Galaxy rotation rates explained without Dark Matter

[Bignose]

In other discussion groups I have been part of people have been more interested to understand an idea fully and then criticize, rather than attack at every step of the way and make personal comments along the way.

People are asking you questions because they are trying to understand. You haven't demonstrated very strong support for many of your statements, so people are asking why. So, you're right, they are not understanding. I'd like to suggest that you do your utmost to answer the questions being asked because that will help further both your understanding and our understanding.

[granpa]

Sorry this is my first post:

Here is the abstract of my paper that explains the content concisely:

The rotation rates of stars in observed Galaxies are almost the same regardless of the distance from the galactic center and can currently only be explained by invoking a huge halo of invisible dark matter filling the space occupied by the galaxy. By realizing that space-time itself is an energy field that can flow, the rotation of galaxies can be explained by space-time also being consumed by the black hole at the center of a galaxy.

Does the inward flow affect light?

What about antimater?

[Declan]

I have been trying to answer all the questions but there is only one of me and about six people firing questions all at once.

 

Yes light and antimatter are all embedded in the energy field medium and so are affected to.

The bending of light due to the inflow appears to be lending due to Dark Matter.

 

To Mordred,

 

There are two ways to interpret Relativity: one where light's speed is fixed and the geometry of space deforms accordingly, and the other where light's speed slows in a region of dense medium (as does the rate of time such that an observer always measures light's speed to be constant).

I am suggesting that the second interpretation makes more sense as the space geometry remains fixed but is filled with a field with vatiable density. When looked at this way one can see how the field can flow and get consumed by the black hole and thus explain the Galaxy rotation rates without having to invoke Dark Matter.

[granpa]

light does slow down near a large mass due to gravitational time dilation

 

I dont know of anyone saying it doesnt

so antimatter falls downward?

Edited July 3, 2016 by granpa

[Mordred]

light does slow down near a large mass due to gravitational time dilation

 

I dont know of anyone saying it doesn't

 

 

Light doesn't slow down. Its invariant all observers will measure it as c. Antimatter follows the same rules as regular matter. The only difference between antimatter and its matter counter part is charge.

Lorentz transformation.

 

First two postulates.

1) the results of movement in different frames must be identical

 

2) light travels by a constant speed c in a vacuum in all frames.

 

Consider 2 linear axes x (moving with constant velocity and [latex]\acute{x}[/latex] (at rest) with x moving in constant velocity v in the positive [latex]\acute{x}[/latex] direction.

Time increments measured as a coordinate as dt and [latex]d\acute{t}[/latex] using two identical clocks. Neither [latex]dt,d\acute{t}[/latex] or [latex]dx,d\acute{x}[/latex] are invariant. They do not obey postulate 1.

A linear transformation between primed and unprimed coordinates above

in space time ds between two events is

[latex]ds^2=c^2t^2=c^2dt-dx^2=c^2\acute{t}^2-d\acute{x}^2[/latex]

Invoking speed of light postulate 2.

[latex]d\acute{x}=\gamma(dx-vdt), cd\acute{t}=\gamma cdt-\frac{dx}{c}[/latex]

Where [latex]\gamma=\frac{1}{\sqrt{1-(\frac{v}{c})^2}}[/latex]

 

Time dilation

 

dt=proper time ds=line element

since [latex]d\acute{t}^2=dt^2[/latex] is invariant.

an observer at rest records consecutive clock ticks seperated by space time interval [latex]dt=d\acute{t}[/latex] she receives clock ticks from the x direction separated by the time interval dt and the space interval dx=vdt.

[latex]dt=d\acute{t}^2=\sqrt{dt^2-\frac{dx^2}{c^2}}=\sqrt{1-(\frac{v}{c})^2}dt[/latex]

so the two inertial coordinate systems are related by the lorentz transformation

[latex]dt=\frac{d\acute{t}}{\sqrt{1-(\frac{v}{c})^2}}=\gamma d\acute{t}[/latex]

So the time interval dt is longer than interval [latex]d\acute{t}[/latex]

 

 

 

[latex]\acute{t}=\frac{t-vx/c^2}{\sqrt{1-v^2/c^2}}[/latex]

[latex]\acute{x}=\frac{x-vt}{\sqrt{1-v^2/c^2}}[/latex]

[latex]\acute{y}=y[/latex]

[latex]\acute{z}=z[/latex]

To Mordred,

 

There are two ways to interpret Relativity: one where light's speed is fixed and the geometry of space deforms accordingly, and the other where light's speed slows in a region of dense medium (as does the rate of time such that an observer always measures light's speed to be constant).

