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About tar

  • Birthday 12/11/1953

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    The computer game "Civilization", trying to figure out the stock market, philosophy of life, and scientific unanswered questions.
  • College Major/Degree
    BS in Business
  • Favorite Area of Science
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    Married, 2x grandfather.
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  • Baryon

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Scientist (10/13)



  1. StringJunky, That is what I am looking to discuss. Einstein talks about a lightning strike as a device to establish simultaneity, but does not account for the distance of each observer from the strike there are a number of inconsistencies and impossibilities that arise using relativity equations. One such hard to square issue is that of the speed of light being constant and defined as a travel time over a certain distance. How can you use this as a standard when both time and distance are warped with high velocities and large gravitational fields? the difficulty is an imagination can place two observers at two different points at the same time, but since they are in actuality separated by a distance, NOTHING can happen at the same time in both places only an event that happened half way between would be noticed by both observers at the same time
  2. except, Einstein assumes an observer that views both the stationary observer and the moving observer at the same time, in order to compare what they each observe at each moment. This makes the comparison mute as the third observer, that compares the two, has his or her own reference frame and can therefore NOT guarantee anything is happening at the same time.
  3. I have read Einstein's train thing and the idea of Simultaneity needs to be agreed upon in order to make any sense of anything. I think you have to consider I have been suspended from Twitter, shadow banned on Gab and now a watcher or bot deleting my sentences as I write.
  4. Thread, The OP had some interesting observations. One was of particular import to me. Any point in space contains everything. Not sensible at first glance, but if you think about it, information from the furthest galaxies in the observable universe is arriving as we speak to all points of Earth's surface facing in the direction of said shiny body. Interesting that if you look at a ballgame and I look at a ball game we both see the whole scene, and we are stationed at different points. Regards, TAR
  5. tar


    I like your electric fields idea regarding the applications of the twelve sections of the sphere but since I last posted on that thread I have run into a major roadblock to all the applications I was considering.  The subdivisions do NOT appear to be of equal area as I had figured earlier in the thread, using a spherical calculator.  I made some incorrect assumptions about angles and unfortunately it appears the subdivisions near the center of each diamond are  of greater area then nearer the corners.    So most applications are thwarted until I come up with a way to have each designated subsection span an equal area.

    There are still some applications that will work if exactness is not required.  If you quarter a section each of the quarters is of equal area, so if you want to divide the sphere into 48 equal sections for your application the scheme is still good.

    One such idea is to for instance mount 48 cameras on a tower or aircraft each pointing in the direction of the center of a quartered section of each diamond.  Then the output of the cameras could be sent in  a one to one way to 48 screens positioned in the same pattern around a viewer.  Thus placing the viewer at the top of the tower or in the craft.

    1. Show previous comments  1 more
    2. Trurl


      So the 48 cameras are some sort of virtual reality?

      Application: What if you divide the Earth into sections to map satellites?

      What about navigation, especially in Space?

      What about video game 3D world positioning?

      The changing shape and propagation of the radio wave?

      When you draw you start with geometry primitives. Why not create a CAD script?

      It is hard for me to think of something mathematical that doesn’t have an application no matter how small.

      I know my application suggestions are not descriptive and it would take much work to complete them, but I envision a 3D model manipulated by change, shape, and division of spheres. Instead of editing polygons you’d edit spheres. If you tried 3D printing you know the inside of the model is structured like a bridge trusses. Those supports could be your spheres divisions.

    3. tar



      I do need to learn some CAD and Rendering programs.

       There are many applications I think for the general Sperical Rhombic Dodecahedral structure.

      And interesting aspect is it filled with symmetries and dual figures. And it is the basis for  a dense packing scheme that puts 12 spheres around a center sphere.  This pattern is a cuboctrahedral pattern that when built out, putting always 12 spheres around each sphere in the same pattern it looks more and more like a cuboctahedron as you build out, and contains 3 intersectinng square planes and 4 intersecting hexagonal planes.

      The math is already there, the switch is to think of a cube with the corners cut off to the center of the edges.  The center of each edge is the center of a 1/12th section of the sphere.

      I am working on a scheme to each sphere in the scheme.  The scheme fills space and is completely scalable and very symmetric, having direct analogs to the cube, the sphere, the tetrahedron and the cuboctahedron.

      I like your ideas.  Please use the system freely. It is a mathematical system so I can not claim any ownership.  What I will claim is the discovery of the way to break the sphere into TAR radians using the four axis of the cube that extend through the corners, assigning a color to each 360 group of great circles and using the intersection of the two colors in each of the diamonds to name each degree sized area.  I recently found out that all the degree sized area are not equal in area, so there is as of yet not a clean mathematical way to use the system.

      Where I see some possibility however is in labeling the spheres in the dense packing situation.  There is a relationship between the spheres in the dense packing system and the TAR radian system but I have not discovered it yet.

