chilled_fluorine

Take your aluminium and make a heat collector which basically will sit in the sun and heat up. Use the fact that you will then have a big lump of hot metal as a source of heat to make electricity.

 

But I could use almost anything for that... And it won't consume the aluminium. I want to tap its chemical energy. I don't have or feel like making a heat collecer of any useful size. I do have a giant fresnel lens though, that could work.

Aluminum is not a good choice for making electricity, aka batteries. Its oxide forms an impervious coating which makes it hard to keep chemical activity going. Also the first electron yeilds 5.3 volts, the second about 3.4 and the third about 1.7, but the battery only produces the lowest voltage, so much of the energy is wasted.

 

When 'they don't do this', it's usually because they found out it's not such a good idea. And that is why you won't find Aluminum batteries at the store.

 

Aluminium batteries are quite practical on a large enough scale. Many chemicals can dissolve the oxide layer, and it's not even necessary. I really don't care about even 80% wasted energy, so long as I get some electricity and aluminium hydroxide that I can dehydrate to the oxide.

 

How much electricity goes to produce I kg of aluminium ? A friend and I were discussing aluminium recycling as a method of energy

 

That was a little vague... don't you think? I didn't pay for it, so I couldn't care less about how much electricity someone in China used to make it. Anyone know how I could trade my al for mg?

 

Solar flat plate collectors ?

 

What?

Burn it .

 

Burning it would make heat and light, no electricity. It's in large chunks, not powder, so burning it is pretty much impossible for me to do.

Well, I officially have more aluminum than I could ever hope to cast into parts... Any ideas on how to make electricity from it? Hydrated aluminum oxide would be my preferred byproduct. Thanks.

Doing anything quickly without adding power is a challenge.

 

Making caesium hydroxide? LOL

 

There's something else you need to worry about.

As the solution gains oxygen it will lose water vapour. Eventually the salt solution will be saturated, after that the salt will start to crystallise out.

 

Replenishing the water is no problem. The solution is ideally around 50%.

 

That bold part is something you might want to explain, so that we can give you a better answer. Do you think I'm "trying to synthesize an illicit substance" ?

 

See, as I said, if you just leave some water standing in the open air, it will reach equilibrium. It might take some time, but it'll get there.

If something is consuming the oxygen (microorganisms??), we have a different scenario. Of course. Microorganisms just LOVE to live in mercury. LOL

 

Anyway, the quickest way to reach equilibrium is to make a larger surface area. If the water is in a glass, pour it into a soup bowl, and your water will reach (approach) equilibrium a lot faster. In industrial biotechnology they bubble water through the bioreactors. If you cannot do that, then just use a large surface area. Bubbling is not an option. Increasing surface area was my original thought. The problem is, there must be a low surface area, bulky central container. The idea is to have tubes leaving to a high surface area tray of salt water to oxygenate quickly. It doesn't need to reach equilibrium. Any ideas on the design? Maybe I should have posted this in the engineering section...

I'm reporting in to say that I just electrolyzed a solution of MnCl2 and successfully obtained a plating of pure manganese metal. The solution was very saturated, iron cathode and carbon anode about an inch and a half apart, and 2 amps of current was used if anyone wants to try this at home. Meanwhile, I'm going to go convert all my MnO2 to MnCl2... >;D

 

Pics will follow if I get a large enough yield.

 

Nice. That's pretty much the procedure I plan on following if I ever need a Mn electrode. Not that I think I will. XD

Cooling the water will also help.

Where I live, the day temperature is almost always in excess of 35c in the summer. Cooling without electricity isn't much of an option, although I guess I could come up with a few ways to do it. Any other thoughts John?I want to expose as much surface area of water as I can, and oxygenate the solution relatively quickly. It's the design of the container I want to discuss. Also, does anyone know if mercury can dissolve air? Doesn't seem to likely, but mercury would be much more ideal for my application.

 

Pour hydrogen peroxide in your saltwater solution, that will go faster. Use some way to decompose it. Estimate the amount and concentration to obtain a bit more than said 8ppm.

http://www.engineeringtoolbox.com/ has tables of solubility somewhere.

 

:facepalms: Seriously? I specifically said NO PEROXIDE. Nice link btw.

The amount of gas you can dissolve is roughly linear with the pressure of the gas above the liquid (if it reaches equilibrium).

 

Oxygen in air has a pressure of about 0.2 bar. So, with patience you will reach the maximum concentration in your salt solution - the max you can reach with air. Note that obviously CO2, nitrogen and some other gases dissolve too.

 

To get an even higher concentration, you need either a higher pressure of air, or a more pure source of oxygen.

 

You can increase the speed at which you achieve your equilibrium (that's the maximum concentration) by bubbling the air through the water.

Remember, no pumps or electricity. The oxygen dissolved is being depleted very quickly. I probably should have asked how I would go about dissolving O as quickly as I could. Time is the issue... as it is so often.

LaTex is the scientific notation system we use here for maths. You know, I'm beginning to think you have a smutty mind, chilled_flourine.

 

Liar.

Wouldn't that depend on your definition of good and bad in this context?

 

Yes.

If you're sketchy on the idea of an oral exam, our staff parties might cause you to have heart failure. It's okay, though; Klaynos really digs that sort of thing.

 

Klaynos? Good things never happen when nerds and alcohol mix..."latex" is what tipped me off.

Bantering requires a friendly component.

 

 

Yeah, too many staff parties where you guys spiked the punch. I still have flashbacks.

 

Staff parties? I would love to see one of those. I was talking to hyper, not you phi. We're still on good terms, arent we?

It's a temporary fixture. Watch while I just as easily revoke your rights to friendship.

