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chilled_fluorine

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Posts posted by chilled_fluorine

  1. Really? I heard he became a millionaire and moved to Beverly Hills.

     

    The actor who took his place certainly did. Not the original guy though.

     

    http://en.wikipedia....9_.28colours.29

    E173

    Al isn't very toxic unless you are unfortunate enough to be allergic to it.

    "Ebsen also played Fess Parker's sidekick in Walt Disney's Davy Crockett miniseries (1953–54), and was cast as the Tin Man in The Wizard of Oz (1939) until he fell ill from an allergy to the makeup."

    from

     

    http://en.wikipedia....iki/Buddy_Ebsen

     

    It clearly didn't end his career.

     

    Hmm... Well, I'll believe you, but only because I have no other proof. That isn't what I heard though.The toxicity of aluminium is sort of controversial. New research has been showing that it may be MUCH more toxic than we thought. Like lead. And mercury. And cadmium. And a whole bunch of other metals I could ramble about all day... The "light" metals can be just as toxic as the heavy ones... Take, for example, beryllium. Why do people tend to forget about beryllium so often?

  2. H2O2? What does it do, get catalyzed back into water and oxygen? Or does the wool oxidize? With 3% it bubbles vigorously, making heat and rust. With 30% it bubbles VERY vigorously and catches on fire (if any is still dry).

    Just tried the magnesium + drill today, and HOLY SNAP, that's a lot of shavings. I got a container very loosely half-full of these things, and they get bigger the longer you drill. I only drilled in a few spots, too, and the holes produced were very shallow. I might have to try this with aluminum... >:)Mg is easier to shave, in my experience. Don't expect it to be as easy with al.

     

    Al poisoning? I heard it was a neurotoxin, but not to what extent. Also, the exposure rate of aluminum in our everyday life is massive, from aluminum antiperspirant to aluminum cookware and much more. Admittedly, powder has some risks of its own, but the Wiki throw for 'health concerns' mostly speaks about how nontoxic it appears to be. The original actor for the "tin man" in the wizard of oz film almost died after using al powder to color his skin like "tin". He failed his entire career because of it.

     

    Should I physically dry the NaNO3? I have it with sodium hydroxide dessicant as we speak, with little action on the dessicant's part except for clumping together. If I recall correctly, there really isn't enough difference in hygroscopicity to make naoh an effective desiccant for nano3. Try a stronger desiccant, like sodium oxide or calcium oxide (both very dangerous). I still have to reccomend heating the stuff. After all, anhydrous sodium nitrate is much cheaper than sodium or calcium oxide. You could make the latter at home, however. This completely random, but have you ever tried to cut a piece of caesium metal? It's ridiculously soft. About as soft as butter, I would say. Any info about the h2o2?

  3. Mm. Should I stock up on AN then? Of course... Once the zombies attack no more will be made...laugh.gifSeriously though, the DEA is just itching to abuse the social contract. They could make it as hard to get as hydriodic acid any day. :remembers a day when it was easy to obtain:

    Ah, the magic of explosives. Fireworks are nice, but unless you're setting them off or 10 feet away, they're not nearly as fun. Unless you're in Pakistan... No offense to any peaceful Pakistanis out there, just the violent ones. Thermobaric weapons are admittedly quite fun. Until you start to kill people with them.

    I hate cutting through magnesium and aluminum to get nice turnings, but I'll try using a drill. That might work better (I've seen someone get quite a lot of good, fine turnings with a wide drillbit). I just hope the metals don't break the drillbit, otherwise I have to pay for a new one. You seriously think you can break a carbide or hardened steel bit with al or mg? Good luck. You need yourself a good bench grinder. For parts and stuff (except maybe anodes for boats) al and mg are pretty much useless without alloying agents like copper or nickel. Either one could effectively screw the reactivity of your powder, so watch out for impurities.

    I've seen lab reagent aluminum that was a bright silver powder, and the stuff from Etch-A-Sketches actually stained my hand bright silver for a time. (It was pretty cool, better than paint. Combustible, too!) Of course, the reagent-grade stuff was likely made by injecting molten aluminum through a very fine droplet outlet into argon gas, so it's probably still ultra-reactive and stuff. Get enough powdered al on you, and it will be so cool you will die of al poisoning... Try a quick soak in vinegar to get it off, maybe add a little peroxide to the mix. That stuff just cleans everything, now that I think about it. Atomized powder is spherical, and by nature can be shiny at lower particle sizes. Atomized powder also sucks. A sphere has the lowest possible surface area of any 3d figure I can think of (please don't say: but x 4 dimensional thing has less) per given mass, and considering the purpose of powder is to be high surface area, atomized is worthless.

