vordhosbn Posted December 11, 2009 Share Posted December 11, 2009 Maybe some of you are familiar with this, maybe not. On 9th December, early in the morning, before sunrise, many norwegians were witnesess to strange phenomenon, which lasted for about 10-12 minutes. earthfiles.com Article dailymail.co.uk Article with good quality video Short description of the event in Wikipedia When i first saw the pictures i immediately thought that they were fake, but seemingly later reports confirmed the spectacular nature of the event with more photos and videos. Not to mention that thousands of norwegian citizens eyewitnessed the phenomenon. The official explenation, which is propagated all over the internet news websites, is that it was a failed russian missle test - a RSM-56 Bulava Intercontinental Balistic Missle, that experienced a defect in it's third stage. I am not really a frantic pseudosience/conspiracy fan, but there are just some details about this, that arise questions... For example, first i was intrigued about the spiral, which seems so perfect and equaly expanding in all directions with constant speed, that i failed to imagine how an out of control rocket engine will "paint" it. Then when the official story began to add details, it seemed a little more plausable - in low air pressure and low gravity conditions, not many things can distrub a spiraling missle trajectory... Well, but it is moving already, right... so if it's engine applies constant thrust to the already moving rocket, how the spiral will form, as it seems from the video, in one plane? Another thing was that the spiral stayed pretty much undistrubed, until suddenly it collapsed and dissolved in space forming a dark circle in it's center (darker than the sky around it), so what could be the cause of that. Explosion? There is no shockwaves in space, so the only way matter can be blown out is by other matter, which it doesn't look like. Any thoughts? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zolar V Posted December 11, 2009 Share Posted December 11, 2009 From my rocketeering experience, it does look like a rocket with a defect in either its nozzle or in its fuselage resulting in the expelling of fuel on consequent spiral formation. From what I see it appears that at the later stages of its trajectory that its instability resulted in its planeing out. Basically the centripetal force pulled the back end up to the same plane as the nose resulting in the large spiral disk. The blue/green color is/could be the result of the fuel. Most rockets have a sort of liquid fuel or a solid fuel depending on its purpose. For this matter I would assume liquid fuel because of the whole spiral thing. If it is a liquid fuel then it is also safe to assume that it could have a chemical in it that burns blue and is used as a catalyst for oxidation. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
vordhosbn Posted December 11, 2009 Author Share Posted December 11, 2009 Ok, but still, the spiral seems pretty steady, untill something happens at it's center and suddently it dissolves very rapidly. Wouldn't it fade slowly, if it was exhaust gases. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zolar V Posted December 11, 2009 Share Posted December 11, 2009 Acutally if you notice the trajectory curves slightly, in relation to gravity and a top heavy object. and the "Sudden" dissolving of the object, is in fact it running out of propellent to propell out of it. the object is still there but there is no illumination making it appear to dissolve. as for the round dissolving spiral. that is the fuel burning up. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
vordhosbn Posted December 11, 2009 Author Share Posted December 11, 2009 Hmm, that actually makes perfect sense. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zolar V Posted December 11, 2009 Share Posted December 11, 2009 actually i just got confirmation about it being a russian misfire. sorry i cant say names but for me it IS a russian rocket. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mooeypoo Posted December 11, 2009 Share Posted December 11, 2009 It looks like a missile depicted in long-exposure pictures. It behaves like a projectile/missile, bound by gravity and momentum (and as said before, ejecting fuel). The Russian military confirmed it is their missile. What's the problem? ~moo Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
vordhosbn Posted December 11, 2009 Author Share Posted December 11, 2009 Don't be so hasty - let's stick to the facts - ITAR TASS does not say anything about the spiral light observed by local residents. From CNN.com: The Russian Defense Ministry has confirmed the Russian Navy launched a Bulava ballistic missile on the same day, but has declined to make any connection with the lights seen over Norway. It confirmed the missile was fired from the "Dmitry Donskoi" nuclear submarine, but would not comment on the submarine's location at the time of launch. http://www.cnn.com/2009/WORLD/europe/12/10/norway.ufo.light/index.html In my opinion, it seems very plausable, but very plausable does not mean 100% undisputable truth... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mooeypoo Posted December 11, 2009 Share Posted December 11, 2009 Nothing is 100% truth, but when you have an accumulation of evidence towards one conclusion, I would say it's safe to assume it's correct. My point is mostly that by saying "alleged russian missile" the OP seems to suggest an alternative; if the alternative suggested is the one paraded online after the event, then it has something to do with a paranormal even or a UFO sightings. Both of the above require quite a large number of evidence, because they require a leap from our *current* knowledge of our universe. The conclusion of the phenomenon being a Russian missiles that the russians just aren't too thrilled to expose too many details of, is a much more logical assertion. I wouldn't say that's a russian missile with 100% certainty. Then again, I wouldn't say gravitational laws are true in 100% certainty, either (as Einstein tweaked Newton's laws, etc). And yet, we're safe to assume that they are both - for all intended purposes - the reality. ~moo Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zolar V Posted December 11, 2009 Share Posted December 11, 2009 like i said, i have conformation that it was a russion missfire. you should believe me even though i cannot cite who/where i got that information from. just look where i work/live Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
