beecee

None, and that's the point. My position though is sympathy first and foremost for the vicitms of violent crime, and somehow containing the incorridgable perpetrators of those crimes from society...reform, sure, I'm all for it...compassion, sure, I'm all for it, you don't know me, but I'll tell you a secret, I'm the biggest softie, you would meet, but sometimes forgiving and forgetting just isn't a choice. I reject the death penalty, because of that small chance that an innocent victim of justice gone wrong, maybe put to an untimely end. But by the same token, [and examples given in this and the torture thread] the horrific and violent nature of some crimes, gets me angry at any so called human, that could lower him or herself to such animalistic level. Yes, the system is imperfect, but I am unable to see how your approach will improve it.

Space mining is still a dream at this stage, but the Asteroid belt and Kuiper belt would be promising places to look, when we have the technology. There was a company called "Planetary Resources" but I believe that was bought out and/or made defunct in 2018. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Planetary_Resources

We do not as yet, have a firm handle as to why, but here is a promising article from CERN https://theconversation.com/cern-discovery-sheds-light-on-the-great-mystery-of-why-the-universe-has-less-antimatter-than-matter-147226#:~:text=All the particles that make,in a flash of energy. CERN: discovery sheds light on the great mystery of why the universe has less ‘antimatter’ than matter:

Certainly, and I'm sure I have never spoken against that. Of course to the highlighted section, and in total agreement with the rest. I'm speaking exclusively for the inncorrigable criminals, that do not want rehabilitation, for whatever reason. Every person committing a minor crime for the first/second time, deserves every chance to make up for it without the need for a dehumanising prison. But when a person thumbs his nose at the system, and thumbs his nose again, and again, and again, more action needs to be taken. And I am pretty sure the again and again and again, leads to crimes from a probably petty nature, to more severe and possibly even violence. The locking up and throwing away the key, thankfully probably only applies to a small percentage. It's that small percentage that we need the harsher prison environment. Can anyone give a guarantee that any "non prison"system as detailed by Peterkin, will work 100% of the time, all the time? Silly question as obviously the answer is no. And that is why we need the imperfect prison system, that thankfully has seen modification and changes over the years. I am reasonably well off and live in a community reasonably free from crime and violence...even loud all night parties are an extreme rareity as my community do consider others. My parents on the other hand, did not [when I was a tin lid and teenager] own there own home, [we rented] we did not have a land line until I was around 13, and did not posess a car until I had left school and was working and contributing. That certainly helps, but again no 100% assurance. The world is far far bigger than one's local community, family and friends. I chose to go beyond my safe little community bubble and through charitable orginizations, and World Vision, attempt in a small way, to hopefully improve the life of someone less fortunate, that despite that, remains a law abiding, considerate, tolerant human being. But the world is a big place with all kinds of people, that are inconsiderate, bullies, and violent criminals. That is a fact of life. If world militaristic endeavours and associate cock waving with different nations ceased, think of all that money that could be dispersed among poorer groups and countries, as well of course to science. Sadly, we have also had cases where the indigenous population in Australia, are discriminated against. That though is improving and certainly not as prevelant in city environments as in rural small town environments, with 1 or 2 police on hand. We have had cases, sadly of indigenous people, dying in custody. And a system with prisons will also not work for some.

I'm sure he does also, so as I acknowledge your point, you need to acknowledge other points that don't align with your agenda. To admitting that we do have innorrigables that thumb their noses at authority and justice, and any and all attempts at rehabilitation and lack any regret for their crimes, other then getting caught and that prison is a part of that justice system. They exist. I make an entirely reasonable and logical assumption that not all criminals can be rehabilitated, and that some are simply evil. And yes there has been an alternative tried...the prison another poster mentioned in the "torture thread" and certainly reform has been made over the last few years, that enable victims of violent rape to testify via video, and not undergo the pain of living through such an event, on examination by a prosecutor. That is decent reform along with others such as parole. Assaults with burglaries are likely to happen if someone walks in, and while criminals are not necessarily stupid as you say, some are, correct? And some are also cowards, and others simply evil. The fact still remains, and always will, that your softly softly approach may work with me, but just as certain, it will not work with all. A criminal justice system, with prisons is the best we can do...some work, some may not...Some may rehabilitate, others will not and have no intention of rehabilitation...Whether our justice system is effective, is desirable, but the important thing that society needs is that dangerous criminals are kept separate until rehabilitation takes place. I believe my country My country's 's record on criminal justice is on a level scale with most other westernised countries....It does act as a deterrent, it has rehabilitated and it most certainly does punish. If I had to steal to feed a child, I probably would...If I had to kill someone who was causing harm to my family, and it was the only way, I probably would also...I would also protect my property with appropriate force. And I would go as far as to say, that there are real living examples of all the above "actions" that any reasonable justice sysetm would excuse. It has happened. That's not criminality. I have never committed a serious breach of the law and never would...stole a few grapes, acted as a larrikan when a kid, been in a few fights...stiff armed a young hoodlum rampaging through a seven/eleven store, had a few traffic fines, and probably a few more I cant remember. But we are not talking about such minor misdemeanors. We are talking about justice for criminals that seriously offend society [some examples I have given, here and elsewhere] we are talking about just punishment...we are talking about a deterrent to others, and we are talking about rehabilitation if possible. It will work with some, will not work with others.