I am suggesting that the second interpretation makes more sense as the space geometry remains fixed but is filled with a field with vatiable density. When looked at this way one can see how the field can flow and get consumed by the black hole and thus explain the Galaxy rotation rates without having to invoke Dark Matter.

This is why I wanted you to look at the null geodesic equations in greater detail.

While looking at those null geodesic equations. Also look at the interactions for a photon.

 

Then consider that the universe is considered electromagnetically neutral.

 

Consider this. A thousand light years of lead would certainly count as a medium. Yet a neutrino can pass through it without a single interaction. Its path follows the normal space-time geodesics. (spacetime as opposed to time-time (null))

 

So how can you account for that?

 

Next how can you account for gravitational lensing where there is no nearby galaxy or black holes?

 

Galaxy rotation curves isn't the only piece of evidence of dark matter. Quite frankly we may well be on our way to solving both dark matter and dark energy.

 

Further research and tests are still underway.

 

DARK MATTER AS STERILE NEUTRINOS

 

http://arxiv.org/abs/1402.4119

http://arxiv.org/abs/1402.2301

http://arxiv.org/abs/1306.4954

 

Higg's inflation possible dark energy

 

http://arxiv.org/abs/1402.3738

http://arxiv.org/abs/0710.3755

http://arxiv.org/abs/1006.2801

 

This is my cuurent field of study specifically the Pati Salam contributions to the SO(10) MSM model. More particularly on the GUT symmetry breaking aspects.

 

I trend towards the single seesaw mechanism over other seesaw MSSM models. But thats a personal feeling

Edited July 3, 2016 by Mordred

[granpa]

Light travels at the same speed near a black hole even though clocks at that location are time dilated??!!

 

Lol. I thought you were an expert.

I guess I was wrong!

Edited July 3, 2016 by granpa

[Mordred]

Like travels at the same speed near a black hole even though clocks at that location are time dilated??!!

 

Lol. I thought you were an expert.

I guess I was wrong!

Look at the postulates of GR postulate 2. ALL OBSERVERS will measure c as the same speed.

 

The metrics I posted show the details. This is the standard GR definement.

 

If you like here is a simplified coverage.

 

https://briankoberlein.com/2015/02/14/burden-proof/

 

Of course you could just read any GR textbook. They all teach the same postulates. I will link you to a few free ones including a reprint of Einsteins paper

 

http://www.gutenberg.org/files/30155/30155-pdf.pdf: "Relativity: The Special and General Theory" by Albert Einstein

 

http://www.blau.itp.unibe.ch/newlecturesGR.pdf "Lecture Notes on General Relativity" Matthias Blau

Edited July 3, 2016 by Mordred

[ajb]

Like travels at the same speed near a black hole even though clocks at that location are time dilated??!!

As measured by?

 

 

Locally in general relativity the speed of light in vacuum is c - just as it is in special relativity. Mordred is right.

[granpa]

Light travels at the speed of light as measured locally by an observer who is also time dilated.

 

As measured by an observer far from the black hole both the light and the local Observer would be time dilated and would appear to be moving very slowly

Edited July 3, 2016 by granpa

[ajb]

Light travels at the speed of light as measured locally by an observer who is also time dilated.

Once again ... the observer does not measure any time dilation effects on himself. Time dilation only comes into play when different observers compare the duration of an event they both witness. And this is only when it really makes sense to compare clocks.

[granpa]

Yes exactly.

That's why the light will appear to be moving at light speed to the local Observer. Because the local Observer is exactly as time dilated as the light due to gravitational time dilation.

To an observer far away both the light and the Local observer will appear to be time dilated due to gravitational gravitational time dilation

Edited July 3, 2016 by granpa

[ajb]

What does it mean for a local observer to be time dilated? Plus this is a local thing and so we can forget the curvature of space-time.

[Mordred]

Yes exactly.

That's why the light will appear to be moving at light speed to the local Observer. Because the local Observer is exactly as time dilated as the light due to gravitational time dilation.

