Pangloss Posted December 1, 2007 Share Posted December 1, 2007 This thing has been amusing to me, the notion that Hollywood writers, who make a LOT of money (hundreds of thousands per year or more), would go on strike over money. It's akin to the baseball players going on strike a few years ago. Oddly enough, it hasn't generated the same adverse reaction in the media. I guess entertainment writers are more politically correct than steroid-chomping baseball jocks. But now the strike is starting to cost much-lower-paid-entertainment workers their jobs. This article talks about NBC workers getting laid off. The article linked above headlines the fact that the laid-off workers are mad at Jay Leno, because he promised them that wouldn't happen. But these workers are also seriously peeved at the writers for going on strike in the first place. The fact that some of Leno's writers are paid $500,000 or more annually also didn't sit well with suddenly out-of-work production staffers who make a fraction of that amount. Writers also are getting residuals on "Tonight Show" reruns that air during the strike. Wow! Can I get some champaign and caviar on that picket line?! But the real prize has to go to the picket line workers who started putting out video blogs on the Internet documenting their time and trying to get the story out. They're mad in part because they're not being paid for the use of their work in new media. But how did they advertise this fact? By using new media! Why? BECAUSE IT'S FREE! But they still want to get paid when their work appears on it! ROFL!!! Yeah yeah ok, there's advertising. Fine. Throw 'em a few bucks and lets get the REAL workers their jobs back. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sisyphus Posted December 1, 2007 Share Posted December 1, 2007 I dunno, not ALL writers make that much money, you know. Some depend very much on residuals for survival. Also, is whether they need the money relevant to whether or not they deserve it? BTW, I'm undecided about this whole thing, since both sides make a very good case. Incidentally, Conan O'Brien is paying his show's production staff their full salaries out of his own pocket for the duration of the strike. It's not relevant to discussion, but I think he deserves as much credit for being a class act as possible. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ecoli Posted December 1, 2007 Share Posted December 1, 2007 Except that Conan is annoying and I don't like his show very much. Could this be an example of unions getting too strong? Whatever happened to scabs and strike breakers? Or did Hollywood already employ the only good writers out there? It seems to me this would be the perfect oppurtunity for new talent to get picked up. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
iNow Posted December 1, 2007 Share Posted December 1, 2007 Maybe we're not hearing about it in the media because there are no writers around to... well... write about it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pangloss Posted December 1, 2007 Author Share Posted December 1, 2007 I dunno, not ALL writers make that much money, you know. Some depend very much on residuals for survival. Also, is whether they need the money relevant to whether or not they deserve it? BTW, I'm undecided about this whole thing, since both sides make a very good case. What case do they make? They ALL make that kind of money, Sisyphus. According to what I've read, writing staff for television shows START at $200k. The only writers who "don't make that kind of money" are the ones who are unemployed. That's why they're only making residuals. So if they're only making residuals, then guess what? They're not on strike! (duh) Meanwhile the "little guy" keeps getting screwed. The guy who holds the cue cards, the guy who aims the microphone, the guy who books guests, all those guys -- none of them make anything like what writers make. A fraction. But they're not part of an elite, powerful guild. So they're out of luck. Gosh, that union thing sure is great! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ecoli Posted December 1, 2007 Share Posted December 1, 2007 So why aren't the strikebreaker's coming out. Even if they got paid have of the writer's current salary, it beats being unemployed (if you weren't part of this union to start with). I find it hard to believe that there aren't good writers that aren't on strike. The broadway strike - stagehands - it's a similiar situation. They get paid pretty well to (over $100k I think). Why don't they just try empoying scabs? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ParanoiA Posted December 1, 2007 Share Posted December 1, 2007 I'm shocked. All that crap on TV that I can't stand to watch is being written by people making 6 figures? Let them stay on strike. Gosh, that union thing sure is great! Would be cool to see a competing union scoop up the unemployed writers and take their place. I'll bet they could take half the pay and still be tickled pink. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
iNow Posted December 2, 2007 Share Posted December 2, 2007 They ALL make that kind of money, Sisyphus. According to what I've read, writing staff for television shows START at $200k. I'm not here to defend the actions of the writers who are on strike, not by any means, but I'm not sure the above comment is accurate. They tend to get paid by the quality of the bits they come up with. The better the writing, and the more it's used, the more they're paid. Unfortunately, most writers contribute, but don't consistenly generate stuff that winds up on air, so this group (which I think is pretty large) actually get paid far less. When I think of unions and strikes, I think of people struggling to go from $5 an hour to $5.25 per hour in Detroit or something. This current situation is rather nauseating, but I can appreciate that this may be their only true leverage against the monsters running the industry, which is why I don't slander the strikers... much. