A Game we can play online !

[Commander]

There are 15 Sticks laid out as per the following diagram :

 

 

This game is played between two Players.

 

Each Player picks some sticks on his/her turn and he/she must pick up at least one stick on his/her turn.

 

Whichever Player picks the LAST STICK loses the game. That means the Aim of the Game is to force the Opponent to pick the Last Stick.

 

A Player can pick up any number of sticks from any ONE ROW at a Turn.

 

That means if I start the game I can pick up either 1 stick from Row 1 OR 1 , 2 or 3 sticks from Row 2 OR 1,2,3,4 or 5 sticks from Row 3 OR 1,2,3,4,5,6 or 7 sticks from Row 4 on the first turn.

 

My opponent can similarly pick up any number of sticks from any one row at his turn from the remaining sticks and remaining rows.

 

At a turn a Player can not pick sticks from more than one row at the same turn but is restricted to pick as many sticks as available from any one row from the available rows containing sticks.

 

If the game is played a few times it will become clear.

 

If someone wants to start the game he/she says : I remove so many sticks from row number .. which is a valid first move.

 

For example you can say : I remove 3 sticks from Row 4 etc

 

Then I will tell how many sticks I remove from which row and redraw the diagram for the left over sticks.

 

Let's see how long it takes before I start losing to someone !

Edited September 14, 2015 by Commander

[Commander]

The expert Programmers here like Sensei, fiveworlds , Janus etc can improve on the online implementation of this.

 

For example if we replace the sticks with balloons and on a click they burst and vanish.

 

Is that possible ?

 

I think that is quite possible.

 

But to retain that new state / status of the game for everyone to see after refreshing the pages may be a challenge.

 

Unless Science Forum Programmers get involved to set up the necessary PHP pages and link it to the post perhaps that can not be done.

 

Is there any way within the available provisions / special BBCodes etc for the Poster to achieve this ?

 

>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>

 

To illustrate further the game let me make a first move :

 

Remove 3 sticks from Row 4 which leaves the board as :

 

 

What is my opponent's response ?

Edited September 15, 2015 by Commander

[michel123456]

16 Sticks.

[Commander]

16 Sticks.

 

Sorry, Yes there are 16 sticks to start with ! Not 15

 

Thanks.

 

+1

[tar]

Commander,

 

Ok, let me start off the anti-commander contingent. Here is our first move. ( It is the entire world against you commander) if anybody sees a forced victory after commander's move, please take it.

 

If commander's next move is a forced loss for the rest of the world contingent, then it will have been just TAR's loss, as I would then have made a bad first move.

here is a move

[Commander]

Commander,

 

Ok, let me start off the anti-commander contingent. Here is our first move. ( It is the entire world against you commander) if anybody sees a forced victory after commander's move, please take it.

 

If commander's next move is a forced loss for the rest of the world contingent, then it will have been just TAR's loss, as I would then have made a bad first move.

after opponent's first move.JPG

here is a move

 

Hi Tar,

 

How are you. Thanks for the move.

 

It always calls for courage to compete , be it war, game or any competition !

 

For that alone you deserve a special Praise and therefore +1 to you.

 

You have made a competitive move and you did have a chance to either make a winning move or a giving away move and therefore my first move was not very great.

 

I give below my next move :

 

[tar]

Commander,

 

Tough game. I have to punt.

 

[Commander]

Commander,

 

Tough game. I have to punt.

 

after tar's second move.JPG

 

tar,

 

My next move :

 

[tar]

Commander,

 

I am still punting.

 

[Commander]

Commander,

 

I am still punting.

 

after tar's third move.JPG

 

tar :

 

No problem, go on. You'll need a few games before beating me. By then you'll get the hang of it !

 

Her's my move :

 

[tar]

Commander,

 

Seems I have lost. I concede. What ever I do you either have a winning move or you could leave me with 2 and 2 in which case I would have to give you a board with a winning move.

 

Perhaps some other member would like a go at it. You could start another and see if you have any competition.

 

Regards, TAR

[Commander]

Commander,

 

Seems I have lost. I concede. What ever I do you either have a winning move or you could leave me with 2 and 2 in which case I would have to give you a board with a winning move.

 

Perhaps some other member would like a go at it. You could start another and see if you have any competition.

 

Regards, TAR

 

TAR,

 

Yes you are right.

 

Anyway it was a good attempt by you and you have now worked it out that this is a losing position for the one who has to move.

 

Actually any number of players can try it out and the game can be marked as ABC vs XYZ etc to identify.

 

In case you do have time you can try by making the starting move yourself for the next game.

 

Best Regards

 

Thomas

[michel123456]

My impression is that the one who begins always wins. Unless commiting suicide in the last 3 moves.

[Commander]

My impression is that the one who begins always wins. Unless commiting suicide in the last 3 moves.

 

Michel

 

I am not sure about that and I have not yet concluded about who wins for sure.

 

Why don't you start the first move for Game 2

 

 

[michel123456]

Sorry Commander I have better things to do. I came here on this thread as a tourist.

[Commander]

Sorry Commander I have better things to do. I came here on this thread as a tourist.

 

Oh, No problem Michel

 

Nice to get your inputs.

 

Yes, one needs a lot of spare time to indulge in such pastime !

 

Regards and best wishes

 

Thomas

[michel123456]

Thank you for your kind reply. +1

[Commander]

Thank you for your kind reply. +1

 

Thank you so much and that eases my load a bit !

