Maybe I found a infinite motor powered by hydrogen?

This is a very first prototype that I idealized, before I explain how it works, I want to establish some points:

1. I'm not a professional engineer, i'm just a enthusiast of aviation that was lost in rambling trying to find a sustentable engine.

2. Probably it is subject to some flaws, and I need help from internauts to show problems to solve them, probably in some future it can be sufficient to power a entire Boeing 787.

3. And lastly, it maybe also be completely flawed and be subject to redesign completely, and even being archived or abandoned.

So, how it works?

Well, it works in a cycle, that is depicted on the attached file below, and is organized in numbers also depicted in the file:

1. The main tank is filled with unmineralized water.

2. The water go to a chamber, then, inside the chamber, the water pass through a electrolysis and is divided in hydrogen and oxygen.

3. The hydrogen go to the anode, and is divided again in proton and eletron.

4. The proton go to the catode through the electrolite, and the eletron goes for another path (seventh step)

5. The oxygen go to the catode chamber during the dividing of the hydrogen.

6. The eletron pass through the catode and joint again with the proton and turn again to hydrogen and joint with oxygen, becoming water.

7. The eletron, before pass on the catode, feed the electric motor by the motor brushes.

8. The water, a result of the sixth step, go again to the water tank and it restarts the cycle.

And then, that's my proposed cycle of the infinite hydrogen engine. And I say another time, i'm subject to constructive criticism and troubleshooting to improve more this project.

PS: I don't have willing to put this project in practice, for now.

Edited May 10May 10 by Heitor Silva

58 minutes ago, Heitor Silva said:

Maybe I found a infinite motor powered by hydrogen?

This is a very first prototype that I idealized, before I explain how it works, I want to establish some points:

1. I'm not a professional engineer, i'm just a enthusiast of aviation that was lost in rambling trying to find a sustentable engine.

2. Probably it is subject to some flaws, and I need help from internauts to show problems to solve them, probably in some future it can be sufficient to power a entire Boeing 787.

3. And lastly, it maybe also be completely flawed and be subject to redesign completely, and even being archived or abandoned.

So, how it works?

Well, it works in a cycle, that is depicted on the attached file below, and is organized in numbers also depicted in the file:

1. The main tank is filled with unmineralized water.

2. The water go to a chamber, then, inside the chamber, the water pass through a electrolysis and is divided in hydrogen and oxygen.

3. The hydrogen go to the anode, and is divided again in proton and eletron.

4. The proton go to the catode through the electrolite, and the eletron goes for another path (seventh step)

5. The oxygen go to the catode chamber during the dividing of the hydrogen.

6. The eletron pass through the catode and joint again with the proton and turn again to hydrogen and joint with oxygen, becoming water.

7. The eletron, before pass on the catode, feed the electric motor by the motor brushes.

8. The water, a result of the sixth step, go again to the water tank and it restarts the cycle.

And then, that's my proposed cycle of the infinite hydrogen engine. And I say another time, i'm subject to constructive criticism and troubleshooting to improve more this project.

PS: I don't have willing to put this project in practice, for now.

The problem is there is no net energy release generated by the process. You have to put in energy to electrolyse water into oxygen and hydrogen. And you have to put in more energy to ionise hydrogen into a proton and an electron. The energy released by recombining these into water only recovers the energy you had to provide to split them, and no more. So this device will not generate any work output.

Edited May 10May 10 by exchemist

No net energy release, as exchemist notes, but there will also be inefficiencies in each step, which represent losses.

You will also have to expend energy pumping stuff around the system.

Well exchemist, studiot and swansont, that's really a big problem to handle.

I searched in some fonts (as for example the ChatGPT) and maybe the thermodynamic laws can't afford a infinite motor, but, what if this motor wasn't infinite, but yes, so efficient? So, with this on my hand, I decided to redesign it. And, something I have certain, that's not will be the infinite motor, but the most efficient? Check that steps:

1. The main tank is filled with methanol (CH3OH).

   1.1. The auxiliar tank is gonna be filled with result hydrogen of the fuel cell, and will be used for a another auxiliar fuel cell of water.

2. The main fuel cell transforms that methanol in hydrogen and carbon dioxide.

3. That carbon dioxide will be transfered for a chamber, where it divides and become carbon monoxide.

4. The carbon monoxide will feed the auxiliar fuel cell.

5. The main and the auxiliar fuel cell will power a electric motor that generates torque.

6. A alternator is plugged in the motor to generate electric energy.

7. A emergency battery will be feeded with these electric energy and will power the motor, in case of an error in the three fuel cells or else errors in some fuel cells and the others can't afford the motor.

