IDoNotCare

If I had it my way we would do it Bane Style taking over Gotham in Dark Knight Rises. But I'm sure they just mean to do it on a social level within the confines of their test group which I would like to be apart of.

Yeah wasn't the first link that was just corroborating what I said about it being in the Arizona desert. Excerpt from the first link: Phase Three To test its designs and proposals, The Venus Project is working toward putting its ideals into practice with the construction of an experimental research city. Blueprints for most of the initial technologies and buildings have begun. Fund-raising efforts are currently underway to help support the construction of this first experimental city. This new experimental research city would be devoted to working toward the aims and goals of The Venus Project which are: 1. Recognizing the world’s resources as the common heritage of all Earth’s people. 2. Transcending the artificial boundaries that separate people. 3. Evolving from a money-based, nationalistic economies to a resource-based world economy. 4. Assisting in stabilizing the world’s population through education and voluntary birth control in order to conform to the carrying capacity of Earth’s resources. 5. Reclaiming and restoring the natural environment to the best of our ability. 6. Redesigning our cities, transportation systems, agricultural industries, and industrial plants so that they are energy efficient, clean, and able to conveniently serve the needs of all people. 7. Sharing and applying new technologies for the benefit of all nations. 8. Developing and using clean and renewable energy sources. 9. Manufacturing the highest quality products for the benefit of the world’s people. 10. Requiring environmental impact studies prior to construction of any mega projects. 11. Encouraging the widest range of creativity and incentive toward constructive endeavor. 12. Outgrowing nationalism, bigotry, and prejudice through education. 13. Outgrowing any type of elitism, technical or otherwise. 14. Arriving at methodologies through careful research, rather than from mere opinions. 15. Enhancing communication in schools so that our language corresponds to the actual physical nature of the world. 16. Providing not only the necessities of life, but also offering challenges that stimulate the mind while emphasizing individuality over uniformity. 17. Finally, preparing people intellectually and emotionally for the changes and challenges that lie ahead. First link: https://www.thevenusproject.com/faq/what-is-the-plan/

This link is more specific regarding the Arizona test city, it's in a desert. A government is only as strong as it's people. If it's the will of the people, it will be built. Right now the first city to be built is more of a scientific experiment to test and or demonstrate he feasibility of it all. But it still costs money to build something in this modern age, even for something that's anti-money. We have to face the bitter truth in the matter of mass unawareness on the subject of free society.

The benefits of an oceanic city, for example, are the ability to utilize wave currents in water turbines. They are in my opening post, the very first link. https://www.thevenusproject.com/tvphistoryevent/present-indicative/

Their plan is to build a test city, and a tribunal park to attract tourists. I would definitely say they are government neutral, not being concerned with the nationality of it's denizens. At least as far as I know. Although they are based in the United States so I'm not sure how citizenship will factor in, probably need to be American but define government neutral are we talking nationality or the federal arena? They might operate under Technocratic autocracy.

The test city is supposed to be built in AZ

Well I can't see it any other way. Even if they end up demolishing the old cities in the distant future, but I don't see the need for the materials in the old buildings to be used considering we have so much more being made from manufacturing facilities and factories than is being put back into industrial endeavors (again because of the nature of the capitalist beast) at least not for a while. A lot of these cities are designed to float on the oceanic surface, even though countries have plenty of open land to build on. There's talk of Texas and California wanting to secede into independent states, perhaps they would invest in the initial prices of these new infrastructures in the distant future.

Yes the first projects will be built from scratch and probably won't include the transcontinental vactube train. But it's not a monetary concern, this isn't about money it's anti-money, the projects will prove it works and, unfortunately, since we're still subjugated by Arabian oil so we can lace Dubai in gold and rule by the Robber Barrons it will have an initial cost but I'm not sure how much their first projects will cost but it seems they are going to do an experimental city so that can only add precedence to it's pragmatism. Then they are going to build a park and make TVP more well known to the public. Furthermore these cities are designed to be retrofitted with newer infrastructure, unlike our modern cities. So that when the molecular replication of materials like nano-gold becomes more mainstream we can integrate self-replicating automation into something like The Venus Project.

