YT2095 Posted February 24, 2004 Share Posted February 24, 2004 I`ve been working on a way to obtain elemental Phosphorus. naturaly I`ll convert it to Red P4 rather than store it as White P4. so far the best way I can come up with is the conversion of Phosphoric acid with Carbon and distilling it. the starting chems I have, are many, Ammonium phosphate, calcium hydrogen phosphate as my 2 sources. does anyone know an easier method from the above? all the other chems that may be required I should have, so don`t worry about having to think of complicated ways, complex is good too, so long as it works maybe an electrolytic way? or a way that doesn`t require distilation? Ideas please Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wolfson Posted February 24, 2004 Share Posted February 24, 2004 How about soil phosphorus extraction by iron oxide impregnated filter papers, since your into gradens....lol... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
YT2095 Posted February 24, 2004 Author Share Posted February 24, 2004 but that would just give me Phosphorus salts, and I already have those (from a gardening shop I might add) )) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wolfson Posted February 24, 2004 Share Posted February 24, 2004 Oh didnt read that well, sulfuric acid extraction of a phosphate-rich rock will give you elemental phosphorus. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wolfson Posted February 24, 2004 Share Posted February 24, 2004 Apatite is an example. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
YT2095 Posted February 24, 2004 Author Share Posted February 24, 2004 it will make phosphoric acid sure, and apatite (nano powder) would be a step backwards from the acid as it includes a metal Ion Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
YT2095 Posted March 1, 2004 Author Share Posted March 1, 2004 YIPEE! I`ve done it )))) I`ve just managed to exrtact elemental Phosphorus Step one: mix ammonium sulphate with Calcium Hydrogen Phosphate soln (both available at a gardening center). a precipitate of calcium sulphate will form, filter it out and colect the liquid, allow the liquid to crystalise by evaporation. step 2: heat the crystals until they melt, ammonia gas will be given off, continue heating until the ammonia smell has gone. allow to cool and disolve the remainder in a little water, filter it of any impurities. you now have Phosphoric acid. evaporate most of the water off by gentle heating, it will become syrupy. step 3: add 25% of it mass with carbon (lumpwood chacoal powdered will do). mix well and allow to got as dry as possible. step 4: put a little of this mix in a heatproof test tube and heat it over a bunsen burner (in a dark room is best). you will see Phosphorus begin to distill up the tube and maybe catch fire with a green glow when it hits the air avoid the fumes as they stink and are harmfull, it smells a bit like garlic. YT2095 goes off to do his Happy Dance around the Lab Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wolfson Posted March 1, 2004 Share Posted March 1, 2004 LMAO congratulations Mr.YT good work Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sayonara Posted March 1, 2004 Share Posted March 1, 2004 Careful with that dance YT! Pics? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fafalone Posted March 1, 2004 Share Posted March 1, 2004 Very cool stuff, good work YT Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
YT2095 Posted March 1, 2004 Author Share Posted March 1, 2004 cheerz and Sayo, I shall have pics done for my second batch, I want to scale it up beyond a few centigrams, but be sure, I`ll be more than happy to present them here Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sayonara Posted March 1, 2004 Share Posted March 1, 2004 :coolio: \o/ What are you going to do with your elemental phosphorus? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
YT2095 Posted March 1, 2004 Author Share Posted March 1, 2004 no idea at all really, probaly just convert it to Red Phosphorus and keep it with my other chems that I`ve made and have no real use for but I may eventualy see an interesting experiment that requires P4 and I`ll know I have some to try it with the challenge and the journey are the exciting bits for me really, the end result is just a bonus when I`ve scaled this up and made a few grams, I`ll move on to something else, as always Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
YT2095 Posted March 13, 2004 Author Share Posted March 13, 2004 Ignore the above!!! it`s way to dangerous! although I did manage to get a measly 100mg of Red Phosphourus that was all I could salvage as the white caught fire ((( I just hope the gasses don`t make me ill, gloves(nitrile) and goggles, but no respirator/fume cuboard, it stinks like holy hell in here now, windows open and all the plumes of white smoke have gone now. I seriously don`t reccomend anyone try this! Sayo I have the pics all leading up to this event, just not on my website yet as I wanted the complete set, you`ll forgive me for not taking pics during the fire I hope! again, unless you have some serious heavy duty Lab kit, do not even THINK about making Phosphourus! [edit] on a brighter note though, I did make alot of phosphoric acid and still have quite a bit left, I`ll look into making fuel cells next Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aommaster Posted March 13, 2004 Share Posted March 13, 2004 How did it catch fire? Doesn't phosphorus catch fire only when lit? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
YT2095 Posted March 13, 2004 Author Share Posted March 13, 2004 it burns spontainiously in air, so it did! don`t get me wrong, I was fully aware that it does, I just didn`t expect it to as I was loading the heating tube! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aommaster Posted March 13, 2004 Share Posted March 13, 2004 nice going YT! U should have taken that into account before making it! Oh God! Must have made a horrible mess! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
YT2095 Posted March 13, 2004 Author Share Posted March 13, 2004 I try not to think about it! mess no, not really, just the white smoke and stink, I managed to cap the tube while it was on fire, it sucked the cork in a bit and shattered over the water bowl, then I was safe(ish). I lost most of it though, as I said, I got about 100mg of red phos for my efforts. hardly seems worth it in all honesty! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aommaster Posted March 13, 2004 Share Posted March 13, 2004 I feel ur pain! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
YT2095 Posted March 13, 2004 Author Share Posted March 13, 2004 and before anyone starts thinking I`m SFNs Resident Mad Scientist, no I`m not! I`m actualy a very good scientist, I just like to "push the envelope" sometimes, and explore possibilities, afterall, isn`t that what Science is all about? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aommaster Posted March 13, 2004 Share Posted March 13, 2004 exactly! The only way to learn is to make mistakes! By the way, I don't think ur a mad scientist! Just a guy with lots of knowledge! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
YT2095 Posted March 13, 2004 Author Share Posted March 13, 2004 LOL, I`ve got a little bit more now Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aommaster Posted March 13, 2004 Share Posted March 13, 2004 yup! I think so too. I just can't imagine how long it has taken for u to get to the stage you are at! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
YT2095 Posted March 13, 2004 Author Share Posted March 13, 2004 aommaster said in post # :I just can't imagine how long it has taken for u to get to the stage you are at! stage I am at? I don`t quite understand you (sorry). do you mean with the Red Phos synth? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aommaster Posted March 13, 2004 Share Posted March 13, 2004 Nope, i mean the level of knowledge that you are at. Amazing! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Create an account or sign in to comment
You need to be a member in order to leave a comment
Create an account
Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!
Register a new accountSign in
Already have an account? Sign in here.
Sign In Now