rigney

That's why you would put a small latch on the bottom. A window that swung inwards would be very hard to open, and it would give the people inside less space to escape any hypothetical danger. The doors swing out on emergency exits in school buses. There has to be a reason they chose to make them swing out.

 

 

 

You didn't build that doesn't make Obama an idiot? I don't vote for republicans just because they are republicans, but because they express my views the best. I would gladly deviate from the platform, if someone was a better candidate in my eyes. For example, in 2008, I voted for a 3rd party candidate. Obama does not express my views, and McCain was a nut. If he won, we would be at war with Vietnam again.

 

 

 

I do think windows on a plane would be a great idea. So long as they only open above a safe pressure level, and while the plane isn't moving. Plus some other safety features.

If you read the following link you will have a much better idea why aircraft builders design as they do.

http://www.bigsiteofamazingfacts.com/why-do-airplanes-have-such-small-windows-and-why-are-the-tiny-windows-on-airliners-positioned-so-low

According the the 1st definition I found in google:

An idiot, dolt, or dullard is a mentally deficient person, or someone who acts in a self-defeating or significantly counterproductive way.

 

Sounds a lot like saying that jet airliners should have windows that open, and trying to get yourself elected most powerful man on the planet. It's certainly "self-defeating" and "counterproductive". I'm sorry, rigney, but I have to conclude he's an idiot. It's not just a strong word I chose to use. He just fits the definition.

Might Mitts remark be more idiotic than someone stating: "You didn't build that"?

Don't ever let him on a submarine. He'll want windows there, too.

I know your remark was meant as a bit of subtle humor, but a man of your intellect should not lower himself to such a level.

 

Would it then not make more sense to vote for a republican senate and house of representatives, but still vote for Obama because he is not an idiot?

 

You do have a separate vote for the president, don't you?

What baffles me is that republicans knowingly vote for a complete idiot, just because he's the only republican on the list of options.

I find it rather disturbing that a well spoken but totally misguided European would refer to Mitt Romney as a complete idiot, since he has done so well professionally.

 

Only for a window that swung out. But for one that swung in, or rolled down, you'd be fighting the effect of the better part of one atmosphere of pressure differential. And because of the tendency to want to swing out, you probably wouldn't design it to open that way.

Could he have possibly been speaking of a plane after it has crashed? But after most crashes it probably wouldn't matter much which way the window opens, would it?

Hi KJ, I remember you now, if we have to dismiss the use of the term god or almighty god from the question of this thread, what should we replace it with? Non- existence of a creator of all existence, maybe? Thanks KJ

 

 

I just had another thought, thus the edit, we know from physics that there is an ultimate overall everlasting one way flow of entropy, (In a total system) from the very beginning (if there were a beginning) whenever, that was, which must have been then at "absolute lowest possible zero state of entropy" or "total order". Entropy continuing all the way down into the eternal future, finally ending up at "absolute total maximum state of entropy" or "total chaos or disorder". If this were the case we would reach a stage where nothing more could happen for all eternity and existence would stop.

 

 

Thus is the energy in all of existence infinite and how can this be? This means that either nature is eternal or there might be a creator as of yet we dont really know the answer?

Since I am an agnostic Alan, you may not wish to hear my inquiry at all. But then, I’m not much of a scientist either. So, let’s just say for instance that man continues advocating: “There is no God”, until all religious belief is stamped out. What then? Do we simply continue striving for perfection in a world without an eventual goal? On the other hand, “What if there is a Supreme Entity, or God ”? But after pondering whether knowledge without direction is wise, He, Her or It; decides to atomize all life forms throughout the universe. Oh S--t! What then?

Rigney, how do you feel about extra-judicial killings, collateral damage from drone strikes, domestic surveilance, Guantanimo bay detainees... the list of things that should probably be part of the general conversation surrounding this election goes on and on.

Instead the conversation seems to be a lot of hot air on the right, and confusion on the left about why the facts don't seem to matter.

I'll admit I don't like Romney. That's not why I won't vote for him. It's his Reagonomics top down approach to the economy that seems unworkable to me.

As long as the conversation is about non-issues we probably won't get good candidates for any elected offices, just a-holes who know how to press our buttons and keep us distracted.