Tommy Wisseau said it best, "If everyone /effed/ loved each other, the world would be a better place." Did you know that the male and female population are about equal, remove lectins from our diets early on and everyone would be pretty, another interesting fact. Between police under the pretense of anti-stalker protocol which is just determined coitus and the STD myth, I'm surprised anyone has sex ever. Then religion just strips polygamy from us which is in fact our natural hunter gatherer state. We take sex far too seriously, and then repress it beyond belief, and the result is death and murder. We need to get into the psychology of all criminals, and it has one root. We are designed for reproduction, we will take a sexual partner over food and shelter every time. Think about how no too people have the same response to visual stimuli regarding primary, secondary and tertiary sexual characteristics. The issue becomes apparent, it's blatantly obvious that criminals can be manipulated from an early age into impoverished or imprisoned status via sexual preference and this is the case.

This is just hired guns, completely throws off natural selection. And it doesn't work either. It's not polite to judge, imagine what they do on NCIS SPU, pure judgement. Is Jury is no more fit to judge than anyone else, God set up misery and the human response. Look through one eyeball, and you can't see past your nose, look through two and you can see right through it. If the electrons in our synapses are entangled than our memory is not local, and our senses and thoughts and feelings are one eyeball. At some point you need to consider the fact that police are really not able to do anything about crime. They do not prevent it. They just put a woman or man with their own gender and provide food and shelter. Personally I'm for mixing genders in a safe place where they can do what any person should be doing. I think the combination of religion and law is entirely homosexual in nature and otherwise pointless.

NO They should get out of our business and find another line of work I have NEVER needed a hired merc I'd rather die than let them capture me again. Deal with your own problems losers let God defend you and if He doesn't you're just a chicken. Anarchy

1. +y coordinate as a, +x as b, C is the found by pythagorean, we need to make C a curve so we have in quadrant 1 three x coordinates and 3 y coordinates, x1 = 2C/pi, y1=C/pi, x2 & y2 = (x1+y1)/2, x3=y1, y3=x1. Of course quadrant 3 is all negatives, quadrant 2 x are positive and y are negative, quadrant 4 y is pos x is neg (Did the math on that it works to make a perfect circle) 2. a 45 degree angle or C can be found by starting at the top corner of quadrant 4 and bottom corner of quadrant 2 and having C be crossing (0,0), so a and b are doubled. Then you can get the other diagonal through 3 and 1 quadrants using the same formula for a curve, now you have 3 dimensions and 2 angled slices of a sphere that cross at 4 points 3. We need them to cross at 8 points because we want to put 8 more spheres around the first one, we want 8 more spheres because of the fact that the dividend between the formula for the volume of sphere over the same formula only with r halved will always yield 8 meaning 8 spheres can surround one sphere in twice the volume without any of the radii crossing but only a maximum of 8 4. So you need 4 more diagonals at 4 45/2 degree angles between the two 45 degree diagonals, these 6 3D slices of the sphere that are angled will intersect at 8 points: these points can be changed by changing the viewing angle of the whole sphere longitudinally using (x-x/2, y) for quandrant 1. These points can be calculated where two slices have the same value using the lateral transformations (x-x/n, y+y/n) for quadrant 1. 5. These 8 new spheres are either closer to you than the original or further away, depth, we express this using y2=y1-y1/r over x2=x1-x1/r where r=C/2 all for quadrant 1. The instructions I gave for the coordinates of those spheres don't become connected to "various physical phenomena and equations" until gravitons are introduced. Which were tricky to put in there, because they are created by the collapse of the spheres into each other and therefore produce a net drag on them and each other much like particles. A system like the universe can naturally comes into form. Actually doing the math for gravitons in that way however was tricky. When we said that the x and y parameters of an outside sphere was x2=x1-x1/r (for the spheres touching the inner one at it's back half as opposed to it's front half) where r=C(pythagorean for quadrant 1 of the first sphere)/2 we were saying the radii of the outer sphere and inner sphere were touching. Keep in mind we are always starting at the centeral sphere which is why when we put spheres around a single outer layer of 9 we only need the two diagonal discs to create for points where there are 32 more spheres in front and 32 more in back relative to the original central sphere we started with. When we take the form y2=y1-2y1/r we are placing the center of an outer sphere at the radial surface of the inner sphere. When this happens one of the discs of an outer sphere & one in the inner sphere are the same x & y values at 2 points (found using lateral transformations), top & bottom. Saying top is x2, y2 and bottom is x1,y1 if where stacking in the quadrant 1 direction the center for your graviton is found with (y2+y1)/2 and (x2+x1)/2 and the length of your x and y coordinates in it's first quadrant is also found by finding the average of the height and width of quad 1 for the two spheres that are crossing through one another.

