling a story to Captain Kirk about being careful where he placed his trust. I don't remember it exactly, but I will come close.

 

There was a donkey and a scorpion standing at the edge of a fast moving river that they both wanted to cross. The donkey could cross easily, but he was blind and was afraid he would lose his bearings and drown. The Scorpion too, wanted to cross, but was too small and would drown too.

 

So, the scorpion told the donkey that if he could ride on his back, he could guide him and they would both be able to get to the other side. The donkey said, "No...you will sting me and I would drown", but the scorpion replied back, "If I sting you then I will drown too" The donkey agreed and with the scorpion on his back, they both began crossing.

 

Halfway across the river, the scorpion stung the donkey and as the paralyzed donkey and the scorpion began to drown, the surprised donkey asked "Why did you do that, now we will both drown"....to which the scorpion replied. "I know and I'm sorry....but its what I do".....

 

I may understand you now, but I cannot accept you.

 

Bettina

No worries.

 

 

 

Certainly not. Is that what you think I said in my post? If so' date=' please reread it.

 

 

 

How do you judge any person? Get to know the person and ascertain his/her individual character. Same applies to a pedophile.

 

 

 

I'm glad that you acknowledge that.

 

 

 

I interpret "the last one" to mean the type that acts out of malice and/or lacks sound judgement, or something along those lines. If that is the case then I agree; a careless or bad-intentioned pedophile or other person may harm a child.

 

 

 

Don't you think understanding is a logical step in solving a problem?

 

Do you still disagree with the reasoning set forth in my first post? If so, I'd still like to know what line of reasoning leads you to disagree. Do you think the stigma placed on pedophiles benefits humanity?

 

Let me try to clarify a bit. I think it would be beneficial to society as a whole if pedophiles were not so strongly stigmatized. Again, this does not mean a change in AoC laws, or that harming children be accepted. Nor does it mean that all pedophiles should be viewed as harmless, outstanding citizens. I think, though, that society should make an effort to better understand pedophiles and remove the generally unconditional hatred surrounding them. This would reduce the isolation they feel and lessen the psychological stress and damage they experience. The number of psychologically unbalanced people attracted to children would go down, and thus the number of sexual attacks against children would decrease.

 

I still welcome arguments from anyone who disagrees.

 

 

 

When you first meet someone do you discard the person as ilk since you don't know whether or not he/she is a good person?[/quote']

 

You admitted you are a pedophile. What would your definition of a pedophile be as it pertains to you. Just curious.

 

Bettina

I think you're forgetting the new and arbitrary nature of the definition of adolescent, which is where we've stuck the sexually capable (biologically speaking) group of "children" who in every lower income area are adults and commonly marry. Not to mention the rather unscientific and inflamatory support of stigmatizing. It risks portraying you as insecure of your distance from a catagory when you admit to the prevelance of something near it, even defend that prevelance, but attack it all the same with an arguement that smacks of nothing but cheep sensationalism. Now I'm not defending criminals of this sort. I think there's a serious issue if those activities seem appropriate. But what I am saying is that "A more fitting label would be monsters" has absolutely no place on a forum pretending to be scientific.

First, could you please use the "quote" so I could know who you were replying to when you use the word "you"?

Second, since I have used the word "MONSTER" in this forum, to describe a person who is cruel, wicked, heinous and an inhuman child molester, I take some responsibility for entering that word into discussion even though its an acceptable word to use to describe this type of person. You can look that up in any dictionary.

Thirdly, this forum is not "pretending" to be all scientific. When I first came here it was for my interest in Cosmology, but I soon found out that most of the posters here are shooting way over my head with talk of string theory and the like. So, I tend to read more than post there....for now. So....I like the fact that I can go to other areas not so "scientific" and still remain in the same forum and join in discussion.

No offense, and you are undoubtedly intellegent, but I'm only a teenager, and you seem too strict and conforming a person that I would find difficulty in learning anything from, and I would like to.

Bettina

There is no real way to judge who is a good or bad pedophile. Personal instinct may be helpful but it can be easily fooled as well. However I'd say does it really make a difference. Can you judge who is a good or bad pedophile today when you don't even know who may or may not be a pedophile? I should think it twice as hard on parents when they have no clue if the person coming into contact with their child is or is not a pedophile in addition to might he be a good or bad pedophile.