Why not simply agree that he too, like you, has a point. Otherwise you seem to be avoiding an answer, more then actually answering. Prisons are prisons and are there to help in the justice system, and like anything else, have evolved over the years, particularly with regards to the subject matter, re torture, discussed in another thread. Perhaps more reformation and evolution is needed in the system, but it is also understood that there are those that reject any and all those good intentions. The loss of freedom and being continually monitored has its drawbacks. Seeing the need? C'mon you understand that if a criminal continues to re-offend, again and again and again, that harsher Methods maybe needed. Especially when more then likley he has gotten away with a criminal act before finally being caught...this may lead to more seriousness, more violence and possibly worse. I can only hope to hell, that if I ever decide to turn to a life of crime, violence and harm to others, that you are the presiding judge! You can practise your reformation philosophy on me then. As I have said a few times now in different threads, we will never get a perfect santised society that you seem to be dreaming of. Why? because of the vastly different, natures comprising individuals, both good and bad. Generally speaking though, I personally would not swap my society for any other that I am aware of...improvements needed? sure, but nothing is or ever will be perfect. If you say so. In summing again, any justice system has prisons. Prisons are part of the justice system and are built to [1] Rehabilitate the criminal, [2] punish the criminal, and [3] act as a deterrent to the criminal and others.

None of that invalidates what MigL said. So we have a prison system for these innorrigables. That is all anyone is saying. Bloody oath! And fine them to the extent that it would mean they don't ever do it again. How many times would re-offending see the need to them locked up? Yep, just as I said here.... I really believe you understand where I and others are coming from and actually agree. I mean, it isn't rocket science that some people just do not, will not, and even never have, fitted into an otherwise just society. Perhaps you are practising your philosophical stance and psychology with me?😉

And as I said, I agree, at least with some cases. By the same token, if an individual proves inncorrigable and does not take the hint to conform, we have no other choice then the prison status quo, as deemed by the law. A fair percentage, yes. Sure it does! Most, the very vast majority, support law and order, because they understand that without it, they could also be a vicitim. It's a "F%$& you Jack, I'm alright" type of syndrome with many people. If they know they could get away for instance, with funneling a large amount of money from a banking institution, without getting caught, they would. No I havn't figures on the deterrent value of sentences [the severe comment was yours] and only bring in the "severe" with repeated many times offenders. I would also without doubt be leniant with first timers, and also take into account the WIKI comment I put in bold print. That be this one......."Justice, in its broadest sense, is the principle that people receive that which they deserve, with the interpretation of what then constitutes "deserving" being impacted upon by numerous fields, with many differing viewpoints and perspectives, including the concepts of moral correctness based on ethics, rationality, law, religion, equity and fairness". I've given two sides of the coin here, one concerning consideration with the victim, particularly in instances of violent rape, and the pain and torture they were often put through, to achieve justice, and then the false allegation of some low life woman, that accused a bloke of sexual assault, and caused an injustice to that individual, and destroying his whole life in fact. In the first instant, my sympathies lie with the woman, and the reforming taking into account her status as a victim, in the second with the bloke falsely accused. The two sides totally show that there is no pleasing everyone, and that we will always have those that will cheat, lie, steal, rape, murder, no matter how much society bends over backwards for them in efforts to reform and change to an accepted standard.

