hoola Posted February 25, 2015 Share Posted February 25, 2015 Isn't there a law that refers to the question of equations and how they are read, as far as forwards and then in reverse? In the simple 1+1+1=3, the ones can only add up to three, no debate. In the reverse order, three can be one plus one plus one, or a near infinite variations of numbers that add up to 3. This seems to have something to do with the 2nd law of thermodynamics, and why reality can only function forward in time. Thanks.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fiveworlds Posted February 25, 2015 Share Posted February 25, 2015 This seems to have something to do with the 2nd law of thermodynamics, and why reality can only function forward in time. Explain. Isn't there a law that refers to the question of equations and how they are read, as far as forwards and then in reverse? In the simple 1+1+1=3, the ones can only add up to three, no debate. In the reverse order, three can be one plus one plus one, or a near infinite variations of numbers that add up to 3. Precedence Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hoola Posted February 25, 2015 Author Share Posted February 25, 2015 If the operating physical universe is based upon equations, that is why I ask the question. This would seem to rule out the possiblites of a broken egg re-assembling, or going back in time. The equation would have to be "read" backwards in every possible way that would give the "3", which is an analogue for the "now" of reality, in any given region of space. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fiveworlds Posted February 25, 2015 Share Posted February 25, 2015 If the operating physical universe is based upon equations I thought similar myself years ago but it proved impossible to prove. If the operating universe were based on equations then there would be no random. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hoola Posted February 25, 2015 Author Share Posted February 25, 2015 (edited) 5worlds.... Each moment in time of any point in space would depend on a nearly infinite original data stream input from a (so far endless) equation describing each point in space dating back and perhaps prior to the BB....with further complexity added due to the history of the interactions between points, altering each local equation expression vastly, plus the interference harmonics from the original equation signal all factored in. This incalcuabilty is defacto randomness on the local scale, although not a true randomness in the theoretical. Edited February 25, 2015 by hoola Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fiveworlds Posted February 25, 2015 Share Posted February 25, 2015 Each moment in time of any point in space would depend on a nearly infinite original data stream input from a (so far endless) equation describing each point in space dating back and perhaps prior to the BB....with further complexity added due to the history of the interactions between points, altering each local equation expression vastly, plus the interference harmonics from the original equation signal all factored in. Which would make it impossible to accurately mathematically model the universe because we would not be able to compute a data set so impossibly large. But that doesn't necessarily mean that such an equation wouldn't be theoretically possible if the resources were at our disposal. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
swansont Posted February 25, 2015 Share Posted February 25, 2015 Order of operations in math has to do with the laws of commutation, association and distribution.https://www.mathsisfun.com/associative-commutative-distributive.html Addition commutes (2+4 = 4+2) but subtraction does not (4-2 ≠ 2-4) Any resemblance to physics laws is because we use the math that works to describe nature, but it's not the other way around. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fiveworlds Posted February 25, 2015 Share Posted February 25, 2015 Order of operations in math has to do with the laws of commutation, association and distribution. Correct which is mathematical precedence http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Precedence Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
swansont Posted February 25, 2015 Share Posted February 25, 2015 If the operating universe were based on equations then there would be no random. "Random" follows mathematical equations. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fiveworlds Posted February 25, 2015 Share Posted February 25, 2015 (edited) "Random" follows mathematical equations. I am well aware that most random numbers in computers are not really random at all but are pseudorandom ie they are generated by mathematical algorithms in a predictable fashion using a mathematical formula. Other things too we assume a dice roll to be random but we know that a well trained sniper can take all these factors into account to shoot a target at very long range. Edited February 25, 2015 by fiveworlds Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
swansont Posted February 25, 2015 Share Posted February 25, 2015 I am well aware that most random numbers in computers are not really random at all but are pseudorandom ie they are generated by mathematical algorithms in a predictable fashion using a mathematical formula. Other things too we assume a dice roll to be random but we know that a well trained sniper can take all these factors into account to shoot a target at very long range. That's not what I meant. Random events can still be analyzed and described — you can tell the difference between a random distribution of numbers and a non-random one. Radioactive decay is random, but the number of atoms as a function of time can be mathematically predicted. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Strange Posted February 25, 2015 Share Posted February 25, 2015 Isn't there a law that refers to the question of equations and how they are read, as far as forwards and then in reverse? In the simple 1+1+1=3, the ones can only add up to three, no debate. In the reverse order, three can be one plus one plus one, or a near infinite variations of numbers that add up to 3. This seems to have something to do with the 2nd law of thermodynamics, and why reality can only function forward in time. Thanks.... You are imposing some meaning to the equation being written in a particular way, where there is no meaning. For example: 1 + 1 + 1 = 3 is exactly the same as: 3 = 1 + 1 + 1 The symbol '=' signifies equality; it makes no difference what is on the left or the right. There is no ordering or change implied by the symbol. It merely states that what is written on one side is the same as what is written on the other side. For example: "0.25 = 1/4" or "0.999... = 1" simply means that those are two different notations for writing the same thing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bignose Posted February 26, 2015 Share Posted February 26, 2015 It should also be noted that the order of operations is merely a convention. 2 + 4 * 6 = 26 by the convention most of us know. However, it is only a convention, one that everyone agreed to so as to reduce ambiguity. 2 + 4 * 6 = 36 isn't wrong so much as the operations weren't done in the order of convention. So, not only does it not matter what side of the equation terms are on, indeed a great many solution techniques are based on the fact that we have rules about how to move terms from one side to the other, but also that the order of operations in how equations are written is merely a convention. We could have easily settled on another one. As swansont above noted, the apparent relation to nature is probably due to how successfully mathematics have been applied to describe nature. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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