The Killing of innocence, whether it be people, animal or vegetable done indiscriminately, is a disgrace to any civilized nation. Catch phrases such as, "extra-judicial killings" and collateral damage are simply ways of lumping many situations together making the question hard, if not impossible to answer. To start with, just what is extra-judicial killings or collateral damage? To keep on topic, let us say that a vice squad goes to a private home suspected of dealings drugs. The police knock but no one answers. What should they do, just go away? No! They have a search warrant, so they kick the door open only to find the house not empty but with five armed felons waiting. Gun fire erupts and bullets beging to fly. In another room of the house a woman is lying in bed with an infant. A bullet goes through the wall during the fight, striking her and the infant, killing them instantly. Is this extra-judicial killing and collateral damage even though none of the combatents get a scratch. Who or what is to blame? And Domestic surveilance? I glance out my window to see a person pacing up and down in front of my home. Heck! It's just my neighbor from down the street. We don't talk much, but his pacing makes him looks troubled and me uneasy. I wonder what his problem is? What the hell, is that a hatchet in his hand? Holy shit! He's walking up the steps to my front door. No! He sees me at the window and is raising the hatchet. Sure glad I keep that 44 mag. in the umbrella stand. He smashes the window and steps in. When the cops come I try explaining what happened, but they don't want to hear a thing until they get me to the station. Somehow I will eventually have to tell Cora, his wife. And the detainees? They are terrorist and represent no country. It may sound cruel, but I'd chain them together, drop them in Gitmo Bay and let them swim for it. Much better that than being beheaded like Pearle or burned to death and hung from a bridge. Or just plain murdered, like those four embassy workers had done to them a few days ago. Old Teddy Roosevelt said it best when he advocated, "Speak softly, but carry a big stick". Pop always stressed one thing to me. Son, if you go looking for trouble, someone will make damned sure you find it.

This line confuses me:

 

 

 

You seem to be using it to insinuate criticism of Obama in some fashion. if I am wrong then i apologize but I don't see how it is pertinent to this conversation.

Had nothing to do with Obama. I just made a mistake with the time frames. Obama wasn't even in office when all of this was happening. He wasn't sworn in until 2009, right?

So you blame Obama for Iraq and Afghanistan?

You know better than that.

Rigney's position on this disturbs me not because he is ignorant or stupid but because I know he is intelligent, when someone who is intelligent disagrees so profoundly on a subject that appears to be so obvious it makes me wonder if i am missing something.

 

My father in law is the same way, he hates Obama with a passion, so much passion he would believe almost anything as long as it is critical of Obama. We cannot hold a conversation on the subject due to his intense hatred of the man, it is weird as snake suspenders...

 

This is not a reasonable stance, i do not hate Romney or Ryan but I do see the error of what they want to do, if for no other reason than it has been done for the last 30 years and it has failed miserably. Someone said the the definition of insanity was doing the same thing over and over and expecting different results.... What the republicans are suggesting we do is the very definition of insanity and to suggest they are the party of fiscal conservatism is just simply not true...

 

I want to understand... I really do... But i cannot help but think that much of the Republican hatred of Obama is based on race, pure and simple...

 

I would also like to add that there appears to be a measure of not liking the messenger means the message is bogus as well...

Moon, I don't hate Obama because of his ethnic heritage whether it be, green, white, black, yellow, or an alien from Mars. But I despise everything he has tried to do politically to save us from the: "Stupid Republicans". Of course I didn't mean that! Don't ask me why I disagree as I do with this administration, because I can't keep things in mind as some of you can do. Even explaining the wars in Afghanistan and Iraq, I knew the time frames were not correct, but thinking of the manpower used instead. My gut feeling is that if Obama gets another four years in office, we may never know this country again as it has been for the past 200 years. I'll just say that the Reps. suit me this time.

 

Rigney is clearly either a troll or too unable to remember history to be able to competently comment on it. No other way anyone could say the following:

 

=Uncool-

You're right, I screwed up the time frames. Here they are in all of their "GORY"

 

Afghanistan

http://www.factmonster.com/ipka/A0107264.html

 

Iraq and Afghanistan

http://www.fas.org/sgp/crs/natsec/R40682.pdf

Page 8

Since you didn't answer swansonT I'll ask, this means you despise Romney and Ryan doesn't it?

 

 

 

 

I agree that America would not bow to Sharia law, why do you think Obama has the power to bring us under Sharia law?

 

Rigney, you are not making sense here, your video was nothing but quote mining of the worst type. Anyone can be made to say anything with quote mining.