Technocratic autocrats should answer this, managers working in a specific field who have to deal with construction. An RBE principle is favoring the technocrats over politicians or even CEOs. In the case of the Deepwater Horizon oil rig catastrophy the owner of the rig had the last day, not his panel of experts, he drew up a scientific reason why the issue might not be what the experts were thinking, he got the last say and boom. I don't think economics or politics are the real science. The real science is in the resources available and the engineers who design ways to get it out of the ground and all the steps inbetween. We often fall short of reality counting cash. I say cut out the middle man. The most valuable resource should be the human mind, and self-autonomous workers can free that time for the mind to develop in an educational, especially considering the education should be a right. Instead of right to work it's right to educate. I said remote operators would be a job, now let's add teachers. But these jobs shouldn't pay because there's nothing to spend it on, the operators can supply themselves and others with a personal club if they direct their machines to build it. It's like using deep R&B for self-gratifying technological employees. Gollum Genies they are refered to. This implies scarcity, currently resources and manufacturing are hitting bell curve with industry, it's too much and most of it is going to waste. In the case of unlimited population growth however, if we indeed start covering the Earth's service in machinery molecular replication will become a necessity but in my opening post I linked a molecular nanogold video in which is the start of what's called a von neumann probe. Now these things can go miles into the Earth's crust, breaking apart any matter and turning it into materials needed to build more machines like themselves or equipment used for other purposes.

I apologise, let's agree to stay on topic or not continue a back and forth?

Thank you for focusing on the topic at hand but an RBE doesn't just account for the materials but assembly and transportation as well but in automated unmanned systems controlled by an operator (operating jobs that can be done at home in a very large network of operators worldwide preferably) in my version of it. The idea is to remove currency altogether and instead account for what will be needed. The extent of training for an operator would be knowing how all the intricate machinery functions, and then it's like playing a video game with drone technologies. A single household could build ten more while at the same time upgrading their own facilities. Adding a mall of storage to their back yard or recreational facilities. We have this technology let's build a grid.

Looks like someone needs some kool-aid. Thannks for chiming in but the constant berating, ban threats carried out by non-admins, and character assassinations are just derailing this thread about THE VENUS PROJECT and are very opinionated and off-topic.

Yes, originally in the first post I tried to highlight the benefits juxtaposed to how bad things are so I could paint a picture of how good they could. It's been an issue since I read about The Venus Project over 12 years ago in highschool and how the best option is the least supported or least known in the public eye. It's either a common first reaction of something sounding too good to be true or it's deliberately suppressed, Jacque Fresco himself had been working on these ideas, such as the energy efficient maglev vactube trains and smartroads since the 70s so I am very frustrated by the lack of deadlines this Venus Project still, obviously companies such as GM and other big corporations could provide some push but I didn't progress would be slow I mean for something so practical and, let's face it, liberating you'd think they wouldn't need to build parks just to be heard by the public. It's ridiculous, this is something often refered to as a utopia, and now there's more rioting than ever for the same causes as I've highlighted in this thread which just of these projects could cure, but we're rioting about symptoms involving race and not over class warfare. Which is even more frustrating. Homelessness is trivial now? I couldn't think of a username so I wrote I don't care. So what one member can neg multiple posts here? Lol, iNow is just going to run around negging any post arbitrarily because he is temperamental. Oh well, that's just a web design problem because stuff like that is bound to happen when you have members like that.

I am not concerned about the reputation points I just didn't like INow going from zero to 100 or the constant attention being drawn away from the actual Venus Project. You see what frustrates me the most is how great an RBE is and how little attention it gets by sheeple.

