9 hours ago, Sohan Lalwani said:

Rosalind Franklin played a crucial role in understanding the structure of DNA. Although she did not receive as much recognition in her lifetime,

And Marie Curie had to use the public restroom down the street, because she was barred from university facilities. That, plus the fact that you had to fish around in the centuries for half a dozen obscure female names among hundreds of famous male ones should tell you something about the influence of women on society. Only in the past half century, out of 7000 years, have they had a significant role in science.

9 hours ago, Sohan Lalwani said:

Even in ancient times, women like Hypatia of Alexandria, a mathematician and astronomer in Egypt, taught and advanced knowledge in geometry and philosophy.

And look how that ended! Almost as if she were not in control.

So, from 5000BC - 2000 AD, what percent of heads of state, judges, prelates, generals, financial officials and lawmakers were women? (Please don't dredge up Boudica or Joan of Ark; neither fared much better than poor old Hypatia.)

Never mind. Nobody - not even you - really believes that women historically control societies and cause men mental anguish through unreasonable expectations.

9 hours ago, Sohan Lalwani said:

I am here if you wish to “vent”

It's not about me. I did some counseling many years ago, and the pattern was pretty clear then. It hasn't changed: in times of economic stress and political instability, domestic violence increases.

"Further, rapid increases in the unemployment rate increased men's controlling behavior toward romantic partners even after we adjust for unemployment and economic distress at the household level. "

And it's not about to improve in the near future.

Here's a vent for you:

"Under Trump’s America, violence against women isn’t just ignored—it’s become a deliberate political strategy. Powerful men accused of abuse are actively protected and celebrated by the Trump administration, while survivors and those who stand up for them are punished and silenced. (Just look at the attacks and public shaming Christine Blasey Ford had to endure after courageously coming forward with her sexual assault allegations against Brett Kavanaugh.) From legal interventions and judicial appointments to funding cuts, Trump has systematically dismantled protections for women and emboldened those who harm them."

20 minutes ago, Peterkin said:

from 5000BC - 2000 AD, what percent of heads of state, judges, prelates, generals, financial officials and lawmakers were women? (Please don't dredge up Boudica or Joan of Ark; neither fared much better than poor old Hypatia.)

Zinaida Grecianîi, Wonnie Boedhoe, Wilma Salgado, Violeta Chamorro, Vigdís Finnbogadóttir, Verica Kalanović, Valérie Pécresse, Tansu Çiller, Tarja Halonen, Syda Namirembe Bumba, Sirimavo Bandaranaike, Sophie Thévenoux, Sanna Marin, Roza Otunbayeva, Quentin Bryce, Portia Simpson-Miller, Penny Wong, Patricia Busignani, Ossouka Raponda, Nana Konadu Agyeman Rawlings, Nancy Astor, Mira Cosic, Milka Planinc, Michèle Jean, Michelle Bachelet, Mette Frederiksen, Mary Robinson, Marie-Christine Mboukou, Marie-Louise Coleiro Preca, María Teresa Fernández de la Vega, Maria Pintasilgo, Maria Luis Albuquerque, Margaret Thatcher, Liz Truss, Lamia Assi, Laura Liswood, Laura Chinchilla, Kolinda Grabar-Kitarović, Kim Campbell, Khaleda Zia, Kamla Persad-Bissessar, Julia Gillard, Jóhanna Sigurðardóttir, Jeanne Sauvé, Iveta Radičová, Ingrida Šimonytė, Indira Gandhi, Hilda Heine, Helena Embalo Nosolini, Hanna Suchocka, Golda Meir, Giorgia Meloni, Gail Shea, Felisa Miceli, Fatima Fialho, Ellen Johnson Sirleaf, Dilma Rousseff, Dalia Grybauskaitė, Clotilde Niragira, Christine Lagarde, Christina Romer, Bóurjana Krîto, Bintou Sango, Bidhya Devi Bhandari, Benazir Bhutto, Anne Craine, Angela Merkel, Aung San Suu Kyi, Soong Ching-ling, Sükhbaataryn Yanjmaa, Khertek Anchimaa-Toka, Isabel Perón, Corazon Aquino, Kim Campbell, Elisabeth Domitien, Jeanne Sauvé, Golda Meir, Indira Gandhi, Ellen Johnson Sirleaf, Dilma Rousseff, Michelle Bachelet, Julia Gillard, Margaret Thatcher, Tarja Halonen, Violeta Chamorro, Laura Chinchilla, Kamla Persad-Bissessar, Khaleda Zia, Tansu Çiller, Roza Otunbayeva, Kolinda Grabar-Kitarović, Mary Robinson, Joyce Banda, Maria de Lourdes Pintasilgo, Sylvie Kinigi, Ertha Pascal-Trouillot, Ruth Perry, Catherine Samba-Panza, and Jóhanna Sigurðardóttir.