 

I know you are better than this Rigney, it's not honorable to use lies, or even assume something is true just because it is what you want to believe and bring it to a discussion about something so serious without some back up. I know you are an honorable man Rigney and I know you do not worship at the alter of lies. Why are you doing this? To rattle the lions cage because you are powerless to do anything else? That would be very sad Rigney, I think you are a better human being than that.

What lies Moon? When I watch that left wing nut case on the Young Turks, Lions or what ever, to including that blathering, blithering idiot (Mr. Ed) Shultz, I actually want to puke. Talk about lying, neither of those guys know the truth. The shame of it is that you guys have chased every conservative or religious person from this forum except me. I will shortly be gone too because I can't stand the total bias shown for that waffling liar we now have in office. But if the cobwebs of ignorance can be shaken out of just a few of the voting public's head, he willl also be gone, come Nov. 6. No mixed ticket this time Moon, It will be "Straight Republican".

You know, if this was a USA Boxing event, you wouldn't be allowed to throw dirt in your opponent's eyes just because he's kicking your ass in the ring. We have rules too.

What is this we thing? Are you afraid to speak without backup? What kind of rules do you have, only those you acknowledge? I suppose you are calling this preacher a liar as you do anyone else who opposes Obaba and your left wing leanings? If so, you have it wrong pal.

Romney and Ryan have been documented to be prolific liars, so this argument doesn't hold any water. You must, by your own admission, despise them.

 

 

How, exactly, has Obama blocked this? I'm sure that you will document evidence that backs up this claim. Yeah, sure you will.

No more than I can substantiate this claim, other than the Reverend's own words.

Rigney,

Is there any chance you will shut up about Obama for a minute and actually answer my question? At the very least, stop posting laughable bad editing.

Once again I remind you that, since it is asking about the previous right wing government and a possible future one, it has nothing to do with Obama.

Got that?

OK, here;'s the question again (in case you have forgotten, it's about the pay rates in the public sector).

 

Why do you think that a new right wing government would do anything more about it than the last one?

Even with your prevailing bad manners and left wing dogmatic leanings, I'll try answering your question. During the eight years Bush was in office many unfortunate things happened. After only a few months as president, some fanatical nut cases decided we no longer needed the pentagon, trade center and quite possibly our capitol. It took the Bush crowd some time and fancy dancing to eventually figure out what was happening. But after figuring out where the attacks came from, our military went after them. Now Clinton had left America pretty solvent when his term was up, so we had plenty of cash on hand to pursue the bad guys with, only to find out after some chasing that there were more of them than just a few airplane highjackers. "We had wars on our hands". Anyway, businesses didn't suffer that much. As a matter of fact, most actually making wads of money that the Bush crew spent like a bunch of drunken G.I.s on leave in Paris. But then we ("somehow"?) found out that Saddam Hussain was still pissed at us for throwing his ass out of Kuait and was supposedly building a nuclear bomb plus having a play pen filled with WOMD. Well, since we can't find ben Ladin we may as well go after this nut Hussain. The cost is great and some of our guys didn't make it, but our military put his bad boys to flight. As we were beginning to clear that shit up in Iraq, we find that ben Ladin is hiding in Afghanistan. Well! Let's go kick some ass. So we more or less invade Afghanistan, with most of the people's blessing. By the way, same thing happened in Iraq. Well, wars costs money, but Clinton had left us well heeled. So we really go after ben Ladin big time. Since things are going so well here in the states, thanks to Clinton; large companies and even some smaller contributors to the war's effort are making mucho dinaro. I'd like to think of America at that time as being status quo. And the wars? Except for getting a bunch of our youngsters killed and maimed, the USA is making money hand over fist. And Bush is doing what any good civilized president does; leading his troops. But since all good things must come to an end and after spending 4 Trillion $ in those 8 years, Bush says, Adios and leves SENATOR OBAMA up to his ass in debt. Now, why would you think that I would think that we will need another right wing government shortly? Is there anything else I might help you with? And by the way, we will likely be in another war before the next president can be sworn into office or before Obama can start his new term.

But you have steadfastly refused to tell us WHY, even when asked repeatedly. I conclude that you have no valid reason, only misguided and unfounded hatred for Obama.