vordhosbn Posted December 11, 2009 Author Share Posted December 11, 2009 At the time of the posting I couldn't see how this can be a rocket, so i put "alleged" not because i was thinking that it was paranormal in nature, but because the official version did not convince me. Later on the day i saw Zolar V's explenation and a of a proposed simulation, so yeah i am pretty much now sure that it was russian rocket...But... why are government officials denying comments about the seemingly obvious connection between the observed spiral light and their failed missile test? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mooeypoo Posted December 11, 2009 Share Posted December 11, 2009 At the time of the posting I couldn't see how this can be a rocket, so i put "alleged" not because i was thinking that it was paranormal in nature, but because the official version did not convince me. Later on the day i saw Zolar V's explenation and a of a proposed simulation, so yeah i am pretty much now sure that it was russian rocket... Fair enough. I also must say - my frustration over this subject isn't meant to be on you at all -- you seem to be a smart individual who is interested in checking the data, cooperate and think for yourself. It seemed, though, that the blogosphere should learn a thing or two from your attitude, and my semi-frustration was on them. But... why are government officials denying comments about the seemingly obvious connection between the observed spiral light and their failed missile test? There's a difference between letting others do the math and actually *admitting* to something. It has to do with official'ness and politics. It's not the first time and it's not surprising too much.. admitting this would mean that (a) they ran a test in potentially very bad weaponary (ICBMS = potential nuclear? potential political problem, probably) and that (b) they did it over a foreign country, or almost over a foreign country, and © they failed the test. Any or all of the above may cause the Russian military to .. well.. not admit to much ~moo Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
vordhosbn Posted December 11, 2009 Author Share Posted December 11, 2009 Hmm, yes. Also if I am not wrong, Norwegian Government haven't been warned about the test. And was there no single astronomer in Norway, to point his spectroscope toward the spiral, so chemical composition could have been identified, leaving no space for speculation? If I were an astronomer, and if I had a spectroscope, that would be the first thing in my mind. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zolar V Posted December 11, 2009 Share Posted December 11, 2009 There's a difference between letting others do the math and actually *admitting* to something. It has to do with official'ness and politics. It's not the first time and it's not surprising too much.. admitting this would mean that (a) they ran a test in potentially very bad weaponry (ICBMS = potential nuclear? potential political problem, probably) and that (b) they did it over a foreign country, or almost over a foreign country, and © they failed the test. Any or all of the above may cause the Russian military to .. well.. not admit to much ~moo that is exactly one of the reasons why a foreign government would deny testing military weapons. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moontanman Posted December 12, 2009 Share Posted December 12, 2009 Damn, you mean it wasn't a plausible supernatural paranormal hyper-technological alien super intelligence UFO sighting of a FTL worm hole appearing in the atmosphere over Norway thingy? ..... shiiiiittt.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Genecks Posted December 12, 2009 Share Posted December 12, 2009 (edited) It looks like a missile depicted in long-exposure pictures. It behaves like a projectile/missile, bound by gravity and momentum (and as said before, ejecting fuel). The Russian military confirmed it is their missile. What's the problem? ~moo Scientists are suppose to remain skeptical. It's ok for people to generate arguments, though. Edited December 12, 2009 by Genecks Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mooeypoo Posted December 12, 2009 Share Posted December 12, 2009 Scientists are suppose to remain skeptical.It's ok for people to generate arguments, though. Indeed. Read the rest of the posts Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
michel123456 Posted December 12, 2009 Share Posted December 12, 2009 Zetetics, the Art of Doubt. "- An extraordinary allegation needs a more than ordinary proof." http://www.unice.fr/zetetique/anglais/a_enseignement.html#facets Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tranquility Posted December 12, 2009 Share Posted December 12, 2009 More importantly however is the question can they do it again? and if so can I book one over my garden on new years eve? that trumps fireworks everytime Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zolar V Posted December 12, 2009 Share Posted December 12, 2009 you could do it again, all you would need is a multimillion dollar rocket, and a defect in the nozzle that causes the oscillation. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mooeypoo Posted December 12, 2009 Share Posted December 12, 2009 It seems this has happened again. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cap'n Refsmmat Posted December 12, 2009 Share Posted December 12, 2009 http://letsrollforums.com/spiral-light-t19861.html?t=19861 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
toastywombel Posted December 12, 2009 Share Posted December 12, 2009 I am wondering if the recent Russian Missile tests are a response to the United States' recent agreements with Poland to station Patriot Missiles in Polish territory. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moontanman Posted December 12, 2009 Share Posted December 12, 2009 It seems this has happened again. Yeah but no where near as spectacular as the one over Norway! The one over Norway really looked weird this one just looks like a failed missile. Merged post follows: Consecutive posts mergedI am wondering if the recent Russian Missile tests are a response to the United States' recent agreements with Poland to station Patriot Missiles in Polish territory. If it was heads must be rolling somewhere for the failures! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mooeypoo Posted December 13, 2009 Share Posted December 13, 2009 Yeah but no where near as spectacular as the one over Norway! The one over Norway really looked weird this one just looks like a failed missile. By the way, I can't help but wonder if this isn't a simple result of our confusion for the first one. For that matter, look at the pictures from the missile over norway - the moon is weird, it's distorted. I'm not quite sure why (a filter?) so I wonder if the second images/video isn't a simple case of "been there, seen that" where the people working on the pictures spent less time working out weird ways of presenting them..? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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