MigL

No apology needed Ten oz. Like I have previously stated, I enjoy discussion, the more passionate the better. Its always been civil. We've never stooped to insults/name calling ( well OK, maybe a few times under my breath as I was typing ). I'm just 'expanding' into other areas of the forum, and maybe sometimes I take a controversial viewpoint to generate discussion.

A quantum particle is not a classical particle nor a wave. Those are models that we can use to describe certain situations. A quantum particle and its properties, whether a photon, electron, proton, atom or even some molecules, cannot be described in 'human terms', it must be described mathematically. Again, a single quantum particle, going through a single slit does not produce an interference pattern, but a single spot. Repeat the process many times, and all the single spots will, like a newsprint picture, form the image of an interference pattern. Care to explain that in human terms ? I don't know how else to make quantum probabilistic nature more evident to you.

Maximum PC magazine does a yearly round-up and test of pay-for and free anti-virus programs. Check it out ( don't know if the rules allow me to mention their on-line site ). Keep your browser and OS software up to date and use either AVG, Avira or Avast free versions. If you must go to questionable sites, pirate, torrent or porn, use a dedicated machine which can be re-loaded or re-imaged, such as a cheap netbook ( $100 ). Keep valuable data on your good machine. Apple products are status symbols, you pay three times as much for the same hardware, and OS/X 'hand-cuffs' you. They get viruses also, although not as many. Phones/tablets also get viruses, but the ratios are reversed iPhone/android get way more than my win8 phone. The percentage of malicious users is always the same, but the total number of users varies with platform. Incidentally Windows hasn't been DOS based since WindowsME. Have been using micro-computers since 1979 ( TRS80 model I with 16 kB memory controlling the laser for my undergrad thesis ) and building since 1980 ( Sinclair ZX-81 kit ) and still will not do banking on-line.

The cpu temperature is the on-die temperature, it is covered by a heat sink and fan to channel away the heat. The plastic (case ) temperature is nowhere near that. The hard drive temperature is the bearing temperature of the HD spindle. It does rotate at 5400 rpm, or if not the original HD, maybe 7200 rpm. The razor blade noise you hear is more than likely the HD head stepper motor which becomes active on start-up or resume from 'sleep'. The cpu heat sink on laptops is almost always finely finned copper. The fine fins catch 'dust bunnies' and cat hair ( I have two cats and 12 multi-core laptops one of which is a Macbook, don't ask me why about either ), if this isn't cleaned out regularly, it will give off a burning smell. But it is not burning plastic. This applies to desktops also, but the heat sink is much larger and easier to get at ( I have two 4-core, one 8-core and did I mention, two cats ). As someone has already mentioned, modern cpu, throttle down and even shut down at high temps. Your Intel cpu has this feature. If the battery should catch fire ( there have been recalls on some Sony models amongst others ) don't put water on it. Batteries contain Lithium. You'll only make things worse.

The fact that your observation/interaction changes the probability distribution means you CAN affect change. The fact that this change is also probabilistic is of no importance. You have still affected change and removed determinism. Notice that this is my definition of determinism ( which we agreed was not the philosophical definition ). And that is ALL I claimed QM does. Removes determinism. I made no mention of responsibility, nor did I differentiate between intended or spontaneous ( random ) change, as in a neuron 'twitch'.

I would agree with Ten oz. Although sometimes justice can be restitution. For example, fining a thief so that restitution can be made to the victim of his theft. I just don't see how taking the life of, or incarcerating a murderer does any justice or restitution to the victim. It may however, prevent the murderer from doing further harm to society.

Again, "I thought I would ask other's opinions as to the cause, or even it it's factual", relating to iNow's post. What part of this do you not understand ???

Whoah ! Cyrillic ?!?! The anthropic principle is a cop-out as it can be applied to any system. Things are like this otherwise we wouldn't be here to observe things being like this, can be applied to anything because ALL things are exactly as we measure/observe them. It also explains absolutely nothing.

Not necessarily randomness, it is the probabilistic nature that defines QM ( the two are different ). If I can change the chances of an event happening by observing, i.e. interacting, then I can affect the outcome according to my will. Is that not you second formulation ? Or are we going around in circles ?

Like I said re-read my post. Covering one of the slits gives a single slit experiment. Passing a single quantum particle through that slit produces one spot on the detector. Repeating this numerous times gives numerous spots. Repeat it enough times and the spots will form the familiar diffraction pattern. Just because R. Feynman didn't elaborate, doesn't mean it doesn't happen, b3a26c ( too long, had to shorten it ). And tar, the situation can be described and has been described. By the math ! What you should have written is that it is impossible to describe by comparing it linguistically to familiar or common macroscopic occurrences.

