dimreepr Posted May 12, 2019 Share Posted May 12, 2019 1 minute ago, DrmDoc said: Clearly, it appears some of us can't. So we judge and condemn them? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moontanman Posted May 12, 2019 Share Posted May 12, 2019 26 minutes ago, dimreepr said: Would you have faith in that? No, in fact if I had anything close to faith it was they would have fought. 26 minutes ago, dimreepr said: Can we at least agree that faith can sometimes benefit and sometimes not? So can flipping a coin... 26 minutes ago, dimreepr said: So there's no reason to dismiss it out of hand because it doesn't benefit you. Flipping a coin? Faith is not a path to anything but a chance occurrence. I am in the middle of a very bad electrical storm at the moment, do you think "faith" will keep me from being struck? 26 minutes ago, dimreepr said: But one day it won't, don't condemn the faithless to your fate because you got lucky. Show me how "faith" is any better than chance and we'll talk... 3 minutes ago, dimreepr said: So we judge and condemn them? Judge and condemn, please elaborate. So far all I see is good advice... 11 minutes ago, dimreepr said: Were you never a baby? We can't all grow out of it... If you never grow out of being a baby you need the same supervision as a baby... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dimreepr Posted May 12, 2019 Share Posted May 12, 2019 2 minutes ago, Moontanman said: Show me how "faith" is any better than chance and we'll talk... Why does it have to be? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moontanman Posted May 12, 2019 Share Posted May 12, 2019 (edited) 1 minute ago, dimreepr said: Why does it have to be? Because people who have faith very nearly always claim it is, this is false and misleads people into making bad decisions based on chance... In fact i would argue that chance is better than faith, look at how gamblers use faith to bet it all and ignore chance... Edited May 12, 2019 by Moontanman Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dimreepr Posted May 12, 2019 Share Posted May 12, 2019 1 minute ago, Moontanman said: Because people who have faith very nearly always claim it is, this is false and misleads people into making bad decisions based on chance... If you understand your reality without recourse to some sort of faith then good luck to you, the rest of us need faith at some point in our lives; how else are we educated? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moontanman Posted May 12, 2019 Share Posted May 12, 2019 Just now, dimreepr said: If you understand your reality without recourse to some sort of faith then good luck to you, the rest of us need faith at some point in our lives; how else are we educated? How can you be educated through faith, please elaborate? Are we talking about "faith" or reasonable expectations based on past experience? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dimreepr Posted May 12, 2019 Share Posted May 12, 2019 1 minute ago, Moontanman said: How can you be educated through faith, please elaborate? Are we talking about "faith" or reasonable expectations based on past experience? How many parents do you have? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moontanman Posted May 12, 2019 Share Posted May 12, 2019 Just now, dimreepr said: How many parents do you have? Four... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dimreepr Posted May 12, 2019 Share Posted May 12, 2019 6 minutes ago, Moontanman said: How can you be educated through faith, please elaborate? Are we talking about "faith" or reasonable expectations based on past experience? Why did you trust your teachers? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moontanman Posted May 12, 2019 Share Posted May 12, 2019 Just now, dimreepr said: Why did you trust your teachers? Because my parents told me to, but I found out by trail and error that many of them were full of shit... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dimreepr Posted May 12, 2019 Share Posted May 12, 2019 Just now, Moontanman said: Because my parents told me to, but I found out by trail and error that many of them were full of shit... Lucky you, but why judge those of us who didn't find out? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moontanman Posted May 12, 2019 Share Posted May 12, 2019 Just now, dimreepr said: Lucky you, but why judge those of us who didn't find out? I am not judging anyone unless the truth is judgmental in your world, if so then continue to have faith in BS... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dimreepr Posted May 12, 2019 Share Posted May 12, 2019 (edited) 5 minutes ago, Moontanman said: I am not judging anyone unless the truth is judgmental in your world, if so then continue to have faith in BS... Hmmm, that seems remarkably parallel... Edited May 12, 2019 by dimreepr Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moontanman Posted May 12, 2019 Share Posted May 12, 2019 1 minute ago, dimreepr said: Hmmm, that seems remarkably parallel... Truth is not a judgement call... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dimreepr Posted May 12, 2019 Share Posted May 12, 2019 1 minute ago, Moontanman said: Truth is not a judgement call... Nope. So who are you to call it? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moontanman Posted May 12, 2019 Share Posted May 12, 2019 1 minute ago, dimreepr said: Nope. So who are you to call it? Let me ask you a question, do you have faith the sun will rise in the east tomorrow morning? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dimreepr Posted May 12, 2019 Share Posted May 12, 2019 Just now, Moontanman said: Let me ask you a question, do you have faith the sun will rise in the east tomorrow morning? I don't care. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moontanman Posted May 12, 2019 Share Posted May 12, 2019 1 minute ago, dimreepr said: I don't care. Then why do you discuss faith vs truth? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dimreepr Posted May 12, 2019 Share Posted May 12, 2019 Just now, Moontanman said: Then why do you discuss faith vs truth? Why not? Besides, what is truth? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moontanman Posted May 12, 2019 Share Posted May 12, 2019 Just now, dimreepr said: Why not? Besides, what is truth? The truth is what is evidently true as opposed to what you want to be true... 3 minutes ago, dimreepr said: Why not? Besides, what is truth? You can believe anything on faith, requiring evidence makes the truth a bit more complex than faith but at least you can rely on that which is evidently true. Now answer my question about sunrise or admit to breaking the rules... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dimreepr Posted May 12, 2019 Share Posted May 12, 2019 2 minutes ago, Moontanman said: The truth is what is evidently true as opposed to what you want to be true... The truth is now and can only be now, if you think it will be the same tomorrow, then you have faith. Trust is different in one aspect only, we can adapt and accept. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moontanman Posted May 12, 2019 Share Posted May 12, 2019 1 minute ago, dimreepr said: The truth is now and can only be now, if you think it will be the same tomorrow, then you have faith. Trust is different in one aspect only, we can adapt and accept. No, my example of sunrise is poignant, if you have either faith or reasonable expectations the sun will rise tomorrow morning then you are wrong. It may not matter to you but the sun will never rise, the earth rotates and gives you the illusion the sun rises. It may not matter to you but the reality of the situation is very important to our understanding of reality. If reality doesn't matter to you then you are dishonestly discussing the subject. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dimreepr Posted May 12, 2019 Share Posted May 12, 2019 1 minute ago, Moontanman said: No, my example of sunrise is poignant. Yes, because one day it wont. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moontanman Posted May 12, 2019 Share Posted May 12, 2019 1 minute ago, dimreepr said: Yes, because one day it wont. As far as we can tell it never has and never will... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dimreepr Posted May 12, 2019 Share Posted May 12, 2019 1 minute ago, Moontanman said: As far as we can tell it never has and never will... What's so special about your tomorrow? Last I heard tomorrow, for our sun, is about 5 billion years away... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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