cookbeat01 Posted June 2, 2006 Share Posted June 2, 2006 How would something being able to go faster than instantaneous or less than zero time speed work? Please, do not say anything about lightspeed (where youe xperience zero time), tachyons, getting somewhere before you leave (causality) and time travel. I am not looking for those. I am looking for how that kind of speed works. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JaKiri Posted June 2, 2006 Share Posted June 2, 2006 Context? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Klaynos Posted June 2, 2006 Share Posted June 2, 2006 Faster than instantaniouse, implies that it happens before what causes it, meaning you've got to break causation, so you can't just say "don't say anything about"... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
insane_alien Posted June 2, 2006 Share Posted June 2, 2006 implying that something goes faster than the speed of light implies tachyons(particles that cannot go at the speed of light or slower.) you question cannot be answered by the criteria you have defined. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Neil9327 Posted June 3, 2006 Share Posted June 3, 2006 Your question implies that there are some things that happen in this way - i.e. the result occurs before the action causing it. I do not know of any scenario where this happens, and I expect other folks won't, so am unable to answer this question. Do you know of any such scenario? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ecoli Posted June 3, 2006 Share Posted June 3, 2006 perhaps you are refering to Merlin the Magician, who travelled backwards in time. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rocket Man Posted June 3, 2006 Share Posted June 3, 2006 suppose you time dialate one particle of a quantum entangled pair... surely you could have one travelling at a really high speed for a set time, enough for the other to have experienced more time. a change to one would effect the other at a time as experienced by the particles not by the observer. The effect of which would be the effect happening before the cause, relative to real time but the particles are sharing a quantum state which is across time i think you need to think in five dimensions for this one Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Klaynos Posted June 3, 2006 Share Posted June 3, 2006 Measureing an entangled particle does not infact change the other member of the pair... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
swansont Posted June 3, 2006 Share Posted June 3, 2006 suppose you time dialate one particle of a quantum entangled pair... surely you could have one travelling at a really high speed for a set time' date=' enough for the other to have experienced more time. a change to one would effect the other at a time as experienced by the particles not by the observer. The effect of which would be the effect happening before the cause, relative to real time but the particles are sharing a quantum state which is across time i think you need to think in five dimensions for this one[/quote'] That's not how it works, both with the entanglement (as Klaynos has already pointed out) and with dilation. "before" and "after" are not referenced to a particular clock; that's what relativity tells us: there is no preferred reference frame. So just because one clock reads 1:00 and the other 1:15, you, as an outside observer, read those values at the same time, and at some time in your own frame. The "1:00" clock is not preceding the other by 15 minutes; you have read them simultaneously, so to you the readings happened at the same time. However, if two events have a timelike separation, we will all agree on the order of events. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Severian Posted June 3, 2006 Share Posted June 3, 2006 Measureing an entangled particle does not infact change the other member of the pair... Why do you say that? I would have said that it does, because it collapses it into a particular eigenstate. One could of course argue that it is not changed until it is measured, but the distinction is not testable, so non-scientific. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Klaynos Posted June 3, 2006 Share Posted June 3, 2006 Why do you say that? I would have said that it does, because it collapses it into a particular eigenstate. One could of course argue that it is not changed until it is measured, but the distinction is not testable, so non-scientific. I said it because in the context of the thread, it isn't actually something happening, someone independent of the other measurer, measureing the other particle will not know a difference if the other one has or has not been measured by another person previousely :s Which yes I know is not scientific, but I thought in the context needed clarification, I understand your dislike of my statement, and will happily retract it... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
swansont Posted June 3, 2006 Share Posted June 3, 2006 I wouldn't view collapsing the wave function as a change in state, since it's in a superposition. And one of the more misunderstood things about entanglement is thinking that interaction after the wave function collapse will cause a change in the formerly entangled particle. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
J.C.MacSwell Posted June 9, 2006 Share Posted June 9, 2006 How would something being able to go faster than instantaneous or less than zero time speed work? Please, do not say anything about lightspeed (where youe xperience zero time), tachyons, getting somewhere before you leave (causality) and time travel. I am not looking for those. I am looking for how that kind of speed works. Like this, which will reach you before I type it, except now I think I might not type it after all. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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