Thus the problem of being accepted. Since I can't tell whether you are a practicing pedophile (you could be lying) or a controlled one, I must place you in the same basket as the other types I've mentioned.

The simple fact remains. A pedophile is a person who is sexually attracted to little kids and you have told us you are a pedophile.

I have feelings of sadness for you now, because you are going thru life not being able to fulfill your sexual desires. To say that you won't in the future is unknown and for that reason, I would wish you were never alone with kids.

I'm sorry, but this is how I feel about you.

Bettina

Thanks for the welcome and for replying to my post.

Okay. Can you please give me a synopsis of how you interpreted my previous post? Also' date=' what thought process led you to discard my words?

Yes.

Certainly. And if the hatred was removed, there would likely be more and more "non-practicing" pedophiles.[/quote']

 

Fair enough. I agree that I was harsh in my opinion to your post and I'm sorry.

 

However, good luck in trying to get parents of small children to endorse the idea that pedophiles should be treated as normal. Are you suggesting all peophiles should be recognized as harmless? How do you judge which ones should be called the "good wolves" in sheeptown.

 

Pedohiles by nature, want to have sex with children. Some know what they are, control it, and would never hurt a child. Another is satisfied in just viewing picures of kids in underwear and will "satisfy" himself in the comfort of his home or gawk at us in the mall. He won't hurt us either. Its the last one that worries me.

 

The first two, I do not believe would come to a bb and tell the world what they are, try to make it sound acceptable as a human right, and mention that aoc laws are unacceptable.

 

The last one, again, my own opinion, would be the type so tempted, that if babysitting a child and the child sat with him he would start getting "touchy" with him. He may not physically hurt the child, but his cheap feels may give that boy a complex that will remain with him for the rest of his life.....all for the pedophiles pleasure.

 

Someone stated that you have come here seeking help, and that I too, have done the same. Yes, I admit it. But the difference is that my "curse" only hurts me. no one else.

 

There is a transparent wall between a pedophile and a child murderer. They are all of the same ilk, just some are not so dark. So, there is your answer. Tell me and the mothers and fathers of little kids how we should categorize the different types of pedophiles so we can have some sit with our kids alone in playgrounds, and protect the kids from the ones that follow us home.

 

Just so we understand each other. Some may begin to understand you, but I will not compromise. I put all of you in the same basket and put it as far away from kids as possible.

 

Bettina

*sigh*

Thanks for posting everyone.

 

I had a meeting (turned out it's only 2 teachers) today but it didn't turn out well as they are not taking me seriously (they go on and on about how I think I'm better than the teacers etc.) They also didn't give me info in school inspectors...

 

Could you guys help me (**if you already know) get a site for school inspectors (or someone qualified to inspect)?

Lets see....You had a meeting with two teachers and during the meeting you wanted to know how to contact teacher inspectors. Hmmmm.....

I have never had a problem with any of my teachers...ever. But one trick that a student used, was to find two teachers that are talking to each other or some other students, go up to them and humble yourself. Look at one of the teachers and say "I'm sorry for being such a jerk". Doing it in front of others gives you more credability.

Then, when you are in a class, keep quiet and listen. If you want to challenge a teacher, ask permission first, then ask it in the form of a question.

If you really are upset by something she said, see her after class.....alone.....NEVER do it in front of the class.....thats a no no.

Hope it helps.

Bettina

I live in Canada and I am in highschool.

 

 

My problem is that my math teacher is biased. I include every single details in a math fair journal yet I get 7/10. My friend was exactly the same and got 9 except it had...

 

"I learnd that in math proposals' date=' the choice in project is more important than the people who you work with."

 

This isn't the first time; she does this all the time.

 

I got frustrated after she simply told me to go back to my sit. And when she wrote, "simplify" on the board, I said, "the word is expand," she kicked me out of the class.

 

I am having a meeting with all the biased teachers who scratch each others back. This is an impossible meeting for me to accomplish anything due to their stubborness. Any comments or suggestions? How would I take a problem that I have with my highschool teacher to maybe the government or some sort?[/quote']

 

Why did you say "the word is expand" when she wrote "simplify". Please explain just that one item.

