iNow

Just to clarify, is it possible you’re thinking about this in terms of abolishing the police instead of defunding them / reducing the funding they receive? One of the things I do like about the current rhetorical framing is how it shocks the system a bit. Most often, those with privilege think of the police as an inarguable good... fine servants making us safe and keeping our families protected. However, for non-whites the police are too often a source of danger and commonly increase their likelihood of death. When I get pulled over, I think, “oh man. This sucks. I don’t want to get a ticket. This is super inconvenient. I hope this dude hurries up so I can get on with my day and that I can mail in the fine instead of showing up in person.” When my black friends and family get pulled over, they think, “oh shit. This is how I’m gonna die.” Then they call their wife or mom to listen in on the interaction in case things go sideways and they wind up with a bullet in them. By framing the conversation as “defund the police,” it jars the system a bit... it’s not something we normally even conceive of... we think, “wait, wtf?!?” and reframes the normally implicit framing of police as an inarguable good. It’s not a policy proposing we abolish the police (tho in sure those calls are out there, too). It’s a conversation starter. Finally, I tend to agree with you that it distracts from the issue. I’m just trying to lead by example here and keep us focused on the WHY. I’m clearly failing at that.

Unfortunately, you’ve just slipped us back into a conversation about HOW they’re protesting instead of WHY. When you find yourself leading a social movement or advocating for one trying to gain traction, then you can choose any techniques and strategies you want to operationalize it and maximize your chances of success. Until then, despite your good intentions, every time you speak of HOW they’re conveying their message, you’re doing little more than distracting us from it... or reaching that next step of doing anything to address it or improve the situation underlying it.

I guess when all you have is a hammer everything looks like a nail. Protests grow MORE violent when the police intervene “armed to the teeth.” It makes things worse. People are protesting police violence. More police violence isn’t going to solve it.

Of course if one focuses solely on the bumper sticker version of this point it’s hard to disagree. But there’s a deeper meaning to this simplistic chant and a far more rational desire. Summarized: Like the US military, funding for police departments bloated and excessive. Money is used to buy former combat and heavy equipment from the department of defense and to continue the “dominate the streets” mentality. The ROI would be higher, however, if we focused those same tax dollars k stead into public schools and mental health clinics, and even increasing availability of social workers dealing with the mental health problems police seem so often to be on the front lines of. Putting a person with mental health issues into jail (or into a grave as so often happens after interactions with police) wastes money and that money can be spent far more intelligently... but that doesn’t package itself well when walking among crowds in the streets to improve justice so it gets distilled to “defund the police.” Cory Booker was on Meet the Press this morning and laid it out well (the entire 8 minute interview is worth the watch, the defund the police comments begin at 4:50):

Can we please acknowledge that increased availability of guns in the US does add risk to officers during every police interaction, but that being black also adds risk to ones life during every police interaction, and that neither of these things justify the way police are treating suspects after they’re already in custody or the way they’re marching on and being violent with peaceful protesters exercising their constitutionally protected rights? Surely, we can move on now... Please don’t make me write another horrible run-on sentence one that

Cute. Now, as the for the actual question...?

So, like Soros wrote a check to the cop telling him to put his knee on this random guys throat for 9 minutes, and then another check to the people with cell phone cameras to walk down the street and that exact moment recording it and then upload and share it, and then another check to get their social network to help it go viral, and then another check to all of the millions of protesters around the planet. And before that, they had a global cabal of doctors and nurses fake the reports of 40,000 deaths in Italy and Spain, and thousands of others across Europe and Asia, and a hundred thousand across the US, and now in Brazil... and put fake bodies into all the morgues and mass graves they dug. And they did all this because they like communism more than freedom. You’re totally right. That’s the ONLY explanation that makes any sense to reasonable people. Thank you for your bravery in speaking up knowing the risks of personal harm to you for sharing the real truth. You’re a true hero.

Just drop it, dim. Your reply was an unnecessary needling and distraction from the topic. Can’t believe it’s continued this long

There’s also the important question of how much changes... what is the magnitude of the improvement

Both, but the part which stands out to me is how many are incited by the police themselves or how many have been false flag operations from white suorenacist groups and agitated by foreign actors

Of course he’s not. I’ve known that for weeks

Dude. One of the cops from last weeks Floyd killing was Asian. Are you just blind?

The issue is police killing blacks, not specific colors or ethnicities of police killing blacks. You’re either trying very hard to intentionally miss a painfully obvious point (basically trolling), you’re extremely ignorant, or a depressingly common mixture of both. Which of these would you prefer we consider you to be?

Definitely yes. Racism is increasing. It’s just getting recorded.

You mean where a compliant suspect of using a fake $20 bill was handcuffed, forced to the ground, and had a knee stuck into his throat for almost 9 minutes, nearly 3 minutes of which the suspect was already unconscious? You mean that side of the story?

This is a bit like asking if a single rain storm or a single hot day is due to climate change. The system is complex, and of course it contributes, but the problem is there’s no simple yes/no answer in the way you’re trying to force there to be. What do you think?

That’s your problem, not ours

Correct. That often happens. Couldn’t agree more. That, however, is not what’s happening here.

We’ll never know the motives of others. All we have is their actions and words to interpret their intent

Interested members, take a look. You’ve got 4 minutes available to learn. That’s why you’re here

Sorry mate, but you must realize that’s a strawman and unrelated to people’s views of his comments

Additionally, he's repeating the long-debunked, but classic racist position known as the bootstrapping myth: https://money.howstuffworks.com/bootstrap-myth-climbing-economic-ladder-takes-more-hard-work.htm

Nope Nope Nope again Well, I would NEVER have guessed that... you don't say! You're at least consistent in your wrong assertions Nope... yet again