1. Another example of the Free Trade Catastrophe – the safest and most reliable product isn’t sold solely, not when they have all these sub-par products to sale! People will buy what they know; it is the work of free trade to employ salespeople to fool them. It’s one big circle. The bigger issue is how frivolous we are with money, and allowed to be. It’s killing us, and all money is good for is running out so desperation can mask incentive. Now that’s not accountability, is it? Self-autonomy is possible, that’s an engineering question and it’s covered heavily in Jacque Fresco’s work. It’s not like they aren’t using the scientific method here, they are more likely to deliver than anything our government is doing when they build their projects. They are planning on testing these self-autonomous projects. It’s actually highly pragmatic; 2. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=__EoOvVkEMo Do you mean this self-driving car? We could have had flying cars quite some time ago, this is one of the older and more seamless ones: http://randolphlalonde.blogspot.com/2012/09/wheres-my-flying-car-broadcast-4-one.html But there is better technology employed in Venus Project designs which are clearly laid out for those members who wish to do a little extra research and I will provide their maglev vactrain, subterranean, transcontinental, which connects not just a city but the world at large using 2% of the cost of the fuel planes use as a public transportation system. He also has self-driving cars but they work a little differently than those limited by disorganized roadways and overall inefficient traffic system. They run on what one could call “smartroads” which is like the smartphone to the phone. Wow, don’t you just love putting the modern scheme out of business with a Venus City? But now with molecular replication and mechanical DNA devices I’m convinced that a vonn neumonn probe could just mine the crust into a planet swarming, within every inch, with self-autonomous systems. 3. That’s the point; we want more engineers and less public service and sales, we want to make it so no monotonous job is possible to get. “Also, if you want to propose communism” WHHHHAA—I didn’t say that. I know it’s custom throw communism at ideas that you don’t like but I said that modern politics are more similar to communism than an RBE if anything. You have to pump money into the system, but you are not all allowed education. That’s communism, that’s the Left, that’s the Right, that’s universal in all countries. You HAVE to pay taxes. You see an RBE is so radically liberating that none of these are requirements enforced by gunpoint. I regress, we aren’t forced to work at gunpoint directly because they trick you, you see, they knock off Maslow’s first tier of most basic needs and then get a criminal to resist so they can kill ‘em. That’s far more similar to communism than an RBE, that’s capitalism. If ownership were such an issue to the point where you have to barter with your government for basic needs you’d think that Murrrcah! should employ the communistic method of limiting the population so housing isn’t such an issue but unfortunately our system falls short of communism in that regard. The Venus Project proposes the idea of usership instead, wherein basic needs are provided and a headcount of projected population growth is accounted for in time to provide it instead of limiting the population, another case where an RBE is more unlike communism and yet better. We don’t actually own anything, not a single piece of that thing, and neither does our government, and it’s just there. If a basic necessity is needed to be used we have what’s called usership, no need to own anything because there’s plenty to go around. The wonders of modern technology handled intelligently and considerately instead of thrown in the trash because of free trade’s lack of accountability.

Will you and your two alternate accounts stop trying to draw away from the topic of discussion PLEASE? Anyway a self-autonomous socioeconomic grid has never been done before, this is HUGE. Why aren't more people talking about it? This needs to be done. We should have had the Projects like these housing our poor DECADES AGO. Why? I'm asking the members here, why? Well I'll tell you why, every single person under the upper middle class would migrate into these projects. Normally when we think of projects we think ghetto, but these are NICE. No one, and I mean no one, would support GM anymore, the wealthy, everyone above the middle middle class would vanish. And rich people do like their servants. We need to not occupy wallstreet, we need the police to step aside and let us give to those who have it coming to them. I bet another half-decade like this and you will see a civilian coalition of impoverished start taking homes and giving home owners the boot. We will outnumber them anyway. The situation grows more serious than you and your alts might think. It might be me kicking you out of your own home, I'm a fighter, are you? Have you ever been in a real fight to death? Do you think you deserve a home and another does not? Because you're a bootlicker? Like it or not war is coming and your only way out is Venus Project. I would say they should have arrested me for attacking them. But I can collate just as well with inmates.

