Moontanman

Yes Depends really on how much influence the US has world wide on the issue, I have no way to accurately quantify that, some countries have no real means or interest and defer to larger countries. I think there is reason to think the US has considerable influence on the stance other countries take on the issue. Other countries have their own agendas at the very least but "yes", generally the US has limited influence around the world even if that limit can be quite high in some circles. The US is not all powerful but the US does have considerable influence over smaller countries on many issues. It has long been said the US has significant influence on Central and South American countries in this area. Reports that indicate that investigations are often run by the US military in these countries but confirming that is problematic at best. NATO is also supposed to tow the party line but France would be an outlier if that is true.

There have been a great many leaks in this "secret" but they are all assumed to be bs because they are often so damn weird... as though leaks about aliens wouldn't almost certainly be weird by definition.

I didn't suggest the US was doing that, in fact other countries are pursuing this puzzle independant of the USA, France being an example. There have been some claims that the USA has influenced other countries, Great Britain, Australia, and Canada are often used as examples but I cannot confirm that.

I know, if not for @swansont I know I would have ridden "certain" threads off into the desert to be lost forever by now!

The scientific community in the USA, or to be more precise, the scientific community that depends on the US gov for funding, needs to support the scientific study and stop the suppression of studying the phenomena. The suppression of scientific inquiry of UAP needs to stop. I know you keep saying that all I have is anecdotal evidence of this. I have however pointed out instances that strongly indicate this, the systemic suppression of information is all but impossible to prove with one incident. The institutionalized suppression of the study of UFOs is part of the very institution that is tasked with the suppression and the study of UAP by the US gov... I am well aware this is classic "conspiracy theory" territory but... just because its a conspiracy theory doesn't mean its not a real conspiracy. It could very well be the suppression has to do with military secretes but at some point even military secretes no longer need to be secretes. Secrecy has become more important than the secretes it protects and this need to keep secretes just for the sake of keeping secretes has IMHO contributed greatly to the obfuscation of the issue. My first suggestion to a path towards truth is to stop suppressing secretes for the sake of secrecy!

Very interesting, thank you for investigating this! I'd give you a thumbs up but I'm out for the day. Did Ni ions play a role in this or am I thinking of another process that uses Ni?

Ammonia is still an important food source for life, at least in aquatic captives. If not for bacteria that oxidize ammonia it would be very difficult to keep aquariums... 😁

Don't forget about ammonia, it is thought to have been present as well.

The book was one of his non fiction titles so it wasn't a story, at the time I wasn't aware of his fiction work. In fact I a pretty sure it was the first of his books I ever picked up. I remember little from it other than it intrigued me big time. It inspired me to write a report in HS about a biochemistry based in HF as a solvent and the ecology it might support.

Nitrous oxide from lightning ?

Asimov was a professor of biochemistry he has some intriguing ideas around possible alien biochemistries, he inspired me to want to be a biochemist until life had other plans, lol

When the US Air Force hired Edward Condon to do the Condon Report, Condon Report Critique, he was quoted as saying "The real trick will be to give the impression of an impartial scientific study while knowing there is nothing to the UFO phenomenon" J.Allen Hynek, who the air force hired to study UFOs, eventually quit Project Blue Book and basically went over to the "dark" side said his reason was the the Air Force wasn't interested in actually investigating anything and actually withheld important info to facilitate their debunking and all they wanted him to do was find something... anything... they could blame a sighting on no matter if it was accurate.

Asimov detailed it out but that was 50+ years ago so I don't remember the exact details but I do remember his talking about that very thing. He coined it as a saturation unsaturation cycle involving fats replacing proteins. He also stated that a lung full of high pressure hydrogen, I assume he was thinking this planet would have a deep atmosphere, would contain many orders of magnitude more hydrogen than a lung full of our air would oxygen but don't remember the details beyond that. I wish I still had that book, I've tried to find it but it's one of his more obscure titles.

You should contact Livermore labs.

I remember reading a book by Isaac Asimov where he described a planet where hydrogen was the breathing gas instead of oxygen, more recently Sara Seager has suggested that hycean worlds might support life. The bio chemistry of a metazoan that breathes hydrogen would be very interesting.

So there is no information to be gleaned from old studies of anything else? And I agree yet this is not what science driven by the US gov is doing. France seems to be doing their best to improve their information by supporting the investigations. The US does its best to suppress information and investigation. The US has be shown to be guilty of outright lies and deception in its "scientific" investigations. And yet I have presented evidence of this ridicule, many times, Avi Loeb is currently experiencing this according to interviews he has done recently. His own colleges are engaging in this ridicule, the word crackpot is being thrown around. And yet the gov of France continues to do science while the US gov ridicules the source. Maybe the poor quality is due to the lack of rigor among the people who want the investigations to die.

So nothing conclusive means no value? Maybe in 20 years we'll have controlled fusion, we've only been pursuing this for 80 years or so and it's always just 20 years away but we continue to gather info hoping that eventually we will figure it out. Gathering accurate data about something potentially so important is never a useless endeavor. Ridiculing something because you just can't imagine how it could be possible is such a great way to figure something out.

https://cnes.fr/en/web/CNES-en/5866-geipan-uap-investigation-unit-opens-its-files.php

Interesting, I honestly thought hydrogen in the form of protons was the energy of the cell, I seem to be lost in the bushes on this. I know there are bacteria that produce free hydrogen as part of their metabolism and bacteria that use free hydrogen as an energy source and give off methane as waste and of course there are bacteria that consume methane... brings back memories of why I was so obsessed with biochemistry in high school. I love the complexity and order of chemistry.

I think it's interesting that different countries have different attitudes about this phenomenon. France seems to have the most progressive attitude with serious research being done via actual experts being employed by the government to investigate sightings. The USA seems to have to have the most repressive systems that appear to be geared toward ridiculing the sources to poison the well rather than investigation to find the truth... interesting how the same subject is treated by different schools of thought. Investigate the sources or ridicule the sources... which is scientific?

What is the significance of the H2? Is it fuel, waste, or something else?

I was wondering the same thing, when I first heard of this I thought they were metabolizing hydrogen but it clearly states that molecular hydrogen is produced not used.

Shit, I deleted the point before I posted.

A group of metazoans known as Loricifera contain at least three species that live their entire lives without oxygen. They depend on mitochondria like organelles called Hydrogenosomes. These organelles allow the organism to produce energy in the absence of oxygen, they live in anoxic sediments. Not considered uniquely evolved from a new organism but actually degenerate mitochondria. . Spinoloricus cinziae was found in 2014.

A marine algae and a nitrogen fixing bacteria have officially teamed up and the bacteria has become a new organelle inside a marine algae. The teaming up of nitrogen fixing bacteria and plants Is not a new (Azolla carolinensis) is one but the bacteria is just in a communal relationship with the plant but this bacteria has actually become an organelle inside the algae cells much like mitochondria or chloroplasts in other cells, this new organelle has been dubbed Nitroplast. https://newscenter.lbl.gov/2024/04/17/scientists-discover-first-nitrogen-fixing-organelle/ I am remembering reading of another animal that has evolved something similar that allowed it live in anoxic water in the black sea. If I remember correctly it was a ctenophore, anyone remember this?