Bettina

Who dictates what the current fashion is?

 

Is it mass producers ie Walmart' date=' Target...

 

Or is it hip expensive designers ie gucci, A&F...

 

or is there someone else controlling our fashion?[/quote']

 

I'm not sure, but I believe the source is mostly the "hip expensive designers", but when I see it on a manequin at the mall, I gotta have it.

 

Bettina

whats wrong with adding violence to the analogy? are you saying hitting a child is worse than sexually molesting them?

 

so you dont think a person who is attracted to children is more predisposed to being attracted to their own child than a person who isnt attracted to children at all?

 

yeah' date=' something changes in people when they have children, but not normally their sexual orientation.

 

why would you risk that? what if he was attracted to them, what with them being the beautiful god sent little angles pedophiles describe them as, and slipped up just once?[/quote']

 

Because physical violence, whether it was toward children or adults, was not part of the thread which I still wish was closed.

 

Were talking about a middle aged Pedophile who wants children to adore and love him for the sole purpose of having a loving and sexual relationship with the boy. He needs to feed him a good line coupled with toys maybe, so he can have continuous sex with them. He can't do that with violence. He harms the child mentally, not physically.

 

Bettina

This is quite a long thread' date=' and I see some constructive discussion has taken place.

 

But some of the discussion appears to be unobjective, unproductive, and/or spurred by personal offense. This is an important issue, and discussing it in a sensible manner has great potential for good. So please, take a few deep breaths and some time to think before replying.

 

Now, I think we can all agree that pedophiles tend to be isolated/stigmatized, emotionally, socially, etc. Hatred for pedophiles seems to be almost universal. (I think a discussion on the reasons for this would be interesting, but this is probably not the proper time for that.) Also, can we not agree that this isolation, especially when experienced for long time periods as in the pedophile's case, is almost certainly psychologically damaging? Would this ostracization and resulting psychological damage not encourage the pedophile to deviate more and more from society and become embittered toward it? I think the previous two questions can logically be answered in the affirmative.* I think many peophiles are estranged from society and thus more likely to act out in reckless, hurtful ways. Before anyone misinterprets this, let me clarify that I am arguing in this paragraph that the stigmatization of pedophiles has ill effects and am in no way excusing the actions of those who harm children.

 

Okay, now let's envision a society in which pedophilia** was a normal, accepted inclination. Let's imagine that pedophiles were not stigmatized and that they could be totally open about who/what they were. I am not talking about a change in AoC laws or anything like that here, merely a change in society's attitude. This environment would be much more amicable to pedophiles and thus far less encouraging of harmful deviance. Because of this, I think that children would be much safer.

 

So, I contend that the de-stigmatization of pedophiles would be beneficial and that such an atmosphere would be better than the current state of things. I realize my argument is very much philosophical, and I am content with that as I think the reasoning can stand alone. I hope the readers will carefully consider my words, and I look forward to objective replies.

 

(I realize this isn't entirely new ground for this thread. It's just something I'd like to see receive some focused discussion.)

 

*This seems intuitive to me, but if anyone disagrees, I'm willing to elaborate on my reasoning.

**When I use the word "pedophile" or one of its variants, I am referring to an attraction, not necessarily a behavior.

I carefully considered them and put them in the trash. First, welcome to the BB. Second, are you a pedohile too?...just asking nice.

Bettina

Are you assuming that a pedophile who has a child would be attracted to that child? Does pedophilia presuppose incest? I can see where a pedophile might be more inclined to be more forthcoming about sexual matters' date=' even with his own child, but surely even a pedophile must realise how incest would harm his own flesh and blood?

I don't know the legalities involved. I'm sure blike would know best. Did ezekiel23 confess to an actual crime in his posts? Because while we may be repelled by his beliefs and desires, as long as he has not acted illegally he need not fear the police.[/quote']

 

I was just wondering what would happen if the police wanted IP's...and I know someone admitted to having child porn....anyway..I was just curious.

 

Also, the word incest could just be another word to a pedophile, at least to me. I've heard of incest with non pedophiles, so I cannot imagine what a pedo would do. On the other hand, who knows, maybe seeing there own flesh and blood might actually help them. I just don't know.