1. Excerpt copied (and edited) from the Venus Project site: "A Resource-Based Economy is a system in which all goods and services are available without the use of any system of debt or servitude like money, credits or barter. All resources become the common heritage of all people[1], not just a select few. The premise upon which this system is based is that the Earth is abundant with plentiful resource; our practice of rationing resources[2] through monetary methods[3] is irrelevant and counter productive to our survival. Money is only important in a society when certain resources for survival must be rationed and the people accept money as an exchange medium for the scarce resources.[4] Money[5] is a social convention, an agreement if you will. It is neither a natural resource nor does it represent one. It is not necessary for survival unless we have been conditioned to accept it as such." [6] 2. "when futurists refer to ‘resource based economics’ today, in a post-industrial context, they’re usually talking about systems where global resources are managed rather like municipal utilities and as a result currencies become redundant. No one ‘owns’ water. Communities create facilities for its collection and distribution as a public utility. Imagine that all resources and many commodities were treated this same way and you have part of the picture of what a resource based economy means. Such systems are anticipated to evolve from global digital networked market systems that become ‘commoditized’ by the trends in decentralization of production. In other words, because production is local, markets stop trading in finished products and labor and start dealing in a broad spectrum of commodities in increasingly fractionalized unit volumes evolving toward just the Periodic Table plus energy. Soon they become so efficient -as commodities markets tend to if left to their own devices- that they come to ‘know’ in an algorithmic sense the full extent of world resources and demand and their respective cycles and ‘bandwidth’, eliminate currency as a metric of market values by allowing resource values to be indexed relative to each other, and eliminate profit and speculation by compelling capitulation (the tendency of participants in a market to conform collectively to its trends) and driving the market toward equilibrium. At this point the system stops being a market for resources and commodities and becomes an Internet (an open-Internet) for them instead, compelling the relinquishing of individual control of resources and the management of their exploitation to the system itself as a world utility driven by demand. The result is a money-less society where all resources are free, within reason, and distributed automatically in response to demand. This is what futurist Jacque Fresco has dubbed Cybernation; world resources managed as a global societal commons by a demand-driven computer-based world utility."[7] 3. Rene Muller: "The Resource-based Economy (RBE) concepts propose a way to abandon money and the speculation with it; and get back to resources directly without the involvement of money as a regulatory tool. It assumes that with today's technology it would be possible to measure and store the quantity of a certain good, and connect with the demand or requirement side and share the resources, and skip the speculative and profit aspect in the exchange. The term itself "Resource-based Economy" was adapted from The Antigonish Movement of Canada's Resource Based Communities concept and later reintroduced by Jacques Fresco, who also initiated The Venus Project (TVP), the term was then adapted by other groups, such as The Zeitgeist Movement (TZM), People 4 Social Sustainability (PSS), The Resource Based Economy Foundation, and The Technocracy Movement. A brief explanation of RBE: "A Resource-Based Economy is a system in which all goods and services are available without the use of money, credits, barter or any other system of debt or servitude. All resources become the common heritage of all of the inhabitants, not just a select few. The premise upon which this system is based is that the Earth is abundant with plentiful resources; our practice of rationing resources through monetary methods is irrelevant and counter productive to our survival."[8] Another key element: Abundance, Efficiency and Sustainability are, very simply, the enemies of profit. This scarcity logic also applies to the quality of goods. The idea of creating something that could last, say, a lifetime with little repair, is anathema to the market system, for it reduces consumption rates, which slows growth and creates systemic repercussions (loss of jobs, etc.). The scarcity attribute of the market system is nothing but detrimental for these reasons, not to mention that it doesn't even serve the role of efficient resource preservation, which is often claimed.[9] RBE is promoted by various groups and might differ in the details but agree on the following: common holding of land by the people common holding of the means of production common holding of the resources common distribution of consumables / goods / commodities and so on automation of the manufacturing process i.e. resources into semi-consumables and semi-consumables into consumables beyond the use of money, credit, barter, exchange, and all forms of interest bearing debt post-scarcity system of shared social abundance Resource-based Economy (RBE) emphasizes the availability of the resource itself and proposes to abandon money as a value system, and value the resource directly (how this is done in detail is not explained). It assumes all resource-based needs can be satisfied with the technological achievement we made as humans. It certainly addresses the issue of survival conditions which we as humans developed in early times, and which are now no longer useful; hence, developing an awareness and consciousness of sufficiency or even abundance and away from scarcity."