 

 

I get so sick and tired of all the out-of-context garbage you try to serve up as evidence that Obama is the boogie-man. Every single one of those supposed Hannity clips are hack jobs snipped from larger segments, and if you even bothered to check a source like Snopes on the My Muslim Faith clip, you'd see for yourself what a farce that whole video is. There's a real reason behind why FOX won't air it, because even they couldn't get away with such deceit. That's why it got placed on the internet, where uber-right wing non-thinkers can pick up on it and stick it with the rest of the crap they pull out of their ass.

There is a lot of crap pulled from many ass holes, but every word uttered here is Obama's and is hacked or chopped from something he has voiced. I didn't make this crap up. But you might ask how I know when Obama is lying? It's when I see his mouth move. And snopes! It's owned and operated as a left wing rag. Personally I could care less if Obama is a Muslim or not. My concern is that half this nation thinks he’s the best thing since sliced bread. Now, to me that’s scary; “By God”.

When did lies about someones faith become a reason they should not hold office? I don't know what's worse. The assertion that Obama is a Muslim, or the fact that you think being Muslim is enough to disqualify someone from office.

 

 

Turn it around and around and around however you want to spin it. But I despise a liar regardless of his faith or lack of faith. A Muslim running for office is no different than a Protestant, Catholic Methodist etc. But if you believe Americans will eventually bow to Sharia Law, you're full of it. That my friend is pure ignorance.

Why do you refuse to discuss why this is?

As I told you, I trust a Romney Ryan ticket much better than an Obama Biden ticket. And the following is much more explicit than I could ever explain.

 

This is a video Sean Hannity of FOX News has been trying to show that has been consistently blocked by the Obama Administration for several weeks. But it was only a matter of time before the internet picked up on it. Yes, it may get me kicked off the forum, but these are excerpts and sound bites straight from Obamas mouth. I am not a Christian or religious person, but The United States was founded on Christian principals. The way I see it, from what I gather in this video, Obama has lied to our entire nation.

http://www.youtube.com/watch_popup?v=tCAffMSWSzY#t=28

Rigney,

I had a look at the site you linked to.

They think that Kenya didn't exist before 1963.

That would be news to my dad who was born there about 30 years earlier.

Here is a picture of a bunch of people who would also be slightly put out to find that the country they served didn't exist.

 

http://www.oldcambrians.com/Photos-KenyaRegiment1961.html

 

However, your decision to link to more baseless crap is beside the point.

 

Here, once again, is the question you were asked.

 

Why do you think that a new right wing government would do anything more about it than the last one?

Because I trust a Romney and Ryan ticket more than an Obama, Biden ticket, OK? Hell, I would vote for Romney and Ryan even if they were democrats. And please don't preach to me about respect after some of the garbage I read on this forum

Please show some respect for the rules of the site by answering it.

And Kenya? You evidently don't know the meaning of baseless crap. You just can't use the name Kenya when it was never known as that simple name before 1963.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kenya

We had 8 years of Bush and we didn't hang him by his balls, so yeah, we'll go along with just about anything.

If you think 8 years of Bush was bad, just give Obama another 4 years to get it done and all of us will lose our balls.

Check this out and tell me what Obama has done right?

http://obamafailedpolicies.com/

 

I have never had a problem following directives, or respecting the office of a senior officer/official (being ex-navy and all that). "Can you do the same?" Kind of implies that you might think otherwise, which is just a tad insulting. What have I said that would call that into question? (for the record, more than 2/3 of my government service has been under Republican presidents. That has never entered into the day-to-day performance of my duties)

 

But this isn't about having a difference of opinion. The problem I have is when you make an outrageous claim and then won't clarify what you mean, and instead posts non-sequiturs. I could post some drivel about how I hate what Romney did that time he visited that place, and how anyone who did such a thing shouldn't be president. And when you ask me for details, I post something that has nothing to do with my claim, get defensive and just chalk your question up to a difference of opinion.

 

If you aren't willing to have an actual discussion, what is your motivation for posting?

Some facts just speak for theirselves if you give them the chance.

http://obamafailedpolicies.com/

And Obama was thrown into economic hell at the outset. So?

 

 

As usual, I don't see what this has to do with anything I posted. What, exactly, are you terribly afraid of?

 

 

Thank you for confirming that I am underpaid.

 

 

Simply put: bullshit. As far as I can tell he just pulled all of that out of his ass.

Is that where the 2/3s majority overturning vote on God and Jurusulum was pulled from during the DNC?