     

    That NaNO3 is taking forever to dry. Not as long as the MnO2 did, but sodium hydroxide dessication isn't making the thing any less damp. That is the one reason I don't use nano3. The stuff is ridiculously hygroscopic. Leave a bit of it outside here, where the humidity regularly exceeds 70% at 25c, and it will be a puddle within an hour. It should come as no surprise that air drying the stuff here is not physically possible 19 days out of 20. I used to use calcium oxide as a desiccant, but then I burned myself, and started to just heat it. Likewise for AN. Look into making kno3 from bat crap, I used to do that with a little success. Don't expect much though. It would be cheaper just to buy it.

    This is completely random, but try putting steel wool in 3% h2o2, and then 30% h2o2. Even in 3%, the reaction is surprisingly vigorous.
  4. It might be a while before I go back to the hardware store, but when I do, I'll search for that product.

    The thermal decomposition of ammonium dichromate was discussed on another forum, but we eventually abandoned the approach as a route to chromium oxide because of the abundance of impurities. Washing the ash with boiling distilled water helped improve the color, but not by much. The way I have to do it is make sodium chromate, concentrate it, acidify and add an alcohol to reduce to Cr(3+), and precipitate the oxide with sodium carbonate (washing soda). This produces a green-gray precipitate, Cr(OH)3, which calcines to the desired Cr2O3.

    I took a closer look at my aluminum, and under the microscope it's not powder, but very fine turnings. *Sigh* time to bring out the old ball mill again...

     

    Turnings, how I remember. The neighbourhood kids got a lot of mg turnings, ball milled into dust, filled a glass bottle with it, and you can guess what happened next. Naturally I was there to see it... Damn bright it was. The cold pack manufacturers are starting to get smart and cutting the good stuff with ammonium chloride and urea nitrate... Stupid DEA... Watch out for purity, I hear they're making a new type with no AN at all.

  5. Yup. Checked everywhere, no luck. No OTC nitrates here but ammonium, from the local Rite Aid.

    Haha, 100% HCl. Now that would be fun to work with.

    Yep. Drain opener, but the point is the same. No aluminum shavings, either.

    I'll have to go back and check about that H2O2, no idea about the other 70%.

    No, actually it's pure oxalic acid as wood bleach. Very expensive, but I hardly ever need to use it.

    Vanadium pentoxide is the orangey-yellow, toxic crap, yes. Chromium oxide is the green stuff that's never pure and annoying to synthesize (raise your hands if you want to work with hex-chrome!)

    Here's a funny story: I was stocking up on HCl, NaOH, CaCl2 and H2SO4 the other day, and I go up to the McLendon's counter. The woman says, pointing to the NaOH, "You need to be 18 or older to buy that." So my dad, who's there for some rust remover (my fault for working with acids inside the garage), buys it for me. The woman completely ignores the HCl and 93.2% H2SO4. XD

     

    Anyway, back on topic, I'm remaking my aluminum powder (but I do need to melt some more aluminum!) This stuff is shiny, not the dull, pencil-streak gray of the previous batches. As for the MnO2, I have 4 ounces of the stuff filling a plastic container to the brim, and I'm assured of its purity (as I made it myself from pure MnCl2), so I'm all set on that end. The CaF2 should be arriving with the ignition stuff any day now, and I prepared some NaNO3 as a backup option.

     

    I remember the days when I made chromium oxide with ammonium dichromate, I had a lot of the stuff for some reason. It's definitely not annoying to synthesize. Light up some dichromate, soak in water, and there you have it. :raises hand: Btw, your aluminium is probably too course if it is still shiny. The good stuff is always gray. Why is fun so directly proportional to danger? The great question... I'm looking forward to your response about the h2o2.

  6. Live in the U.S., and again, unfortunately no. Don't I wish...

    The available OTC chems in my neck of the woods are:

    -Sulfuric acid, 78%-93.2% Drain cleaner? The only good purity stuff (low concentration though) we have here is battery acid. ~35% I believe. I just boil it. The neighbors hate me...