    4. tar


      a scheme to label each sphere in the scheme

  6. Mit have gotten my lowers and uppers and lefts and rights fouled up. Like this, is the way the current number system goes. 10 7 4 1 11 8 5 2 12 9 6 3 Regards, TAR2
  7. Actually I don't think the universe is weird at all. It fits together quite nicely. Works better than the model.
  8. The four images posted are the 4 equatorial diamonds look for the small pink numbers in the middle of each diamond the number system is simple and elegant, unlike the arbitrary numbering I used earlier in the thread to imagine it , 1 is to the upper right of 2, 2 is the equatorial diamond where the date line on the Earth passes through the center, 3 is to the lower left of 2 then rotate as the Earth rotates to diamond 5, again an equatorial diamond. 4 is to the upper left, 6 is to the lower right. rotate to equatorial diamond 8. 7 is to the upper left 9 to the lower right rotate to number 11 10 is to the upper left 12 is to the lower righ Unlike my earlier numbering system this works out perfectly. The order is easy to follow AND you will notice a pick dot in the left corner of each diamond. This signifies the origin of an X Y type grid in each diamond where the degrees go up to the right in the one colors wheel and up toward the top in the other color's wheel. Each color thus spans six diamonds around the sphere and intersects with each of the other color wheels twice. This system is potentially useful because the square degrees are all named and of the same area. spheres have 41,253 square degrees Compare that with this system that shows 43,300 diamond degrees also notice the 3 point under each equatorial diamond Red, yellow, green and blue axis points respectively
  9. Swansont, Well of course you are right about all those things we didn't notice, and science found them for us...but we are talking about dark matter and dark energy here which, for I can see exist ONLY in the equations. That is only in the model and the imagination. You can't say "well that explains illness" like you could when we found germs. Regards, TAR2
  10. Well no dimreepr you can't, and I see your point. The crackpot has stuff working in his or her mind that any scientist knows can not work in reality. But the other side of the coin is that sometimes I know that what a scientist says is stuff the model says, or the math says or a probability equation says, and I know, from common sense, that it is nonsense. What I mean is my senses give me information that is NOT consistent with what the scientist says. The thing fits the model but makes no sense. For instance scientist say that the models and the math tell them the universe is 79% dark energy. That makes no sense. We have been in the universe since we started noticing stuff. How did me miss 79% of what there is to notice? It seems to me a thing is true if it is true in many ways, not just one. If dark energy is 79 percent of the universe and now we know that, we should be able to explain 79 percent of the the things we only understood 21 percent of before the discovery. I suppose that is the other reason I left the board. I think scientists are just people, same as religious folk. I give no special wonderfulness to people that believe more in their model than they believe in their neighbor.
  11. I enjoyed this board a lot. Made some friends and had some great discussions and learned a lot. Got run off by Hillary Trolls. Came back to post my solution to the spherical coordinate challenge I had posed to myself. Saw this thread and had to respond.O It is important to me that crack pots and scientist recognize that they are both working from essentially the same viewpoint. A human viewpoint. And the world is a whole lot bigger than any one person's image of it. For that matter it is a whole lot bigger and more complex than all the images of all the scientists, since man started communicating with him or herself. The scientist and the crackpot have almost exactly the same brain, with all the same chemicals and sections with various functions. Bodies match pretty closely too and the same chemicals are in the brain with the same dopamine/serotonin/norepinephrine in both the scientist and the crackpot, working on in most cases the same problems, with the scientist having more information and the results of more investigations and a better understanding of the collective models. However it is important for the scientist to realize that math is happening in the mind, in the imagination. It is not affecting the outside world until it is used to build something or create something in the outside world or in some other mind. Models of the world are just that. Internal analogous representations of outside the brain reality. Knowing the math means you know the model. The model, by definition is incomplete. It is not reality itself. If reality fits the model it is because the model is consistent and well designed. But reality is under NO compunction to fit the model. Imagination can be wrong. Optical illusions can give the eyes and brain misinformation. Old age can dull the hearing. Taste buds can be dulled by spices, matching facilities in the brain can get old and once sharp minds can become a little dull and slow. Point being, I have great respect for the crackpot, because I am one. The difference between me and a scientist is slight. Has mostly to do with experience and knowledge of conventions. The actual world remains exactly the same regardless of our knowledge of it. On Earth we change stuff all the time. In space we just have moved a few rocks and sent out radio signals. Just because you imagine something does not make it possible. What is possible is what we build our imaginations from.