The part of government I work in doesn't run this way. Creating a new billet is very hard to do.

 

 

And?

 

 

That's the federal reserve. What's the connection?

Isn't the federal reserve a part of our government? What a damned shame we have sunk so low.

There is no way to resolve our differences. My opinions are mine only and yours belong to you. The people of this country will be the ones who decide who steers the ship come Nov.6, not you nor I alone. While i may never agree with the directives given, I will follow and respect them. Can you do the same?

It's not just the stock market. Democratic presidents are better overall for the economy, over a wide range of metrics.

http://www.bloomberg.com/news/2012-06-25/democratic-presidents-are-better-for-the-economy.html

 

As much as one might complain about Obama, he's doing markedly better than Bush 43, whose mess he is trying to un-do. So I wonder how re-embracing those disastrous policies (or going them one further) is supposed to be a good thing.

 

Obama's score has no doubt been hampered by high unemployment, in which house republicans are complicit since the 2010 elections, as they have done nothing for job creation. Zero legislation.

 

Complaining about taxes being too high? Under Obama, the tax burden as a fraction of GDP hasn't been this low (15.3%) dating back to Truman. And the math-challenged want to lower it (for those with high incomes at least) in an effort to balance the budget. Johnny (actually Mitt and Paul) can't add. A-r-i-t-h-m-e-t-i-c

Bush 43 was thrown into hell 8 months after taking office. BUt here is what I'm terribly afraid of happening if our present leader gets another 4 years in office.

 

Look at these links and tell me; will 88 % of Americans eventually become wards of a welfare system having only professionals, union members and government agencies acting as; keeper of the keys?

 

Which jobs pay better, Private or Federal sector?

http://money.cnn.com/2012/01/31/news/economy/federal_worker_pay/index.htm

 

Who does things better, Private vs Public?

http://www.donloper.com/business-and-entrepreneurship/government-vs-the-private-sector-who-does-things-better.html

 

Private vs Public?

http://www.investopedia.com/terms/p/private-sector.asp#axzz269UbTfGy

 

Private vs Public?

http://blog.royaltyuniverse.com/private-sector-vs-public-sector/

 

Another interesting tidbit!

http://www.thenewamerican.com/economy/sectors/item/11344-fed-approves-first-communist-chinese-takeover-of-us-bank

[The really insidious thing about Ryan's claim about the auto plant is that help was offered to his district and he refused it, but that's conveniently forgotten.]

 

 

OK, I made that up. Why should rigney have all the fun?

 

Offered by who and how? The AP reported Ryan joined with other Wisconsin legislators to lobby GM to keep the plant open, but they were unsuccessful. I suppose it's something else to blame on Bush

 

Phi for All says: Heilige Mutter Gottes, rigney, do your research before you puke up this crap! The buses belong to the Secret Service, and they have about a 10-year lifespan, so yes, if the Republicans win this fall, they'll get to use the buses. It's a protect-the-President kind of thing, not a liberal thing or Obama thing.

Who authorizes the purchases, Bush? And the puked up crap, I hear that expression from most all liberals trying to allow Obama to re-build our government from the ground up "ALL OVER AGAIN".

Bless us Holy Mary, Mother of God.

We could set things right. We could reform our politics, end special interests and reform campaign financing, remove the waste from government programs while strengthening the ones that work, start a national health insurance program that allows doctors to be doctors who put health above the dollar, put regulations back that protect our economy from relentless business models, tax the top and the corporations at the rate they were taxed when the USA was at it's most prosperous all around, and bring some integrity back into our representative government. The real problem, rigney, is going to be convincing people who hold your point of view that we're not "bringing our nation to an end" as we're setting things right.

Phi, I wish I had confidence in the democratic party as you do. I actally research many things concerning both major parties, but my biggest drawback is sorting out the lies from the truth connected with just about everything a liberal politician says. Ok! I'll sure that I will be questioned on that statement alone. Things like, where is the proof? Who would make such statements? Let me for instance use Paul Ryans comments about GM closing their manufacturing plant in Janesville, Wisconsin that make him out to be a liar. Oh! But that was a decision made by GM long before Obama came to office. Well, he was right on one account; that complex will likely stand for another 100 years, just not as a GM factory. But now that GM practically belongs to the federal government and if, just if; Obama should get reelected in November, he may re-open it under a new name: "GM, Another Obama Bail Out"? Thank goodness that FORD is still solvent.