    -Hydrochloric acid, 31% I get 38% from the pool store. So many fools I have met think you can have 100% at standard conditions... LOL

    -Sodium hydroxide Drain cleaner?

    -Calcium chloride Here in the far U.S. south, we can't buy it, so I make it with limestone (very abundant) and hcl.

    -Hydrogen peroxide, 30% (haven't bought this, seen it once) I haven't seen this in stores, just 15% at the barber's. Would you care to say what it was sold for, a brand name, and hopefully the store you bought it in? I really need some more...

    -Oxalic acid Barkeepers friend, right?

    -Chromium (III) oxide, Vanadium (V) Oxide, etc. at a pottery shop some distance away Vanadium pentoxide is the orange crap, right? And chromium oxide the green, knew that.

     

    I still find it hard to believe you can't find spectracide stump. Have you checked Lowes, Home Depot? They have it in so many places, but I get mine from home depot. I used to make it in few gram batches with bat crap and KCl... Then I found spectracide. And nitric acid.

  7. Lemon juice removes permanganate stains and, in my personal opinion, smells better than vinegar.

     

    I tried lemon juice once, but I have to say my method works much better. Lemon juice never worked on skin for me...

     

    Nope, no Spectracide here. Instant cold packs, though.

     

    If you live in the uk, do you know if you can still get sodium chlorate as weed killer? Don't try that with the aluminium of course.

  8. Good to know about that permanganate stain cleaner!

    I can make potassium nitrate, but I'd be using precious ammonium nitrate... although I don't have much of a use for nitric acid anyway.

     

    Or you could buy it as spectracide stump remover for 3.99 a pound. 97%+ purity, nice and finely powdered. More than good enough for black powder and stuff like that.

  9. Well, it's a bit late for me to use 'coarse' aluminum... :P

    The ignition mix I ordered is the classic mix of potassium permanganate and glycerin with some Mg ribbon mixed in.

     

    Have any pics or weights of your Mn yield?

     

    Wow, it's been so long since I last made mn, I don't have much use for it... Anyways, I think I got around a 50 gram yield, that was one bright thermite. No pics, sorry. Took a while to make that al from foil, didn't want to waste my good stuff. I still say kmno4 sucks, it's only good for larger amounts, it does a lot of contaminating, and it's just not very reliable. If your reducing agent and it mix, then you essentially have a pile of flash powder, itching to blow up in your face. It's also just about the messiest shit I've ever seen... BTW, mix vinegar 5% and 3% h2o2 in a 1:1 to clean permanganate stains. This works on skin (finally something non-toxic), and pretty much anything else you can think of, saved me from my parents as a kid more than once.

  10. Luois,

     

    Again, your statement said "water", not "pure water". My pond is water. The air above it is the atmosphere. And it is in direct contact with it. I think by now, it is clear (no pun) and theres no need for you to try to change what you stated. My pond does meet those conditions. All the babble about what kind of water you [meant to imply] well, its too late. Stand by your statements.

     

    Pippo, could you please just admit you were wrong? Even if your pond has one tiny microbe in it, then there is no way it could be completely saturated. Besides, not all of your pond is in contact. Louis, you were right. But I didn't need to tell you that, did I? smile.gif

     

    Maybe I want you to mind your own business, mkay? If I was trying to make crystal meth or something, I would be with those nuts on sciencemadness. Nobel prize? No. I have personally seen oxide hydroxides in suspension, they tend not to be soluble for the trans. metals. Maybe I wanted to make a hydroxide that dehydrates to an oxide hydroxide in air. I really wish someone could provide a simple answer, not cluttered with criticisms or more questions than the poster has brain cells.

     

     

     

    This is a proof of concept, it is not necessarily supposed to be the best way. It is my opinion that biology is stupid. I find it boring, and less productive than my other pursuits. I enjoy math, and I didn't drop out of high school. LOL, top of the class. If you enjoy biology, great, I'm not going to challenge that. Why do you want to see oxyhydroxides? Not much exciting about them... I would tell you what metal I'm using, but then you would play 20 questions with me; are you going to make meth with it? Where did you get such an exceptionally rare metal? Do you want to make a bomb? Etcetera, etcetera.