 

Bettina

wow... thats gonna be a healthy relationship.

 

your partner shouldnt be second to anyone or anything except maybe your own children.

 

if thats your approach im thinking adoption would be a better option' date=' but, of course, im extremely hesitant to suggest adoption to a pedophile. i would actually be severely disappointed if any agency would give a pedophile a child.

 

i feel like a jackass saying you shouldnt have a child, but thats what i honestly feel, so here goes:

 

you shouldnt have a child.[/quote']

 

I agree, and I won't comment on what I think of pedophiles having children less I get in trouble.

 

Bettina

What I'm asking for is simply acceptance in the way that people don't look at pedophiles as monsters or something similar... you know, it should just be possible to publicly talk about it, tell people about the way you feel without automatically being looked down upon by others. A bit like homosexuality has gained some social acceptance during the last decades. Only the orientation. Imagine if someone would mention that he's a pedophile. Most people would shun him thereafter, think of him as sick, disgusting, evil - some might even get violent. People shouldn't automatically associate every pedophile with a child molester, that's all.

Homosexuals are not a problem, at least not to me. To me, they are still moral. I know not by church standards, but who says the church is right. They have a right to be happy with each other no matter who they are with.

Do not try to compare homosexuals with pedophiles. Homosexuals don't try to bed little kids. If they did, they would be pedophiles....homosexual or straight.

I'm glad I live in a country that looks upon the pedophile for what they really are. A sick individual who is immoral, not only to the church, but to Mothers, Fathers, and the rest of civilization too.

If I were a pedophile, I would get help for my sickness and would hide it from everyone no matter how hard it would be. I would live out my entire life without hurting one single kid, and no one would have been the wiser.

Bettina

I actually didn't get a chance to read all your posts before you erased them. I wasn't sitting at my comp the whole time. I rely on the forum to pick up the thread where i last left off. And with so many members' date=' threads and posts, I don't always get a chance to read them all until sometime later.As a poster and a member, I view it the way someone seeking knowledge views burning books. You have taken away my chance for learning. Despite the nature of this thread and the fact that many of us have children in the range you're describing, all here were willing to listen.

 

As a Moderator, you have violated this thread and made many replies look silly for future viewers. Of what were you afraid? Surely you must realize by now that, despite what some people were mentioning earlier, your IP address would never be shared. Word quickly spreads when internet forums depart from their integrity.[/quote']

 

Would you give out the IP if the police requested them? If no......then would you in a warrant. I'll be willing to bet thats what he is afraid of...the police.

 

Bettina

for charles law you can put alittle water in a soda can, bring it to a slight boil, then with tongs quickly upturn it and put it facing down in a bucket of water. The gassses inside will rapidy cool and cause the can to crush instantly as soon as it hits the water. Very dramatic demo.

That sounds cool...I'm going to try this tommorrow in school......

Bettina

This is the same kind of argument that could be used against homosexuality or people who like to participate in S/M sexual play or whatever fetish. There are many sexual variants - but does this actually say something about the people? I think in today's society nobody should be judged based on his sexual orientation.

There not.......What's being judged is the mindset of some pedophile ADULTS who have come here to tell us that ADULTS having sex with little kids is ok if the little kid doesn't mind for various reasons.....thats all.

An example of mindset is in another post of yours......the bold print bothers me the most.

Regarding adults and children, well, I think sexual abuse should be illegal. This includes rape, abuse where the child is passive and just lets the adult do because of fear and also cases where the child has been coerced into it. Still I think that there are some rare cases where such sexual relationships can be positive for both sides and I think a poster even told about such a situation somewhere on this thread. Because of this I think that there should at least be a law which would allow excptions if it is really clear to the judge that the relationship was really consenting and not damaging to the child. All other sexual relationships should still remain illegal of course.

Bettina

YES!...I do.

CS....

I've been following this post right along and even though you are in some unknown nebula....your ok..

I just wanted to say that.

Bettina

I'll tell you. Ignoring physical interaction' date=' here's a little selection of questions. Have you ever felt physically upset and frustrated that you can't be with a particular child, even for a single day? Does being with one particular child make you happy unlike any other person in the world? Does seeing that child being happy bother you even more than your own personal welfare?