Sure, playing any sport is more important then winning, and teaches us certain desired human values. And we can also learn a lot from losing in sport. In time we all get beat, or have our records broken. I also do have a handful of those ugly trophies and medals, from when I was a tin lid, and they have pride of place in my home. Sport certainly unites in frienship and comradary, and at the same time, honing our competitive skills and the benefits derived from that. I was once asked a question with reference to Rugby League, the game I played and loved, but applicable to any sporting team contest, "Who would win the game; a team of champions, or a champion team" My answer was without doubt, the champion team, but realising that any team of champions, will probably develop into a champion team over time. That is if, like any sportsman, they have the will to win.

BINGO! BINGO!

Interesting. I wouldn't mind picking up on the history of Great Britian and Ireland.

Not at all...Justice as generally perceived, is that "just deserts" that is handed out to a person, in the event of a crime. That generally is pretty straight forward for the perpetrator, based on law. The victim on the other hand, can be put in an invidious, cruel, and mentally cruel position. eg: A woman that is viciously raped. In my country [and I believe in other reasonable democratic countries] a woman that has undergone such an ordeal, at one time would need to appear in court, in the presence of the animal or animals that committed the rape, testify, be put through the wringer of questioning and examination by an uncomprimising prosecutor, which many times [more often then not] amounted to mental torture of that victim. Now mostly statements of the accounts are accepted by the courts, or appearence by video link, where she is not "comprimised" by the presence of the defendant, and in consideration of her ordeal. Agreed, restitution is desirable, but as usual, you forget the percentage of inncorigables that are present in society, irrespective of any potential undesirable aspects of the criminal in his early childhood and upbringing. Plus mt statement earlier thus, "Justice for all! particularly including justice for victims and criminal justice." was also accompanied with the following, "Justice, in its broadest sense, is the principle that people receive that which they deserve, with the interpretation of what then constitutes "deserving" being impacted upon by numerous fields, with many differing viewpoints and perspectives, including the concepts of moral correctness based on ethics, rationality, law, religion, equity and fairness". https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Justice It takes all kinds of citizens to make up a society. Incarceration and/or death penalty most certainly do deter the majority of committing a crime or breaking a law, but as always, there are some who totally disregard any and all laws, over looking after and total consideration of one person, themselves. Not only be seen to do something about crime, but doing it! Many normal ordinary citizens have also faced difficulty, injustices, poverty, cruelty, even worse...but they rise above it all. Prisons are a necessary evil, as to are police forces, military orginisations etc, as to are courts, judges, juries etc. What sort of society do you believe we would live is without those evils. If you can show me where the "bleeding heart" approach will work exclusively, then you will have my support. But you know as well as I do, it doesn't and won't...We as a society must meter out justice as we see fit, sadly. And while that system, just like your bleeding heart system, may not work all of the time, it is still far more desirable. I mentioned just above an example with rape and the consideration of the victim." Here is the other side of the story. A couple of years ago, in Sydney, we had a woman with car trouble...a "good samaritan" stopped to assist. He got her car going again, and she embraced him in thanks. Then accused him of sexual assault. https://www.news.com.au/national/nsw-act/courts-law/caitlyn-gray-in-court-over-accusing-good-samaritan-of-indecent-assault-stalking/news-story/6afe58fe6bff5f65b302778ae3d5f48d A young woman, whose actions led to a good Samaritan being locked up in a maximum-security jail for a week after she lied and claimed he had stalked and sexually assaulted her, has made another accusation. Caitlyn Gray, 19 at the time of the offence, fronted Bankstown Local Court yesterday accused of lying for days over the way Sydney dad Kenan Basic behaved after he spent more than two hours helping her get her damaged car back on the road at a local BP petrol station. Mr Basic, 36, lost his job, was served with divorce papers from his wife and spent a week in Silverwater Jail in Sydney’s west after he was accused of the horrific crime on November 22 last year. Gray initially claimed the father-of-one lunged at her and grabbed her breast and vagina after she refused his advances as “payment” for helping with her car. She then claimed he stalked her through the streets of western Sydney before she called her boyfriend, who reported it to police. Seven days later, Gray admitted to making the whole thing up. """""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""" Justice must be served, or as you say, not only done, but be seen to be done. PS: https://www.news.com.au/national/nsw-act/courts-law/caitlyn-gray-sentenced-for-knowingly-making-a-false-statement-against-kenan-basic/news-story/4a4c9cae521751b9a5c58a05d2ad8b32 Caitlyn Gray, 20, was sentenced to a non-parole period of five months earlier today after she pleaded guilty to claiming Sydney dad Kenan Basic stalked and indecently assaulted her after he helped her with her damaged car. """"""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""

I came across it a few years ago, but was unaware it went under the title of "Abraham Maslow's pyramid"

Generally speaking, the standard in civilised countries, I cannot but agree with Externet and basically what I said before... How does it know and which one deserves you ask? As per the scientific method, and the justice woman holding the scales...weight of evidence. And while there are injustices from time to time, it is still the best available. But hey! I'm always open to any better system that sees justice for the vicitim as well as justice for the criminal/perpetrator.