    Yay! I finally got a -1!To whoever did it: I'll say it again, I think biology is STUPID.

     

     

  11. I watched the video a few times and I noticed the possibly important word " dry " being used. Not that I want to know very much of the theory of nitrogen triiodide but is it stable when it is put on the paper mixed with a solvent and what we see in the video is the dried chemical without the solvent being given a tiny impact?

     

    From what I've seen, it is very stable when damp. Use acetone, not water. Why can't you screw around with something less sensitive, like tatp, or plain gunpowder?

  12. If you add a little NH4Cl before you add the NaOH then any Zn ,Cu, Ni and a few others will stay in solution so you will end up with purer Fe(OH)3

     

    Clever... Thanks for the tip, I'll try it. It was mainly organic impurities I was worried about, but I'll try it anyways. I have WAY to much ammonium chloride. You're not worried about wether or not I'm going to make thermite? That's unlike you, John. smile.gif So you do think this will work, right? Seems kineticly fine enough to me, but I might as well ask the esteemed resident expert, right?

  13. I'm officially out of fe2o3. Would anyone like to share their favorite method of making it?Btw, does anyone know the price per kg or pound for steel wool these days? (not stainless steel, and in us dollars please) Thanks for any help, my "pottery" is really being hindered by this.

  14. I have some really dirty fe2o3, with little bits of grass and everything. To purify it, I thought I might dissolve it in hcl, to get as much iron chloride as I can in solution. Then I'd filter it to remove most of the contaminants. Next I'd add naoh or koh to make their respective chloride in solution, as well as an Fe(OH)3 precipitate. The Fe(OH)3 would be filtered out and rinsed several times to remove residual solubles. Then I'd dry out the stuff, and bake it into Fe2O3. Any suggestions? Improvements? Criticisms? Ramblings and equations about why it would/wouldn't work? I'll take 'em all. Thanks.

  15. Is the guessing game and hostility really necessary? If you want help, it seems pretty obvious that the best way to do that is to actually describe your problem in full so that people can help you better or provide alternative solutions to your end goal that you may have missed. What exactly is the issue here?

     

    Also, please have a read of this:

     

    http://www.sciencefo...cit-substances/

     

    Granted, the title may not apply to you, but the points in it are relevant and something you may want to read to make your experience here both more amicable and more fruitful.

     

    Also, staff or members living outside of the UK isn't the issue in terms of legality. IIRC, it's the fact that SFN's server is in the UK.

     

    Guessing games are fun, although not necessary. What hostility? I've already read that.

  16. whoa...and i thought i'd got all the replies i was going to get...

     

    before i read ur inputs, ewmon, thank you so very much for all this effort...lim really really gratefu

     

     

    ewmon, captainpanic ur inputs raise just the right questions, im experienced to the point of not knowing which questions to ask myself, therefore your posts really are a help.

    I'll brainstorm a bit, research a little more, and then come back to bug you :)

    thanks a lot,

     

    Regards

    The biggest problem with getting into business is getting stamped out by companies spending millions of dollars on equipment. They have the resources to produce chemicals very cost effectively. I would try to start out with something that doesn't need all that capital, such as logging. But you don't have forests in Pakistan, do you? Your countries biggest resource is oil, which has been effectively taken over by billionaires. What does that leave? You just need to answer that question, and you should be on your way to success.
  17. One more question and I'll leave you alone, is your metal in period 5 or period 6 of the periodic table? I think I have it narrowed down to two metals. I still don't see why that would be a big secret unless it was obtained by somr questionable means.

     

    I'm not accussing you of being a criminal, it's just that as an SFN staffer I need to help keep my subforum clean as liability law in the UK (where we are hosted) is a bit more strict than it is in the US. IIRC, we can get in trouble for giving advice to anyone who intends to conduct illicit activities.

     

    Imfataal,

     

    If you are reading, care to share some of your English legal knowledge? I can't afford the attorney rate, pro-bono please.