[10] Typology of RBE Movements Humanistic RBE Rene Muller: "As pointed out above, the TVP and TZM view on RBE is a rather mechanistic and technocratic solution, and lacks some of the humanistic, spiritual and holistic perspectives, fortunately there are also other groups who work on developing RBE further with a large scope, like The Resourcebased Economy.com: As there is a lot of talk about technology, design, architecture and the like this website (TheResourcebasedEconomy.com) tries to discuss the term ‘resource based economy’ from a human perspective based on existing and possible future values on this planet. When this website was formed, one found almost nothing about a resource based economy online in spite of the websites of The Venus Project and The Zeitgeist Movement. This site was made to remedy that. Still, the term ‘resource based economy’ can be replaced/overlapped by many other terms. Resource based economy (RBE), Natural Resources Economy, Resource Economy, Moneyless Economy (MLE), Love Eased Economy (LBE), Gift Economy (GE), Priceless Economic System (PES), Trust Economy (TE), Sharing Society, Resource Based Society, Moneyless Society, Love Based Society, etc. etc. It is all the same thing. It doesn’t really matter what we call it, as long as it has the basic notion of an economic system where no money is used, ownership and trade is abandoned and replaced with usership and giving and all resources (both human and planetary) are shared and managed properly. On this site we will mainly use the term Resource Based Economy. We could add ‘Gift’ in the title (Resource Based Gift Economy), to emphasize that on a local micro level, we need to simply give and share our personal resources, while we at the same time, on a global macro level, manage global resources. (from The Resource-based Economy.com: About) A simple definition for RBE from the same web-site: It further addresses the mindset and the consciousness to live in such a RBE system: RBE is not an ‘establishment of a system’, but rather the emergence of a system, coming from it’s citizens and not from any ‘rulers’, as there are no rulers in RBE. That it is an emergent system is crucial to understand. It is not a top down system, but a bottom up system based on a shift in mindset of the population.[11] And specifically speaks of a continual emergence of a system of self imposed management of human and natural resources both locally and globally where the following happens: money is replaced by gratitude trading is replaced by sharing and ownership is replaced by usership ... in a way where everyone’s needs are met. Currently responsibility and ownership are closely tied together; in other words, you care about things you own; things you don't own you don't usually care, even avoid to get involved because it's considered "none of my business". In a RBE system, where there is no or little individual ownership but owned by the collective, the responsibility and the will to take care of and maintain things would be entirely new: you care for the things you use, but don't personally own. As described in the Gift Economy, a sense of family and intimacy among those who share things to use and not own privately has to emerge."[12] Directivist RBE Rene Muller: "People 4 Social Sustainability (PSS) also has picked up (August 2011) the term from its predecessor "The Promethean Workers Association (PWA)" a movement that drew ideas largely from Robert Anton Wilson's "Prometheus Rising" and on Gnosticism, Discordianism, Metaphysics, and RBE that publically accepted neophytes/ initiates as a movement/ tradition from 2004-2010. PSS adapted PWA's version of RBE and separated it from the more mystical tradition based New Aeon view's of The PWA. The Directivist RBE was then defined beyond its initial purely mystical basis as a more idealistic and philosophical view point with an open and secular spiritual view point: An economic system based on direct-common ownership of land, resources, production, distribution, and allocation, characterized through non-usury (monetary) intelligent management of resources for common consumer social abundance rather than profit-based scarcity (Capitalism) or need-based scarcity (Socialism). A gift economy in which the need for money, barters, or exchange is surpassed by the development of advanced earth-based technologies. A post-scarcity society in which shared social abundance replaces the implied and artificial social notions of resource scarcity. (In Directivist Theory) An essential third way post-monetary developmental stage achieved through the abolishment of state-property-centered and private-property-centered economic systems. A) An application of alchemy towards the solving of social problems with earth based technology. B) A guaranteed focus on the spiritual transcendence of society towards ascension and greater heights of spiritual understanding. C) Guaranteed direct access by all to the means of all necessary production D) Directly Democratic and technical assisted facilitation of resource management, utilization, and distribution. E) Election of Alchemists to develop ways to relieve society from the burdens of menial labor and allow all members of society to engage in creative, fulfilling social endeavors F) Use of Energy Credits to track renewability of resources and give a share of social abundance to everyone" (http://occupyconcepts.org/wiki/Resource-based_Economy) Interviews 1 1. Interview of Stephanie Smith, founder of the We Commune software project, by Allison Arieff of Shareable magazine:[13] Interview: “AA: Explain the idea of the Third Economy. SS: The Third Economy is a group-based resource-sharing economy. I coined the term in order to give shape to the informal exchanges that are beginning to happen as a result of the failures of the first (cash) and second (credit) economies. Economies are constructs (Visa created/implemented the credit economy with the help of Madison Avenue ‘Mad Men’ about 50 years ago). I think it’s time to work together to build a new one; one with a different set of underlying values that are more in tune with our times, and one that is built from the bottom up by people who have intimate knowledge of, and experience with, the needs and desires of their local communities. Allison Arieff: I think it’s so important to develop online strategies that extend to offline. Tell us about the tools you’re creating, and how they might start to take shape on the street. Stephanie Smith: The first