  12. I do not believe the imagining of something makes it possible. I believe it works the other way 'round. When we imagine something it is an "image" of reality. The images we float though our minds and combine and synthesize in various manners are made up of sensory information we gleaned from reality. What we thought about before, what we saw, heard, felt, smelt, tasted or experience through any sense, existed, was possible, had to be, in order for us to sense it in the first place. Our brains "matched" what it imagined against what the eyes, ears, fingers, nose, tongue, inner ear, emotions, pleasure/reward system noticed about reality before. It is a must that reality fit itself. It is NOT a must that our image of reality fit reality. In fact just thinking it, does not manifest into reality that others can experience. You have to do something to bring it into reality. You have to communicate your thought, or build a model, or adjust reality in some way to contain your image. That is, the greater the number of things about reality that have to change in order for your idea about reality to be correct, or possible, the less likely it is that you are correct or that the thing is possible. If nothing about reality has to change in order for your image of reality to be correct, then you have it exactly right. Example. You cannot contain the universe within your skull. You brain is a tiny finite size and consist only of images of what actually is.
  13. TAR spherical coordinate system consists of designating the four three points adjacent to the South pole four point as Red, Yellow, Green and Blue, looking at the South Pole, moving counter clockwise around the pole. Each of the four threepoints becomes the center of rotation of an axis going through the center of the sphere. These are analogous to the four axis of a tetrahedron. Looking at them from the south, each axis can be imagined as putting out an infinite number of great circles that intersect at the other end of the axis on opposite side of the sphere, The line going through the South pole is the 0/360 line and the other lines are designated in degrees in a clockwise direction around each of the four axis. Twelve diamonds are described by drawing the great circles at 0 degrees, 60 degrees, 120, 180,, 240, 300 and 360. The 0, 60, 120 are the same circle as the 180, 240, 300 but retain them all because the intersections of certain of the degrees on the six diamonds that are furthest from the axis ends, around the middle of the sphere, in reference to each axis, allow a description of every possible direction from the center of the sphere with two coordinates. Diamond 1 through 12 are numbered as follows. 1 Red 180-240 Blue 120-180 2 Yellow 240-300 Blue 60-120 3 Green 300-360 Blue 0-60 4 Yellow 180-240 Red 120 180 5 Green 240-300 Red 60-120 6 Blue 300-360 Red 0-60 7. Green 180-240 Yellow 120-180 8 Blue 240-300 Yellow 60=120 9 Red 300-360 Yellow 0-60 10 Blue 180-240 Green 120-180 11 Red 240-300 Green 60-120 12 Yellow 300-360 Green 0-60 Notice each color appears 6 times, the six 60 sections. So if you have a point in space at the center of a sphere, and designate a South pole surrounded by four tetrahedral axis you designate one as Red and the whole system is determined and every direction in space can be designated with color degree, color degree and every point in space describable by adding a distance to the direction. Copyright Thomas A. Roth Aug 8 2021
  14. Right. is my point. The leader of the free world, happened to have enjoyed, as a millionaire, the favors of ladies, in his many encounters with such. Such ladies often got something for their favors. It does not make Trump the devil. There is, in the apt mind, the ability to hold two contradictory ideas. To denounce a person's treatment of women, while lauding their ability to command the discussion for two years with tweets. Trump remains the most powerful person in the world. This is higher status than you or I have achieved. He must have some capability to rise to this position. Since he is a millionaire himself, I doubt he was bought, and I don't think he is subject to the pressures that Wellington group or the Koch brothers might bring to bear. He is an actual strong leader, with good ideas and speaks the truth, rather than playing identity politics. He gets things done, and takes decisive action. I think part of the problem, since the election is grief. Hilary was on her way to be the first woman president, and when she lost, the hopes and dreams of millions were dashed. I recently lost my dad, and looked up again the five stages of grief. I knew them from before, as I looked them up when I was getting laid off my job, as everybody else was too, and I recognized the stages of grief being run through by myself and the people around me. One of the stages is denial, and I think a large part of our country has been in this stage since the election. If you were a Hillary supporter, look up the five stages of grief and reflect a moment upon which stage you are in. One day you will arrive at acceptance, but judging by this thread, I would guess it is not imminent. Regards, TAR just noticed I dropped another 3 rep points no idea why what I am saying is at all wrong or evil I am out again. You guys are hopeless. You seem to enjoy responding to my posts, so I am thinking I am at least making you think. Unfortunately I hate neg reps, and don't enjoy accruing them when I make a good argument. Sorry to challenge your narrative, but it needs challenging, and the real world needs to be lived in. You need me and I need you. The middle ground needs to be inhabited. Figure it out on your own. I am out. Deleting my favorite. You are on your own for a while. Disgusted, TAR
  15. I have been in corporate America, (a Japanese owned company) and I remember a year were we will losing money and Japan was keeping us open. I was smoking a cigarette and looking out in the parking lot at hundreds of late model cars, each representing an employee with a family that supported the local shoe maker, day care, grocery store...etc. I decided that we were winning, just by being in business.
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