I actually feel the same way about penality kicks deciding a game...extra time? which is what happens in RL...extra 5 minutes either way.

I remember coming across a "pyramid of knowledge" many years ago...not sure how relevant it is, but makes sense to me..... Mathematics being the language of physics/science. or another version if you like...................

Well the games are nearly over...still having the equally awe inspiring examples of human endurance and skill with the upcoming paralympics to go! Congratulations to all athletes and their teams, and a hearty congratulations to Japan for pulling this off without any notable incidents, in dificult times.

music From Earth The following music was included on the Voyager record. (REF NASA) Bach, Brandenburg Concerto No. 2 in F. First Movement, Munich Bach Orchestra, Karl Richter, conductor. 4:40 Java, court gamelan, "Kinds of Flowers," recorded by Robert Brown. 4:43 Senegal, percussion, recorded by Charles Duvelle. 2:08 Zaire, Pygmy girls' initiation song, recorded by Colin Turnbull. 0:56 Australia, Aborigine songs, "Morning Star" and "Devil Bird," recorded by Sandra LeBrun Holmes. 1:26 Mexico, "El Cascabel," performed by Lorenzo Barcelata and the Mariachi México. 3:14 "Johnny B. Goode," written and performed by Chuck Berry. 2:38 New Guinea, men's house song, recorded by Robert MacLennan. 1:20 Japan, shakuhachi, "Tsuru No Sugomori" ("Crane's Nest,") performed by Goro Yamaguchi. 4:51 Bach, "Gavotte en rondeaux" from the Partita No. 3 in E major for Violin, performed by Arthur Grumiaux. 2:55 Mozart, The Magic Flute, Queen of the Night aria, no. 14. Edda Moser, soprano. Bavarian State Opera, Munich, Wolfgang Sawallisch, conductor. 2:55 Georgian S.S.R., chorus, "Tchakrulo," collected by Radio Moscow. 2:18 Peru, panpipes and drum, collected by Casa de la Cultura, Lima. 0:52 "Melancholy Blues," performed by Louis Armstrong and his Hot Seven. 3:05 Azerbaijan S.S.R., bagpipes, recorded by Radio Moscow. 2:30 Stravinsky, Rite of Spring, Sacrificial Dance, Columbia Symphony Orchestra, Igor Stravinsky, conductor. 4:35 Bach, The Well-Tempered Clavier, Book 2, Prelude and Fugue in C, No.1. Glenn Gould, piano. 4:48 Beethoven, Fifth Symphony, First Movement, the Philharmonia Orchestra, Otto Klemperer, conductor. 7:20 Bulgaria, "Izlel je Delyo Hagdutin," sung by Valya Balkanska. 4:59 Navajo Indians, Night Chant, recorded by Willard Rhodes. 0:57 Holborne, Paueans, Galliards, Almains and Other Short Aeirs, "The Fairie Round," performed by David Munrow and the Early Music Consort of London. 1:17 Solomon Islands, panpipes, collected by the Solomon Islands Broadcasting Service. 1:12 Peru, wedding song, recorded by John Cohen. 0:38 China, ch'in, "Flowing Streams," performed by Kuan P'ing-hu. 7:37 India, raga, "Jaat Kahan Ho," sung by Surshri Kesar Bai Kerkar. 3:30 "Dark Was the Night," written and performed by Blind Willie Johnson. 3:15 Beethoven, String Quartet No. 13 in B flat, Opus 130, Cavatina, performed by Budapest String Quartet. 6:37

Justice for all! particularly including justice for victims and criminal justice. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Justice Justice, in its broadest sense, is the principle that people receive that which they deserve, with the interpretation of what then constitutes "deserving" being impacted upon by numerous fields, with many differing viewpoints and perspectives, including the concepts of moral correctness based on ethics, rationality, law, religion, equity and fairness.