I beg to differ. Any photon emerging from the event horizon of a black hole has exactly zero energy. Hah-Hah !

Hey, John and Del, why don't you guys just buy the same dictionary ?

If you are at all 'suspicious' of my intent Ten oz, we can have another full page discussion about me ( off topic ). I would rather forgive, forget and move on. Obviously I'm more tolerant of your ideas than you of mine. I clearly state in post #86 that I'm looking at black incarceration numbers. And you are right ,iNow, I was only looking at the first four age groupings, not all six. The reason I asked instead of looking up incarceration numbers myself, is because iNow's post shows a decline for that demographic, in a specific time range, and, this being a discussion forum ( not an assuming or suspecting forum, Ten oz ), I thought I would ask other's opinions as to the cause or even if it's factual

YIPPEEE !!

OK, so should this thread, then, try to define 'free will', before getting too far ahead of ourselves ?

Thanks for the info, swansont.

My previous post gives an example using a single slit or hole, so you can always determine which slit or hole the quantum particle went through, as there is only one. A single quantum particle results in one spot on the detector. A large number of quantum particles passed through the single slit, one at a time, results in an interference pattern. Re-read post # 39 because you don't.

Did you know, tar, that you can pass a single quantum particle through one slit and get a single spot on the detector ? Did you know that you can repeat the same process hundreds of times and all the individual single spots on the detector will line up and arrange themselves into an interference pattern ? Did you know that you can repeat the single process in hundreds of different experiments with hundreds of slit screens and hundreds of detectors in hundreds of different cities around the world and get that same single spot on the detector ? Yet when you stack the transparencies with the single spot from each of the hundreds of different detectors, they will line up and arrange themselves into an interference pattern ? What is interfering with what ? Or are you just seeing the probabilistic true nature of a quantum particle ?

I'm looking at the incarceration rates chart ( first set ) that iNow posted ( post #79 ) . The time span is 1960-2010. Black American incarceration numbers increase steadily to about 2000 ( peak ), then decline.

I will be happy with a NO vote. I admire what the UK has been able to accomplish the last couple of hundred years. They did it together.

OK It was a too quickly put together thought experiment, spurred by reading the other thread. Lets consider, instead, virtual particles. Is it impossible for a single photon to be travelling along a geodesic and spontaneously produce a virtual particle/ant-particle pair ? Now the virtual particle pair could have the wrong energy because of Hisenberg borrowing ( I made up that term ), but when they annihilate after a brief period, they must reproduce the initial energy and momentum of the original photon exactly. A gain any difference in the trajectory of the virtual particles would be manifest in a difference in the final photon's energy and momentum. In effect, virtual anti-particles that act differently gravitationally, provide a mechanism for violating conservation laws.

Showtime !! There is no predicted lower limit, you can go to zero. Energy gravitates and as such produces a gravitational field. A high enough concentration of energy in a given volume is predicted to form a black hole. See J. A. Wheeler's work with gravitational collapse of geons ( just going by memory). Is that an upper limit ? I don't know, you can still add more energy to a black hole.

Any insight as to the rapid drop-off in incarceration rates after the peaks in/about 2000 ?

Your opinion Ophiolite, but I'll have to disagree. The Scotts already have a vibrant cultural identity and no-one ignores their accomplishments ( James Clerk Maxwell is a personal 'hero' ) All the arguments for, that I've read on this forum or seen on TV/online, assert that Scotland would get to decide, and to keep more of her own money and be better off economically as an independent ( I won't use the word country, John ). Whether the ( yet to be negotiated ) terms of separation bring about such a windfall is the question voters have to ask themselves.

Dimreepr, are you suggesting that sociopaths and the like, do not feel and suffer psychologically like the rest of us do, because of a genetic abnormality ? Please provide references. That there is no free will and no such thing as evil in this world ? Please provide a valid argument or references. That this ( unproven ) condition absolves them of any and all responsibility for their actions ? And that understanding is the solution ? Sometimes you have to understand that something ( or someone ) has gone bad ( for whatever reason ) and to protect the rest, quarantine (segregation ) or destruction is the only option. Notice that this works for wine, cheese, plants, etc. so we also use it for people ( rightly or wrongly ). Knowing the cause and understanding doesn't affect what has become. It may help prevent.