Sure but there is no preferred frame. The laws of physics are the same for all observers. This includes the distant observer. C is the only constant between observers. By the way you also need length contraction. Edited July 3, 2016 by Mordred

[granpa]

It means he is deep within the gravity well where gravitational time dilation is significant

[Mordred]

It means he is deep within the gravity well where gravitational time dilation is significant

So what about the outside observer? The quantity that is constant or invariant is c..

 

Look at the mathematics. I posted a basic textbook answer. One that you can find in any Relativity textbook.

 

What did you think the term "invariant" means?

Edited July 3, 2016 by Mordred

[ajb]

It means he is deep within the gravity well where gravitational time dilation is significant

Time dilation is an effect when comparing clocks. The observer himself - irrespective of if we are talking about gravitational or kinematic time dilation - notices no difference to his clock. His clock, as far as he measures, as always ran at the rate he sees.

 

To see any time dilation effects our observer must comapre his clock with another observer. In the context of the Schwarzschild solution one can set this up as measuring gravitational Doppler shift of a light ray sent from one observer to another. The time dilation is then deduced from that.

 

Anyway, again, any observer does not see anything strange happen to themselves.

Edited July 3, 2016 by ajb

[granpa]

Yes they're time dilated relative to an observer which is far from the black hole and outside the gravity well and outside of the gravitational time dilation. What else would it mean?

 

I have no idea what you are not getting here.

 

Are you just messing with me?

Edited July 3, 2016 by granpa

[Mordred]

If you design a metric you look for what is common between all observers. Then develop your metric for what changes for each observer.

 

In Relativity the only factor that is common between all observers is c.

 

Both distance measures and time vary between observers. (Makes for a poor baseline geometry).

 

This is one of the fundamental reasons why SR isnt as robust as GR. As SR trends towards the rest frame as the pteferred frame of reference. GR fixes the preferred frame in a non cooordinate dependant manner with tensors

Edited July 3, 2016 by Mordred

[ajb]

Yes they're time dilated relative to an observer which is far from the black hole and outside the gravity well and outside of the gravitational time dilation.

Yes, this is usually how it is understood - you can set up the coordinate time as the proper time of a distant observer and so on...

 

 

 

I have no idea what you are not getting here.

A single observer is not time dilated. It makes no sense - you need to compare his clock with another clock. As far as the observer measures nothing funny happens to himself.

 

Thus, I cannot really understand some of your earlier statement

 

"Because the local Observer is exactly as time dilated as the light due to gravitational time dilation."

 

In fact we don't have a very general notion of gravitational time dilation. The local speed of light is c for any space-time; you can always in small enough regions work with a flat space-time and recover special relativity. Globally the situation is more complicated and the speed of light depends on the coordinates you pick - if you have a non-inertial observer then the speed of light is almost never going to be c.

Edited July 3, 2016 by ajb

[granpa]

I think you skipped over part of my response.

 

Light travels at the speed of light as measured locally by an observer who is also time dilated.

As measured by an observer far from the black hole both the light and the local Observer would be time dilated and would appear to be moving very slowly

[Mordred]

No light still measures c to the distant observer. The wavelength of light varies not its speed

[ajb]

Okay, I think you edited that after I started to respond.

[Mordred]

Here is gravitational redshift

 

[latex]\frac{\lambda}{\lambda_o}=\frac{1}{\sqrt{(1 - \frac{2GM}{r c^2})}}[/latex]

 

It is the wavelength that changes between observers not the invariant c.

Edited July 3, 2016 by Mordred

[Declan]

Thank you granpa you can see the point I am trying to make.

 

I doesn't matter if the observer knows he is time dilated or not, he will always measure light to travel at the same speed - as his time slows by exactly the same amount as does the speed of light in his reference frame.

 

Every physical process is determined by the rate at which waves (light or matter) propagate through a region of space, so time will slow down by exactly the same amount as does the propagation speed of light.

 

All quanta - be it light, electrons, positrons or neutrinos are wave functions traveling through the space-time medium (aka energy field), so all will follow the geodesics. Light will bend, and matter will gravitate as a result of the slowed propagation speed in a region where the field is more dense.

[granpa]

Gravitational time dilation is entirely orthodox.

 

That has nothing to do with your theory

 

So you believe antimatter falls downward?

Edited July 3, 2016 by granpa