The line I often used with a couple of conservative mates, was "even if there is any doubt [and I believe in the eighties there was some] that if we were going to err, we should err on the side of caution. Those conservative mates of mine, are now nearly convinced thankfully, but is it too late? Australia's bush fires and black Summer last year, the Northern hemisphere "on fire" this year...will we, can we, ever convince nuts like the Australian right wing Senator in this clip... should Idiots like this Malcolm Roberts spewing such nonsensical crap be made responsible? Listen to this fool, only 8.5 minutes long...this is the type of ridiculious conspiracy nonsense that the general public hear and sows the seeds of doubt. Science needs to get the message out there in a more positive and convincing form...perhaps sadly having another black Summer in Australia maybe benificial?

https://phys.org/news/2021-08-good-news-key-ipcc-climate.html No good news here: Key IPCC findings on climate change: The UN Intergovernmental Panel on Climate Change's first major scientific assessment since 2014, released Monday, shows unequivocally that global warming is unfolding more quickly than feared and that humanity is almost entirely to blame. Here is a rundown of some of its key findings from the IPCC Working Group 1 report on physical science: Goodbye 1.5C, hello overshoot Earth's average surface temperature is projected to hit 1.5 or 1.6 degrees Celsius above preindustrial levels around 2030 in all five of the greenhouse gas emissions scenarios —ranging from highly optimistic to reckless—considered by the report. That's a full decade earlier than the IPCC predicted just three years ago. By mid-century, the 1.5C threshold will have been breached across the board, by a tenth of a degree along the most ambitious pathway, and by nearly a full degree at the opposite extreme. There is a silver lining: in the most ambitious if-we-do-everything-right scenario, global temperatures—after "overshooting" the 1.5C target—fall back to 1.4C by 2100. more at link.....

Well said! I'm dreading our coming Summer in the Southern hemisphere!

https://phys.org/news/2021-08-greece-turkey-fierce-heatwave.html Greece, Turkey battle fierce fires under crushing heat: https://phys.org/news/2021-08-california-wildfire-second-worst-state-history.html California wildfire now second-worst in state history: https://phys.org/news/2021-08-drought-hit-california-town-ground.html A drought-hit California town finds itself sinking into the ground: https://phys.org/news/2021-08-forest-bolivia-consume-vast-area.html Forest fires in Bolivia consume vast area: official: https://phys.org/news/2021-08-hundreds-homes-forest-ravage-greek.html Desperate Greeks flee as fires ravage Evia island: https://phys.org/news/2021-08-wildfires-endanger-villages-fuel-site.html Wildfires endanger villages, fuel site, in Russia's Siberia: :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: It seems the Northern hemisphere is on fire. Anyone remember the devastating bushfires in Eastern Australia last year?. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2019–20_Australian_bushfire_season Clockwise from top left: Sydney's George Street blanketed by smoke in December 2019; Orroral Valley fire seen from Tuggeranong; Damaged road sign along Bells Line of Road; Gospers Mountain bushfire; Smoke plume viewed from the ISS; Uncontained bushfire in South West Sydney. The 2019–20 Australian bushfire season,[a] colloquially known as Black Summer,[13][16] was a period of unusually intense bushfires in many parts of Australia. In June 2019, the Queensland Fire and Emergency Service acting director warned of the potential for an early start to the bushfire season which normally starts in August. The warning was based on the Northern Australia bushfire seasonal outlook noting exceptional dry conditions and a lack of soil moisture, combined with early fires in central Queensland.[17] Throughout the summer, hundreds of fires burnt, mainly in the southeast of the country. The major fires peaked during December–January. As of 9 March 2020, the fires burnt an estimated 18.6 million hectares (46 million acres; 186,000 square kilometres; 72,000 square miles),[2] destroyed over 5,900 buildings (including 2,779 homes)[18] and killed at least 34 people.[19][20][21][22][23] Nearly three billion terrestrial vertebrates alone – the vast majority being reptiles – were affected and some endangered species were believed to be driven to extinction.[24] At its peak, air quality dropped to hazardous levels in all southern and eastern states.[25] The cost of dealing with the bushfires is expected to exceed the A$4.4 billion of the 2009 Black Saturday fires,[26] and tourism sector revenues fell by more than A$1 billion.[27] However, economists estimated that the Australian bushfires may cost over A$103 billion in property damage and economic losses, making the bushfires Australia's costliest natural disaster to date.[1] Nearly 80 percent of Australians were affected either directly or indirectly by the bushfires.[28] By 7 January 2020, the smoke had moved approximately 11,000 kilometres (6,800 mi) across the South Pacific Ocean to Chile and Argentina.[29][30] As of 2 January 2020, NASA estimated that 306 million tonnes (337 million short tons) of CO2 had been emitted.[31][32] ::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: It won't be too long that we in Australia will be entering another Summer. While I live in greater Sydney and in no immediate danger, smoke last year that turned our sunny weathger into misty, smoked filled days, my Mrs suffered greatly with her Asthma. Not sure what is in store for us, let's hope it isn't another 2019/20 repeat. Here is another dramatic photo from a few.... https://www.theatlantic.com/photo/2020/01/photos-australia-bushfire-catastrophe/604492/ A pyrocumulonimbus cloud formation is seen from a plane as bushfires continue in New South Wales, Australia, on January 4, 2020.