    Which two metals do you think it could be? I don't have a periodic table handy, but I believe it is a group v. It was obtained legally, no worries. Wow, I feel SO ignorant right now, I just assumed you all lived in the good old U.S. of A. I had all but forgotten how much of a pain UK laws could be... Sorry.
  18. Chilled,

     

    Did you really just mention that you had some exceptionally rare metal, then say you wouldn't tell us what it was? Yup. Iron does things very similarly though, what with all it's hydroxides and hydrated oxides. Any info you give for iron should be close enough. It's a trans. metal, not a rare earth, but that's all I'm going to say. Maybe it's zirconium. With all the info I've given, you should be able to narrow it down to one or two.smile.gif

     

    I know how to make all sorts of illicit things (I don't make meth, but I damn sure could), so if you are not doing anything wrong, why not tell us what kind of chemistry you are up to.

    I don't cook crank. Why would I try some complicated back route that doesn't exist when it is so easy to do? (not that I ever have/would) People that do that stuff are all too easy to find on sites like this. They talk like they're straight out of the ghetto, don't know how to spell, have the vocabulary of a 5 year old, and ask questions about lithium batteries and drain cleaner. There are sites specifically made for that stuff, so I don't know why they would be here, or is that what they want us to think? Did someone forget a question mark?:shifty eyes:

    Or else I'll assume you are cooking crank :)

     

     

     

  19. Big surface area.

     

     

    A chemical engineer can only improve and optimize a system when he knows the design criteria and boundary conditions.

     

     

     

    Are you sure this exists? Oxides are usually not stable in solution. They react to form hydroxides in water. So, I am in doubt whether step 1 will even work (making that oxide-hydroxide in a solution). The reaction is an acid/base equilibrium. If you look at the table of acid/base strength, then the reaction of hydroxide to oxide is even below the bottom one on that list, meaning the equilibrium is completely at the hydroxide.

     

    Using oxygen will not create an oxide. You need to get two electrons from somewhere... it's a redox reaction. You probably need an oxidizing agent instead.

     

    But assuming this will actually work with oxygen, in solution, I still completely fail to see why you cannot either bubble some oxygen through the mixture... or at least stir it. Your oxygen will get transported quicker if the liquid moves. That is achieved by pumping it around, or by stirring. And you need a large surface area to get enough oxygen into the liquid, which you normally do by bubbling.

     

     

    Probably not. If the water is stagnant, all you have is diffusion. That is a pretty slow process.

    Depending on your design, it might even be possible that differences in density prevent it from spreading at all... like when you drop some sugar into a glass of water. The sugar dissolves into the bottom bit, but does not really reach all the liquid unless you stir it.

     

    But your strange behavior probably means that you are either doing something illegal, or you think you're about to make a major breakthrough which will make you rich, famous and get you a nobel prize, which you are afraid of losing. Whichever it is, I struggle to help and my motivation is going down rapidly. So, good luck! I'm not sure I am interested anymore.

    Maybe I want you to mind your own business, mkay? If I was trying to make crystal meth or something, I would be with those nuts on sciencemadness. Nobel prize? No. I have personally seen oxide hydroxides in suspension, they tend not to be soluble for the trans. metals. Maybe I wanted to make a hydroxide that dehydrates to an oxide hydroxide in air. I really wish someone could provide a simple answer, not cluttered with criticisms or more questions than the poster has brain cells.

     

    Chill, chilled. No one's out to get you.

    Biology's not stupid, either. I'm not a biologist, but no one can say that any given branch of actual science is 'stupid' without me thinking of those dropout highschoolers who think math is useless. No offense.

    Ooh, what metal? I'd like a chance to see oxyhydroxides.

    I agree, electrolytic production seems a good choice here. I know, it uses outside power, but there's really not many ways to get out of that without chemical means like peroxide, chlorate, etc.

     

    This is a proof of concept, it is not necessarily supposed to be the best way. It is my opinion that biology is stupid. I find it boring, and less productive than my other pursuits. I enjoy math, and I didn't drop out of high school. LOL, top of the class. If you enjoy biology, great, I'm not going to challenge that. Why do you want to see oxyhydroxides? Not much exciting about them... I would tell you what metal I'm using, but then you would play 20 questions with me; are you going to make meth with it? Where did you get such an exceptionally rare metal? Do you want to make a bomb? Etcetera, etcetera.

  20. What exactly is your 'refining' step?

    I tried upping the current/voltage to a car battery charger, but I got black, burnt Mn with noticeable hydrogen spots.

    I've tried igniting manganese thermite for quite a while now with a blowtorch with no success. Ordered some good ignition chemicals, and I'm going to try to make better Al powder (from cans, not foil. Cans are pure enough to melt).