tools we’ll launch over the next six months or so include a Facebook app that helps users post and manage a “share,” barter or group barter (i.e., a dog walking club or childcare co-op), and a digital bulletin board tool that people working in cafes and co-working environments can use to post real-time resource-sharing opportunities. A third tool we’re working on is a surplus re-allocation tool designed for urban districts that allows anyone to create a free shelf, box, table, or room, and add it to a map so that others can find and use it; they can take something, leave something, or both. AA: There’s a lot of this share/trade/barter stuff happening now, especially in more progressive cities like Portland and San Francisco. Is there hope for this sort of momentum elsewhere? SS: I’m always excited when progressive people in urban centers pioneer new approaches. We’re watching, participating and learning from many of these pioneers, especially on the west coast. What’s interesting about the Third Economy, however, is that it’s happening informally across America, in cities, suburbs and rural areas, as people confront our new economic reality. For instance, the numerous childcare co-ops and wholesale buying clubs that are started by average folks every day to get some of their economic needs met in a group format. The best way to build on this momentum, both among pioneers in progressive urban centers, and by average people across America, is to make these informal resource-sharing behaviors one notch more formal. Give them a name – Third Economy, and let people know that when they share resources as a group in order to save money and build deeper community, they’re actually participating in a structured, economic system that has value and meaning.”[14] 2 Singularity Utopia (SU) of Singularity-2045.org interviewed by René K. Müller (RKM) of OccupyConcepts.org on October 10-18, 2012. * How do you define RBE and how do you think it differs from Post-Scarcity? RKM: Take a look at Resource-based Economy where I summarized some of the key issues, and also formulated the criticism. SU: This is where I disagree strongly with RBE advocates, when they say we already have enough resources. They say scarcity is merely a distribution/greed issue. While I fully recognise the 1% make things a lot worse for the majority, compared to how things could be, I am sure, looking at all factors, that we cannot have Post-Scarcity merely by having better distribution; thus things will not be free with better distribution based on our current technology. On the issue of how, it is a simple issue comparable to how you breathe. How do you breathe? You simply suck air into your lungs; you never worry about a scarcity of air because it is all around us, it is not scarce. How would people gain access to free computers in a Post-Scarcity situation? It would be similar to breathing air. You would simply compute via the super-abundance of computers all around you. Intel have stated (via their resident futurist Brian David Johnson) that meaningful computation (the chip size) will approach zero size in 2020, which means you could potentially have cheap microscopic computers in clothes, cups, paint, anything. Recently I read about the ability to print solar cells. Imagine how 3D printing will have developed 20 or 30 years from now, we will be able to print anything, for example imagine being able to print powerful computers, or imagine printers that can deconstruct printed objects. So if computer chips are zero size by 2020, what about 2030, or 2040? What will evolved AI be capable of 30 years from now? Look at various aspects of technology then project them 30 years into the future and that is the how. Today I looked at pay-as-you-go cell phones in the supermarket and the cheapest one was only 14 US$, which is cheaper than 10 years ago and the technology in it is incredibly sophisticated compared to 10 years ago. You can also buy a corded landline handset for only $3.45. In another ten years companies will possibly give cell phones away or perhaps they will cost $2; or perhaps we must wait 20 or 30 years before there is such a drop in price, but the sure thing is that by 2045 everything will be free. * RKM: What is the difference between having sufficient for all and Post-scarcity? What is free? When is something free for you? SU: The difference between "sufficient for all" and Post-Scarcity is that the "sufficient for all" idea would or could entail rationing, there would likely be strict management of scarce resources to entail the sufficiency. Sufficient for all would or could entail mere provision of basic needs such as food and shelter, whereas Post-Scarcity entails no management or rationing, there is no need to regulate scarce resources, there are no limits in a Post-Scarcity situation. “Sufficient for all” is imprecise because it could apply to a very wide variety of situations depending on how you define sufficient. For example the amount of platinum per individual could easily have a differing level of sufficiency for each person. A sufficient amount of cake per person is a differing measurement for each person similar to a sufficient amount of computing power. I am sure many millionaires think they have insufficient funds, which is why they are so desperate to earn more money; whereas many poor people might opt for eternal retirement if they had only 1 million in currency. I doubt you could ever have a situation where everything is free if the resources are scarce. If there is very effective management of scarcity to entail a "sufficient for all" scenario, you will nevertheless have prices despite the sufficiency. Something is free in the monetary sense when it has no price, and there will always be price in a scarcity situation because human greed, the fear of scarcity, cannot be completely eliminated during a scarcity situation."[15] That's not all I said. That's a fraction of what I wrote, if you want blueprints go to their website, there's dozens of youtube videos as well. There's ted talks, they were on 60 minutes, there's also the links I provided. Would you prefer to not do research and rest on what I say? https://wiki.p2pfoundation.net/Resource-Based_Economy