 

If you answer yes to all of those...I guess our love isn't so different after all [/quote']

 

 

I believe you would love a child like a normal person would...but the scary part is that you also have a sex drive that could take it to a deeper place that a normal person would see as unthinkable.

 

Bettina

[Originally Posted by Bettina]

Quote:

In post 204 above, you admit your being tempted. That makes you different from me and all normal people.

Quote:

You're telling me you've never been tempted when the opportunity for sex with someone your attracted to came up... Well you certainly are different then me but I'd say if when an opportunity to have sex with someone your attracted to came up you where not tempted that maybe your the one with the problem not me.

With all due respect, I am surprised you would find this so confusing. I have never thought of nor have ever been tempted to have sex with a little boy. This makes you and I as different as night and day....In other words.....I'm a normal human being.

Don't get me wrong. I am not flaming you, I realize there is something wrong with your brain that makes you different from me, but you need help.

Bettina

Lastly I hope I don't hurt anyone either. On a simplistic level and being a bit of a semantic jerk I've already hurt many people... its inevitable... but in terms of the kind of hurt your fearful of... the kind associated with pedophilia... all I can say is when I've been in situations where I was tempted to allow my desires to get the better of me I've excused myself from the boys and got myself under control. That does not mean it will always work but I think being open and honest and talking with people about it helps me keep the proper moral balance that keeps me from crossing a line that could cause problems.

For awhile, I was beginning to think I was wrong about you, but when I read your last few posts, it made me go back and check a few things.

In post 204 above, you admit your being tempted. That makes you different from me and all normal people.

In post 207 your wishing the Aoc laws could be changed to benefit people like you. Please tell me what age your interested in.

In Post 381 you state you own pictures of naked children. I would also make a bet that they would be naked little boys, and I do mean little. Just a guess on my part....no facts.

Those posts above disturb me greatly. You have stated your desire to be understood and accepted as a "non hurting anyone" kind of pedophile. But what you consider "non hurting" is very different than mine and other normal people. If you were truly a pedophile who is under control, you would continue a very near normal life. Nobody would know that you crave little kids. You would not be on a bulletin board posting your feelings. You would not in your last few posts tell everyone that you continue to buy and keep naked pictures of kids.

So....Why are you here. I'll tell you why in a nutshell. I don't believe you. I think your a 35 year old pedophile who is getting older and is on the edge of losing control. I think you dream of going to a country where you have a better shot at being legal with little boys. I wouldn't trust you with any child no matter what age and I would be very cautious of you if you were near me.

No offense, but you need a shrink.

Bettina

For somebody with empathic abilities i would have thought it to be easy.

No offense, but where are you coming from anyway?

My empathic ability is being directed to the CHILD and though I do feel a little empathy for the molester for being born that way, I find it repugnant that some would use this board to further their quest for acceptance.

The problem is something that our society has brought up, and decided that sex with children is wrong.

Your correct. Its called moral values which surprises me you would consider it a problem. I can however see moral values being torn down in this country every day.

........Now a days people are more openly sexually explicit than ever before, and i cant help but think of a future where peadophiles are accepted as the 'norm'

I hope the concept of this future your describing doesn't become reality, because it would stop me from having children.....really. I see my country throwing away moral values every day because not enough people care anymore. Pedophiles are coming out of the woodwork now and carrying out there dreams as you plainly see on TV, and now they come to this board to further their goal of being accepted for what they are.

If you google "pedophile", you will find somewhere it links to this site which is why we are getting so many hits.

http://www.google.com/search?sourceid=navclient&ie=UTF-8&rls=GGLD,GGLD:2004-48,GGLD:en&q=pedophile+sfn

I wish this thread was closed, but since it isnt then all I can say is if the smooth talking pedophiles on this board are Coke, then where is Pepsi.

Bettina

i must say that i have viewed this thread without replying mainly because i think i might turn this into a flame war then get banned so i think its best if i just stay out of this argument. But it is an interesting thread none the less

 

~Scott

Speak up...Yes I worry about that too, but they will warn you first I'm sure.

Bettina

Another thing that scares me is the amount of views this thread has recieved in the short time it has been here. I wonder if it is just curiosity, or are there a lot more pedophiles lurking around than I think.

Bettina