 

Regards

Edited September 17, 2015 by Commander

[Sensei]

Commander, do you have Android smartphone or tablet?

The expert Programmers here like Sensei, fiveworlds , Janus etc can improve on the online implementation of this.

Better make Android .apk (application) to download IMHO.
Preferably using NFC.

 

Is your's listed here?

http://www.nfcworld.com/nfc-phones-list/

 

That means if I start the game I can pick up either 1 stick from Row 1 OR 1 , 2 or 3 sticks from Row 2 OR 1,2,3,4 or 5 sticks from Row 3 OR 1,2,3,4,5,6 or 7 sticks from Row 4 on the first turn.

 

This part needs to be rethought.

 

f.e.

If 1st player will take 7 from bottom row,

2nd player will take 5 from bottom row,

1st player will take 3 from bottom row,

2nd player will have 1 remaining and will lose.

Edited September 19, 2015 by Sensei

[Commander]

Commander, do you have Android smartphone or tablet?

 

Better make Android .apk (application) to download IMHO.

Preferably using NFC.

 

Is your's listed here?

http://www.nfcworld.com/nfc-phones-list/

 

 

This part needs to be rethought.

 

f.e.

If 1st player will take 7 from bottom row,

2nd player will take 5 from bottom row,

1st player will take 3 from bottom row,

2nd player will have 1 remaining and will lose.

 

Sensei :

 

Thanks for the response.

 

But I have lost my touch with coding and can not do it myself without spending long hours.

 

Not using android either.

 

About the game steps you indicated my opponent in the other site did remove all 7 sticks on the 4th Row as a first move.

 

Then I responded by removing 3 sticks from 3rd row leaving the following position :

 

[michel123456]

there is an even number of sticks (16)

there is an even number of rows (4)

there is an odd number of sticks in each row(1,3,5,7)

 

.

...

.....

.......

 

For two players A & B, it doesn't matter which sequence is followed: maybe row 3 is ended first and row 1 is the last. or the reverse or no matter.

In any sequence, a "logical" ending sequence of the rows is

Player A takes the first row (it can be row 4, or 2, or 3, or 1, no matter), by definition the player who takes the "first" row is called player A.

Player B takes the second row

Player A the third

Player B the fourth and loses

 

I mean the "logical" sequence is A B A B, with player A being the one who takes the "first" row in sequence

 

For player B to win the sequence must become A B B A, or A B A A, or A A B A, or A A A A

 

I hope I made no mistake in the above, so that the game can be analyzed more profoundly.

[Commander]

there is an even number of sticks (16)

there is an even number of rows (4)

there is an odd number of sticks in each row(1,3,5,7)

 

.

...

.....

.......

 

For two players A & B, it doesn't matter which sequence is followed: maybe row 3 is ended first and row 1 is the last. or the reverse or no matter.

In any sequence, a "logical" ending sequence of the rows is

Player A takes the first row (it can be row 4, or 2, or 3, or 1, no matter), by definition the player who takes the "first" row is called player A.

Player B takes the second row

Player A the third

Player B the fourth and loses

 

I mean the "logical" sequence is A B A B, with player A being the one who takes the "first" row in sequence

 

For player B to win the sequence must become A B B A, or A B A A, or A A B A, or A A A A

 

I hope I made no mistake in the above, so that the game can be analyzed more profoundly.

 

Hi, Can you explain it a bit.

 

What is the first move and what are the Dots or Sticks left after the first move.

 

Please note that a player can not own one row etc and any player can remove from any row on his/her turn.

 

And on the next turn the player can remove from another row or the same row etc.

Edited September 20, 2015 by Commander

[michel123456]

I mean it doesn't matter how many rounds it will take for a player to take the last stick of some row.

 

For example, I play first and take 1 stick of row 4

then you take also 1 stick of row 4

then again me 1 stick of row 4

then you one stick of row 4 (3 sticks remaining)

then me taking the last 3 sticks.

 

After all these rounds, the result is that I have ended row 4.

 

what i say is that the same result would have happened if I took all the sticks of raw 4 in the first place. And the chronological order doesn't matter either. All the above could have happened in between other phases of the game. What matters in the end is who takes the last raw. and thus who takes the before-last.

[Commander]

I mean it doesn't matter how many rounds it will take for a player to take the last stick of some row.

 

For example, I play first and take 1 stick of row 4

then you take also 1 stick of row 4

then again me 1 stick of row 4

then you one stick of row 4 (3 sticks remaining)

then me taking the last 3 sticks.

 

After all these rounds, the result is that I have ended row 4.

 

what i say is that the same result would have happened if I took all the sticks of raw 4 in the first place. And the chronological order doesn't matter either. All the above could have happened in between other phases of the game. What matters in the end is who takes the last raw. and thus who takes the before-last.

 

Michel,

 

Every move will have more variations than what you are stating.

 

 

 

For example, I play first and take 1 stick of row 4

then you take also 1 stick of row 4

 

In the above if you remove one stick from row 4 I will do the following

 

|

| | |

| | | |

| | | | | |

That is : I will remove one stick from Row 3

 

Now it is your turn.

 

You might give a tough fight

[michel123456]

| | |

| | | |

| | | | | |

My turn, I removed row 1
----------
edit, in my analysis, I am player A because I am the first to have removed a row. You are player B Edited September 20, 2015 by michel123456