8. A third fuel cell will be feed with hydrogen (1.1 step) and will be feed also with oxygen of the air, forming water, that is plugged for cooling, after the water will be mixed with an antifreeze substance.

9. Hydraulic oil will be pumped for reducing the friction wastes of energy.

10. The water from the third fuel cell will be mixed with a antifreeze and will be pumped for cooling process.

That can afford one of the most efficent electric motors that use fuel cells, maybe the most efficient methanol fuel cell motor ever made. With a efficiency estimated in ~70 or 80%, and, finally, it generates useful work, that be afforded with a lot of attributes that can be used. Like propellers and what I want - jets.

Seeing it, I calculed how much horsepower that motor can afford with 33,8 fluid ounces (1 litre), and there is a table about it. Pay attention because the 3 last ones was with a efficiency calculated of 30%, so, it can be even bigger.

Litres per time	horsepower (hp)	kilowatts (kW)
1 litre per hour	~4,46 horsepower	~3,32 kilowatts
1 litre per minute	~134 horsepower	~99,92 kilowatts
1 litre per second	~8.035 horsepower	~5.991 kilowatts
2 litres per second	~16.070 horsepower	~11.983 kilowatts

PS: 16.070 horsepower is way bigger more that 9.620 horsepower, that is the power needed to thrust a Boeing 737-300, God, I created a monster?

12 hours ago, Heitor Silva said:

Well exchemist, studiot and swansont, that's really a big problem to handle.

I searched in some fonts (as for example the ChatGPT) and maybe the thermodynamic laws can't afford a infinite motor, but, what if this motor wasn't infinite, but yes, so efficient? So, with this on my hand, I decided to redesign it. And, something I have certain, that's not will be the infinite motor, but the most efficient? Check that steps:

1. The main tank is filled with methanol (CH3OH).

   1.1. The auxiliar tank is gonna be filled with result hydrogen of the fuel cell, and will be used for a another auxiliar fuel cell of water.

2. The main fuel cell transforms that methanol in hydrogen and carbon dioxide.

3. That carbon dioxide will be transfered for a chamber, where it divides and become carbon monoxide.

4. The carbon monoxide will feed the auxiliar fuel cell.

5. The main and the auxiliar fuel cell will power a electric motor that generates torque.

6. A alternator is plugged in the motor to generate electric energy.

7. A emergency battery will be feeded with these electric energy and will power the motor, in case of an error in the three fuel cells or else errors in some fuel cells and the others can't afford the motor.

8. A third fuel cell will be feed with hydrogen (1.1 step) and will be feed also with oxygen of the air, forming water, that is plugged for cooling, after the water will be mixed with an antifreeze substance.

9. Hydraulic oil will be pumped for reducing the friction wastes of energy.

10. The water from the third fuel cell will be mixed with a antifreeze and will be pumped for cooling process.

That can afford one of the most efficent electric motors that use fuel cells, maybe the most efficient methanol fuel cell motor ever made. With a efficiency estimated in ~70 or 80%, and, finally, it generates useful work, that be afforded with a lot of attributes that can be used. Like propellers and what I want - jets.

Seeing it, I calculed how much horsepower that motor can afford with 33,8 fluid ounces (1 litre), and there is a table about it. Pay attention because the 3 last ones was with a efficiency calculated of 30%, so, it can be even bigger.

Litres per time	horsepower (hp)	kilowatts (kW)
1 litre per hour	~4,46 horsepower	~3,32 kilowatts
1 litre per minute	~134 horsepower	~99,92 kilowatts
1 litre per second	~8.035 horsepower	~5.991 kilowatts
2 litres per second	~16.070 horsepower	~11.983 kilowatts

PS: 16.070 horsepower is way bigger more that 9.620 horsepower, that is the power needed to thrust a Boeing 737-300, God, I created a monster?

I suggest you produce a new list of your steps 1-10 but this time you show the energy input or output for each step.

But at least this time you seem to be achieving a net conversion of methanol + atmospheric oxygen to water and CO2, which will give you a net energy release. So that's a step in the right direction. 🙂

Edited May 12May 12 by exchemist

AFAIK nobody has ever made hydrogen without putting more energy into the process than you get from burning the hydrogen produced. If you are trying to do it in something like a car this is a really big deal and not going to be easily overcome since the extra energy has to come from somewhere. On a grid, however, sources that sometimes can produce more energy than required may use the excess to make hydrogen for backup or other purposes. This is about as close as we get to practical perpetual motion ATM.