    A tip from blogfast25, a poster on ScienceMadness who tipped me on manganese thermites: Mix in a 1.11 molar ratio of CaF2 to every mole of Al used. This acts as a heat sink and prevents some of the Mn from boiling away (yes, it does actually boil. No, I've never had this happen for above reasons).

     

    A brief soak in certain acids, to remove al and al2o3. A battery charger is probably going to be too much current. I don't use caf2, I just use courser aluminium to prevent boiling. You can melt foil, it is just so high surface area it tends to become useless slag. Foil powder will work fine, as long as it is fine enough. Blowtorches suck at igniting thermite. What I do is use mg ribbon, or kno3 and al. They say the latter doesn't ignite, but it does work. Drop a glowing bit of charcoal on the mix, and it will sizzle and burn blindingly. That's the only way I've been able to ignite it, without in turn lighting IT with mg. If you're close enough to get it with a blowtorch, you're to close to want it to go off. Play safe.smile.gif

  21. In the time I spent bickering with you guys, the first batch has completed itself, however slowly. Thanks for helping to pass the time.rolleyes.gif

     

    No, but I am clueless what you try to do, and without any further knowledge of the problem, I cannot help. You come here asking expert advice, but you don't explain the problem.

    The problem is exactly as I asked: How can I dissolve oxygen into water rapidly, and with no external source of power? If I feel it makes a difference, I will provide you with more information. But I don't. Why do you need more information to answer that simple question? Give me a valid reason and I will gladly elaborate.

    You said that the oxygen was being consumed (post #5). Solutions of salt in water usually do not consume oxygen. Microorganisms do.

     

    Anyway, almost all practical experience with getting oxygen into water is from bio-tech, so whether you like it or not, you are gonna have to learn a thing or two about those reactors... Unless you want to tell us what you are actually doing , this is the best advice.

    I personally find biology to be stupid, except for bean plants, I love to tweak with bean plant genes... I also enjoy watching amoebas move... Strange, I know. Fine, you win. I want to make an oxide-hydroxide of a certain metal, so that I may dissolve this in a certain acid that the metal itself is not soluble in. Then I plan to use this certain salt for a certain purpose. (not synthesizing illicits) The oxide-hydroxide needs o and h2o to form. Care to provide an answer now? Or do you need to know my street address as well?

    I'm guessing that also here you do not want any circulation system (no pumps?).

    That salt solution is not going to move around from that high surface area to the bulky container by itself. And the oxygen will diffuse really slowly.

    The oxygen should move through the solution in the tubes very quickly, no?

    But as long as I have no clue what you're going to do, or what chemical reaction you want to achieve, I have no way to determine whether the system is diffusion limited or whether you're fine.

  22. Wow, that was ages ago. Since then I have gotten a much shinier plate of Mn by using two half-cells, with the catholyte being concentrated MnCl2 and the anolyte dilute MnCl2, a copper PCB blank as cathode and 60/40 solder as anode (eliminates production of MnO2 at anode), and a 9V battery as power source.

    I kind of wish I could build the plating up to a point where I could physically remove it from the electrode, but I'm still not entirely sure if that's possible with my setup. It would take forever, and I have to keep in mind that the cathode needs heavy cleaning with a towel every 15 minutes to an hour or so to keep that shiny coat of metal and not have it pockmarked with oxides and hydrogen bubbling sites.

     

    You can give up on making any real amount of mn with that method, at least with a 9 volt battery as a power supply. Step it up a notch. Use a wall wart or a computer supply, of course you still won't get anything worthwhile. I just reduce mno2 with al powder, ball mill the slag, then refine. Works well enough for me. It could be purer, but it's good enough for anything I need it for.

  23. For the benefit of everybody having a read here , how much electricity are you trying to make ? 1 microwatt second or 100 megawatt hours ?

     

    "I wish I had enough money to buy a hippopotamus." "Why?" "I don't know why, I just want the money."

     

    I just want to do a few experiments off grid... Gosh. I have other means of doing this, I just figured I'd make some al2o3 in the process, and de-clutter the workshop/lab. Al2o3 can be ridiculously hard to find... So perhaps I shall ask: HOW CAN I MAKE AL2O3 WITHOUT AL POWDER?

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