 

As it turns out, you're not my friend at all, you just claim me as yours.

 

The oral exam is mostly non-negotiable.

 

Really? I sent you the request, and I soon got an email saying you accepted. I could quote it if you told me how.

 

Creepy?! What do you think we're talking about here? You don't think...?! OMG!!!At this point, I really don't know what your talking about, and I don't think I want to.

 

 

You think I've forgotten about your "longitudinal strain" prank? My tailor still hasn't finished altering my suits.

 

 

It sounds like you're warming up to the idea.

Hell no!

 

Is this a new fixture? What does it do? Will I need to bring my voltage converter?

That joke was so stupid, I'm going to +1 you out of pity.

 

Mostly, as in, "I hope I can talk you out of wearing those pants"?

 

 

Mostly because you insist on wearing those pants.

 

John, what are you doing on this page? I can see your name.

 

Oh, *I* didn't take *your* exam? Is that how that went, was it? Is this just a cover for the ol', 'this doesn't usually happen,' shenanigans?

 

 

I thought we burned those photos and swore never to speak of it again?

 

Photos? Of what?

 

If the banana fits....

 

If the banana fits? What are you... Oh... OK.

 

Are we friends or not?

I dunno if this would make a good science fair project but an idea I once had was to try to make a home-made "laser image projector" with a laser pointer and a tiny mirror somehow attached to two speaker cones or some equivalent. Each speaker would tilt the mirror on a different axis. Then convert the outline of some test images you want to draw, into waveforms, and play it through an amp to control the mirror.

 

Lasers of course command a lot of interest from industry and government. All's you'd need is a tracking system, and a large spinning mirror and you could vaporize a human target from space.

 

Sounds interesting, but no. This must sound completely outlandish, but the winner last year did almost exactly that!

Yes, let's get back on topic:

 

And since the MSDS (Material Safety Data Sheet) says about ammonium fluoride that:

 

 

 

According to another source, HF might even form when you expose the ammonium fluoride to water.

The same source says that the decomposition already occurs at >100C (which is, imho, a pretty low temperature).

 

 

As for safety of putting this kind of info on our forum - I just plucked that off the internet. It took me about 10 seconds to find it. The second source is from the manufacturer themselves. I'm sure that if you make millions of pounds per year, you do give it a little thought. Btw, they do not sell it directly to customers, only to industry.

Would HF and ammonium chloride work? It would probably make some nasty fumes, but it seems like it should work. I still cringe every time I open that bottle.I was just about to point out what a runaway forum this has become, should we move it to the lounge?

What company was it? I know someone who owns some sort of PCB etching place, I could probably get it through her. Why she chose this profession? No idea, but it is a convenietnt source for corrosive things, except sulphuric, she doesn't use that.

The odds of just about everything possible are existent. The probability, however, is as hypervalent said: Probably quite low. I do agree, however, that full safety protection should be used just in case; I've heard stories about HF. And they gave me nightmares.

 

There were some idiots on an anarchy forum who clearly had access to hydrofluoric, as well as ammonium chloride. Just saying...

"Squeeze you in" Ha, that old one — any excuse to hose someone down with lubricant. (Fool me once…)

 

Swansont, this is really awkward, you have lost the tiny amount of respect I once had for you.Well, I checked my profile, and guess who accepted my friend request? No oral exam required... Yet.

United Nuclear! $10 or something, I ampouled some the other day. Still have plenty left for reactions, etc.

I wonder if I could reduce some rare earths with this stuff?

 

EDIT: Incidentally, how did you dehydrate your CaSO4? I blowtorched some of mine in a ceramic bowl, and it didn't *seem* to do anything.

 

Personally, I just heat it up in a furnace, or if I'm short for time I blowtorch it until its red hot. The temporary glow is what tells me it is done.United nuclear is great, but I try to avoid ordering from there. I used to add sulphuric and distill, but that's dangerous, and I'm out of good sulphuric now.

This is getting sort of creepy, so I think I'm going to find a different friend... A less creepy one.

Well, I need to get some sleep. It's late here. We will continue this tommorow, whatever it is. Mkay?

Alright phi, let's get this over with, what's her test.**** girls and their sororities, pressuring you to do things.

 

It used to be a digital exam, but some people don't appreciate LaTex.

You seriously hunt down people and examine them :shudders:, just so they can be friends with hyper?

By which I mean, I am kindly nominating Phi to be examiner.

 

Oh, it's bad alright

 

Good god... An oral exam?You know your not supposed to meet with strangers you find on the internet.Now what is your test?

That's my potential friend you called a turnip, whoever it was.:shifty eyes:

Watch "Spaced Invaders" to find out

 

http://en.wikipedia....Spaced_Invaders

 

"Who died and left you in charge?... Captain Bipto"...

 

 

 

 

 

Careful, I hear it involves being polled....

I think I'll pass on watching space invaders...Could her "test" really be that bad?

 

 

 

That's why the Trinitrotoluene award is so much fun!

 

What is this TNT award you speak of?

 

You would have to pass my initiation test first.

 

I'll probably regret this... Where can I take your initiation test?

 

It's that Nawth Carolina ayuk-sent.

 

 

Not really. I just voted 217 times.

 

Is that even English your speaking? Someone really needs to fill me in. Mods can vote more than once? Lucky... I meant it was growing fastest independent of the votes, I knew that was rigged.

What exactly are you referring to? I made but a single improvement.

 

Also, freedom of speech on a forum is at the discretion of the people who run it. And no, I don't.

 

I was just thinking that because you aren't an American, you have no 5th amendment right.You know what you did. Oh well, who cares. Hyper, would you like to be my 2nd friend on this site? LoL.Now no one will know how awesome the community thinks I am...