Let me say from the beginning, I don't drink, bottled, filtered or boiled water. Straight from the tap for this little vegemite! In saying that, my Mrs and young bloke do drink exclusively bottled water! I found the following article I would like comments on................... https://phys.org/news/2021-08-environmental-impact-bottled-higher.html Environmental impact of bottled water up to 3,500 times higher than tap water by Barcelona Institute for Global Health: What is the best option for individual water consumption if we take into account both health and environmental impacts? The answer to that question, according to a new study led by the Barcelona Institute for Global Health (ISGlobal), a center supported by the "la Caixa" Foundation, is that, at least in the city of Barcelona, tap water is the option that offers more overall benefits. extract: Results showed that if the whole population of Barcelona decided to shift to bottled water, the production required would take a toll of1.43 species lost per year and cost of 83.9 million USD per year due to extraction of raw materials. This is approximately1,400 times more impact in ecosystems and 3,500 times higher cost of resource extraction compared to the scenario where the whole population would shift to tap water. In this sense, the results estimate that a complete shift to tap water would increase the overall number of years of life lost in the city of Barcelona to 309 (which equals approximately on average two hours of lost life expectancy if borne equally by all residents of Barcelona). Adding domestic filtration to tap water would reduce that risk considerably, lowering the total number of years of life lost to 36. "Our results show that considering both the environmental and the health effects, tap water is a better option than bottled water, because bottled water generates a wider range of impacts," says Cathryn Tonne, more at link................ the paper: https://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/S0048969721039565?via%3Dihub Health and environmental impacts of drinking water choices in Barcelona, Spain: A modelling study: Highlights: •Quantified health and environmental tradeoffs of drinking water choices •Novel approach integrating health impact and life cycle assessment •Environmental impact of bottled water 1400–3500 higher than tap water •Local health burden of tap water consumption equivalent to 2 h of life lost •Filtered water considerably reduced health and environmental impacts. Abstract: Quantitative evidence of health and environmental tradeoffs between individuals' drinking water choices is needed to inform decision-making. We evaluated health and environmental impacts of drinking water choices using health impact and life cycle assessment (HIA, LCA) methodologies applied to data from Barcelona, Spain. We estimated the health and environmental impacts of four drinking water scenarios for the Barcelona population: 1) currently observed drinking water sources; a complete shift to 2) tap water; 3) bottled water; or 4) filtered tap water. We estimated the local bladder cancer incidence attributable to trihalomethane (THM) exposure, based on survey data on drinking water sources, THM levels, published exposure-response functions, and disability-adjusted life years (DALYs) from the Global Burden of Disease 2017. We estimated the environmental impacts (species lost/year, and resources use) from waste generation and disposal, use of electricity, chemicals, and plastic to produce tap or bottled drinking water using LCA. The scenario where the entire population consumed tap water yielded the lowest environmental impact on ecosystems and resources, while the scenario where the entire population drank bottled water yielded the highest impacts (1400 and 3500 times higher for species lost and resource use, respectively). Meeting drinking water needs using bottled or filtered tap water led to the lowest bladder cancer DALYs (respectively, 140 and 9 times lower than using tap water) in the Barcelona population. Our study provides the first attempt to integrate HIA and LCA to compare health and environmental impacts of individual water consumption choices. Our results suggest that the sustainability gain from consuming water from public supply relative to bottled water may exceed the reduced risk of bladder cancer due to THM exposure from consuming bottled water in Barcelona. Our analysis highlights several critical data gaps and methodological challenges in quantifying integrated health and environmental impacts of drinking water choices.