Today I'm hearing on FOX NEWS that the big unions who donated millions for Obama's 2008 campaigne hasn't donated a red cent to the current one in Charlotte, NC. Could someone tell me why the change? And yes, lets talk about the two big black $million buses for Obama's mid-west tours and the planes to fly them around in, all paid for by the middle class dupes he is trying to save. Will the Republican party get to keep these buses after they win this next election? Plus, I wonder who paid for the two week party spree on Martha's Vineyard, or the Christmas vacations in Hawaii? I won't even try tabulating the cost of either at TAX PAYERS expense. But hey! We can give them another four years of these liberal goodies if you vote right.

GM Janesville, was build in 1918 and later became one of the first Chevrolet/Fisher Body plants in the US and by 2008, was the oldest operating GM plant in the US. Talk of closing the plant had been persistent from the day's my Dad was Material Superintendent in the 50's in Janesville and while I worked for CNW RR, which supplied both Fisher and Chevrolet with most parts used, then building most all Chevrolet Models and Small Trucks, not pick ups.

 

While media an people seem to ignore the similarity between lies and deception, for all practical purposes Obama deceived the people in South Central Wisconsin, who believed Obama WOULD save the impending closing of the plant, which several previous politicians had done over time, delaying the actual closing until after the 2008 elections, when it did closed in late December 2008. IMO, no one could have prevented the closing as it and was well beyond handling a structural retooling to the modern robotic manufactureing model or said another way would have had to be rebuilt from the ground up and cost prohibitive.

 

As for who lies or deceives the ELECTORATE, most often for strictly political gains, historically Obama is the champion. Ryan's not even in the same ballpark on this issue.

 

http://www.audacityofhypocrisy.com/fashion-shows/

 

rigney, I'm posting to you while your still here and note I've seen many of your post, especially threads that have been distorted by the power to be here and want to commend you for you efforts. It's always a pleasure for me to see and read things from people that have been around the block, state what they feel and mean what they say.

 

I saw where you "earned" a three day suspension for this and want you to know there are others that didn't agree then or do they now. While I won't any longer post here if you earn the ultimate reward for bothering to make 1600 post over a couple years, it's been my honor to read many of your thoughts.

Believe me Jackson, 95 % of the time my statements are only thoughts. I leave justification for my ignorance to the more learned intellectuals on this forum. I hope to hang around until after the election so I can say, "I told you so". But as of now it does seem iffy. The three days I was awarded were fun after reading some the trash I see posted. Even my closest Mexican friends, all (4) of them; wondered why I got whacked as I did for my humor. But Hey! You can't please everyone. The joke is that, in my day Juarez had two fantastic bull rings, the Plaza Del Toro, or down town bull ring as it was called and the Monumental. There was no Running of the Bulls in Juarez until the drug lords decided it might become great sport. Thanks for the boost.

The point is not that he "tells NOTHING but lies." The point is that he's been found lying numerous times and that this speaks against his reputation as an honest serious policy wonk. Sure, some of those lies were "technically" correct, but wrong in the spirit of what they suggest... Wrong for what they imply.

 

For example, he spoke of the GM plant closing in Wisconsin and implied this was Obama's fault. The decision to close that plant took place before Obama took office.

 

He lashes out at Obama for gutting Medicare by over $700 billion, yet his own Medicare plan preserves those cuts! Further, Obama's cuts do not effect the benefits allotted to plan participants, whereas Ryan's cuts DO impact the care eligible to participants.

 

He cries out how Obama didn't support Bowles-Simpson and how he is monster for failing to drive it forward when Ryan himself voted against it and said it was a bad idea while he was on the panel that helped put it together.

 

He says that his plans will cut the deficit, but every nonpartisan and independent fact checker says his points are mathematically impossible. He wants to cut taxes for the rich and corporations, make Medicare a system of vouchers that won't keep pace with inflation and will cause out of pocket costs for seniors to rise, and he wants to increase spending on the military. He says he will pay for it by "broadening the tax base" and by "closing tax loopholes," yet he has failed to name even a single loophole he would close and even if we assume the tax base is broadened as much as absolutely possible it STILL would result in a massive increase in our deficit given what he's put forward.