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pangloss Posted December 2, 2007 Author Share Posted December 2, 2007 From the Huffington Post (so it's probably skewed left): Starting TV writers earn about $70,000 per season for full-time work on a show. Veteran writers who move up to a story-editor position make at least a low six-figure salary, with a "written by" credit on an hourlong script paying an additional $30,000 plus residuals. http://www.huffingtonpost.com/huff-wires/20071105/hollywood-labor/ I guess you're right (write?) iNow -- starting salary is only about twice what we pay veteran teachers in this country. How come teachers aren't included in this bargaining agreement? Aren't we all supposed to be paid a fair, living wage? Gosh -- and here I thought Hollywood writers were supposed to be progressive! Turns out they're greedy capitalists just like everyone else! Another amusing aspect of this is that the writers' guild wants reality programs included in the collective agreement. You know, those shows that aren't supposed to be pre-written! The deal also includes writers of Jon Stewart's "The Daily Show", often touted as the primary news source for young people these days. I don't think I even need to write a punch line for that one. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Saryctos Posted December 2, 2007 Share Posted December 2, 2007 Screw 'em, I'm not a very big fan of unions in this day-and-age*. They just aren't necessary anymore. When I think of unions and strikes, I think of people struggling to go from $5 an hour to $5.25 per hour in Detroit or something. AHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAH sorry, being from around south east michigan, I really couldn't help but laugh at the notion of autoworkers making 5$ an hour(although if you weren't talking about autoworkers I appologize for the misunderstanding, but in a thread about unions I figure you were aiming at the UAW) It's more around the figure of 28$ + benefitts. although GM is starting new hires at only 14$ an hour these days to swing things around in their favor a bit. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
iNow Posted December 2, 2007 Share Posted December 2, 2007 Thanks for the update. The mention of $5 was more rhetorical than anything else. I was indeed referring to auto workers and didn't know exactly how much they made (only that it was less than television writers), and since this thread wasn't about auto workers I didn't bother to look it up for accuracy. Either way, when I think of strike, I tend to think of people who generally face poverty conditions... and those people striking in attempts to improve their ability to feed and protect their families and whatnot. Perhaps this is a bias on my part... Cheers. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Skye Posted December 2, 2007 Share Posted December 2, 2007 From the Huffington Post (so it's probably skewed left): http://www.huffingtonpost.com/huff-wires/20071105/hollywood-labor/ I guess you're right (write?) iNow -- starting salary is only about twice what we pay veteran teachers in this country. How come teachers aren't included in this bargaining agreement? Aren't we all supposed to be paid a fair, living wage? Gosh -- and here I thought Hollywood writers were supposed to be progressive! Turns out they're greedy capitalists just like everyone else! Maybe it would be more accurate to call everyone involved here corporatists. A fair, living wage is more the rhetoric of socialists, and I don't see anyone suggesting a nationalisation of the entertainment industry. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pangloss Posted December 2, 2007 Author Share Posted December 2, 2007 No, I've never heard anyone in the entertainment industry suggest nationalization, and isn't THAT interesting? They're happy to push a progressive agenda at everyone else, but when it impacts on their own wallets, not so much. Still, I guess I'm not being entirely fair. They respect the picket line, for the most part, though I think they do that mainly for perception and self-preservation reasons rather than ideological ones. Blacklisting is condemnable when the government does it. When the industry does it to itself, not so much. If you want to work in the creative center of world's foremost movement to defend freedom and independence and personal choice, you'd better stay in line and do as you're told. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bascule Posted December 4, 2007 Share Posted December 4, 2007 It's interesting that the writers are so acutely aware of the changing media landscape... Hulu launched recently as part of a collaborative effort between a number of different networks/corporations, primarily NBC and Fox but also Viacom and AOL/Time Warner. The site contains a fully legal, ad supported source for streaming television delivered over the web (albeit currently closed beta, but I have an account ha ha!) Currently the writers receive no residuals for shows delivered over systems like these, or countless IPTV systems springing up. While as a professional programmer I find the whole idea of residuals kind of odd (I don't receive residuals for software I've written in the past), I've had the opportunity to receive stock in companies I work for, and that provides continuing value for past work. Writers don't typically have that option. I can certainly see where they're coming from. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Reaper Posted December 4, 2007 Share Posted December 4, 2007 I don't really watch T.V. so I'm not terribly concerned. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pangloss Posted December 4, 2007 Author Share Posted December 4, 2007 The strike affects movies as well. Incidentally, I believe the two sides were scheduled to meet again today. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Reaper Posted December 4, 2007 Share Posted December 4, 2007 The strike affects movies as well. Incidentally, I believe the two sides were scheduled to meet again today. Most movies out there are crap, so I'm not concerned. Very rarely do you actually run into a good movie in this day and age. As for the writers themselves, let them strike. The real entertainment will begin once I see people out there complaining about not being able to sit down on their lazy asses to waste hours of their pathetic lives in front of some big screen. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pangloss Posted December 5, 2007 Author Share Posted December 5, 2007 Most movies out there are crap, so I'm not concerned. Very rarely do you actually run into a good movie in this day and age. Says a guy with an avatar from a faux Saturday afternoon matinee! But yeah, we pretty much agree. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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