Greta has billions listening to her about climate change, she could do so much more damage to Uncle Sam if she marketed the Venus Project to her followers than with a speech on deaf ears:

I did in the first few sentences. We account for things, construction is automated from the Earth to your house, all replacements you'll ever need accounted for. It's doing it smart, it's accounted for. We would even account for when we'd run out of precious materials, and replicate the ones we do have using simple chemistry. No money, no scarcity, no inflation. No scarcity arises. We already do a headcount on projected population growth, we just don't care. The free market economy is destroying lives as we sit here. I'm sure you're wondering "what if the automation breaks down", and I point you back to accounting. Von Neumann probes are a great remedy for this, you only need one in good working condition and in 80 years you can cover the earth in automation, and the only things doing any work the whole entire time was the automation! This is not new, and we certainly have to technology. Only a fraction of a percent of modern people even have the resources to get into engineering, the rest is public service and sales: monotonous, obsolete, most of the time demeaning, doesn't pay enough, and the whole idea of earning a scratch of a living to pump money back into the prison planet of capitalism is really irksome. The living quality will continue to decline worldwide, and all countries are the same with minutiae variations we are all living in Amerika. Whereas an RBE is radically different, and not the potato potahto of Marxist and Communist which really have no difference between Democrat and Republican or socialist or conservative or whatever they are literally not addressing the issue of technology vs muscle. And if somehow RBE self-autonomy did break down and we needed construction workers again it's not like they're not there. And it's not like we wouldn't have plenty of engineers the whole point is free education, so there'd be far more engineers in an RBE than ever partly because it's free and mostly because of how much time we're allowing our technology to save us. Right now it's like we're in the way of our technology, too many Protestants and Presbyterians I suppose.

Imagine living in a decent house rent free. We already should be doing this and we don't need a venus project to do so. All the places exist, all the replacement parts, the electrical grid. This is an issue of incentive, money doesn't actually do anything but grow in number as resources run out, in essence it doesn't do anything but grow like a parasite in your pocket. No, no, enough of that nonsense. Here's to the future, [url=https://www.thevenusproject.com/faq/what-is-the-plan/]coming along at a snail's pace[/url]: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QorK2X7GsVU https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nYodgWapmgc https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=c-M_kVZTf50 The biggest problem is that people are being born with no place to stay, unless they win competition for it. This is not nice at all! First of all if you're going to do that to people raised to work, then you shouldn't raise them in a place like America you should raise with the Aboriginal peoples that live off the land in huts. Second of all competition for Maslow's hierarchy of needs, the base of it, causes death and murder. A resource based economy has been on 60 minutes, it's been on numerous Ted talks, they kick the shit out of socialists in arguments! So why haven't the Projects been built yet? In fact we could have built a Venus Project when we built the Pruitt Igoe projects. What's the deal, why aren't 100% of us fighting for this, much less talking about it? I have personally gone to war with the local authorities in Missouri over this.