 

Those are serious flaws in ideas, serious disconnects from reality, and serious examples of lies, hypocrisy, and disingenuous dishonest dialog with audiences. Add on top of that all of the other little things he's lied about... Such as claiming that he does not support Ayn Rand despite giving a speech in 2005 to the Atlas Society where he credited her for being his driving force and "the one thinker, the one person" responsible for getting him involved in politics, and despite mandating that every intern that works for him read Atlas Shrugged before they're allowed to work on Day 1. There is also how he claimed to have run a marathon in less than 3 hours, yet when checked it turns out it was actually more than 4 hours. "Ooops... Did I say I ran a magnificant marathon? I meant I ran a fairly normal one. I must have forgot." Runners don't forget stuff like that, but liars often inflate it. This last one is not a big deal at all, but it adds further evidence to the larger point that his reputation as an honest serious thinker is an unearned mirage.

 

 

There are more, too, Rigney... Yet you blindly cast aside and ignore all of these falsehoods and acts of hypocrisy and then on top of it you have the audacity to call *us* the ones who are dupes? Seriously? Get a clue, old man. There is one fool in these conversations and you will find him staring back at you in the mirror.

 

You seem genuinely curious about this stuff, and genuinely involved in the political discourse, yet you remain willful in your ignorance of the facts and unwilling to correct your thinking when you are shown indisputably to be mistaken. Yes... You're right... the sheeple in our nation are causing major problems for all of us right now, so how about you remember Truman's great line about where the buck stops and focus on no longer being one yourself!

 

I know... I know. This is one of those long thought out replies with many points that make you feel all overwhelmed and you'll just reply with, "I ams what I ams and that's all that I ams," or some unsupportable equivocation about how it's bad on both sides or frankly some other ridiculous unrelated, uninformed, unlogical ridiculousness.

You have such a wonderful way with words.

There are more, too, Rigney... Yet you blindly cast aside and ignore all of these falsehoods and acts of hypocrisy and then on top of it you have the audacity to call *us* the ones who are dupes? Seriously? Get a clue, old man. There is one fool in these conversations and you will find him staring back at you in the mirror.

Mercifully I have an image to look back at me and I do understand my inadequacies. But unfortunately, you are such an intellectual that you haven't a clue as to what your shortcomings are.

But these are the very things that you seem to support with your arguments.

 

 

 

 

The health insurance idea is just my opinion, of course. By offering a competitive government-backed (read "taxpayer-backed") health insurance, we let the market decide which is best, and with the least amount of change to the healthcare system as a whole.

 

My point is that anything progressive that's suggested gets shot down by people with your point of view as "bringing our nation to an end". It seems very simple to me, for instance, that we should adjust our tax structure back to the level it was when we were prosperous. Same with regulations that protected the consumers, citizens and businesses alike. Businesses still did very well under those regs, and the vast majority of the people did better also.

 

Your arguments are very vague, waving your hands at some kind of evil liberalism without any cogent examples of why it's evil. And then you bring up the extreme views of others, saying you agree with them, but when pressed you put your hands in the air and claim they aren't your words. I can see why Romney is your guy, both of your overall stances suffer when people bother to check the facts.

Since I personally don't have the answers that you do seem to have, I suppose we both will both wait until after Nov.6 to see who will be doing all of the finger pointing, crying and teeth gnashing. I've been hosed by both parties for 80 years, but you evidently have just begun to feel the political f-c-ing.

Misquoting or taking things out of context seems to be the liberal standard for getting the job done. Here is what I stated:

My friend, fear mongering, coersion and lying from either side will never get it done.

And here is what you quoted.

rigney, on 3 September 2012 - 09:46 AM, said: My point of view? My friend, fear mongering, coersion and lying will never get it done.quote] On that note, quite likely we have nothing more to discuss.

We could set things right. We could reform our politics, end special interests and reform campaign financing, remove the waste from government programs while strengthening the ones that work, start a national health insurance program that allows doctors to be doctors who put health above the dollar, put regulations back that protect our economy from relentless business models, tax the top and the corporations at the rate they were taxed when the USA was at it's most prosperous all around, and bring some integrity back into our representative government. The real problem, rigney, is going to be convincing people who hold your point of view that we're not "bringing our nation to an end" as we're setting things right.

My point of view? I'm only scared of what I find to be alarming. Friend, fear mongering, coersion and lying from either side will never get it done. If you actually believe your ideas are the best, go into politics and fix our problems. Don't equivocate or try beating on me over the head to slake a demeaning and demanding nature.