Its a fairly small list as its about .1% due to a variety of factors and not it singularly being male dominated

29 minutes ago, Peterkin said:

Never mind. Nobody - not even you - really believes that women historically control societies and cause men mental anguish through unreasonable expectations.

Women have overall had a profound effect on societies, believe it or not to some extent they birth the people who run the empires etc. Shocker I know.

Some women do have unreasonable expectations, likewise men but it does exist.

31 minutes ago, Peterkin said:

. Only in the past half century, out of 7000 years, have they had a significant role in science.

Tapputi-Belatekallim, Merit-Ptah, Peseshet, Agamede, Agnodice, Theano, Myia, Aesara of Lucania, Aspasia of Miletus, Artemisia of Caria, Cleopatra the Alchemist, Hypatia of Alexandria, Mary the Jewess, Maria Prophetissima, Perictione, Sosipatra of Ephesus, Hildegard of Bingen, Pandrosion of Alexandria, Trotula of Salerno, Metrodora, Paulis of Ephesus, Yuhanna bint al-Qass, Lubna of Córdoba, Miriam the Prophetess, Fatima al-Fihri, and Empress Wu Zetian.

ARE SOME VERY NOTABLE PEOPLE. Overall it pales in comparison relative to popular male scientists but popularity ≠ importance. Some people like Lubna of Córdoba contributed substantially in mathematics and even lead the creation of the Medina Azahara

35 minutes ago, Peterkin said:

And Marie Curie had to use the public restroom down the street, because she was barred from university facilities.

So were colored male scientists, discrimination isnt only a female issue. :)

UNRELATED but I happen to come from the nation with the first female president globally

21 minutes ago, Sohan Lalwani said:

Its a fairly small list as its about .1% due to a variety of factors and not it singularly being male dominated

😂Of course it isn't!

22 minutes ago, Sohan Lalwani said:

So were colored male scientists, discrimination isnt only a female issue. :)

No, However, the subject at hand wasn't female issues but the lack of support men get in society. Quite true that Black, Native and South American men get even less help with mental and substance problems problems than those of European background, which is strongly related to economic status, rather than gender.

How many times do you think you can change the subject before fascism is acknowledged as a systemic social malaise, not a one-off?

31 minutes ago, Peterkin said:

How many times do you think you can change the subject before fascism is acknowledged as a systemic social malaise, not a one-off?

Lord, my friend when did I say it’s a one off

I also don’t remember ever starting this thread, how did this appear?

45 minutes ago, Sohan Lalwani said:

ARE SOME VERY NOTABLE PEOPLE. Overall it pales in comparison relative to popular male scientists but popularity ≠ importance. Some people like Lubna of Córdoba contributed substantially in mathematics and even lead the creation of the Medina Azahara

This again is a result of parroting factoids without actual analysis or actual reading on the subject. Only by taking massive shortcuts would one arrive at the notion that societies are not male-dominated because of a handful notable women. It is just being ignorant of history or society and is a malaise of seeking superficial knowledge without putting in the work.

Obviously women always played an important role in society, but their role was/is frequently diminished. Importantly power structures were set up by men, with deep impacts in all kinds of aspects. There is a reason why medical data for women is still lacking, for example and it wasn't too long ago that institutions realized that we need better data for women. Similar is true for racialized minorities, but especially for women in that group. Now we see that that little progress we are making getting reversed by a strongly patriarchal administration. Following their logic, male mental health should be improving rapidly and I have serious doubts that we are going to see that.

10 minutes ago, CharonY said:

This again is a result of parroting factoids without actual analysis or actual reading on the subject. Only by taking massive shortcuts would one arrive at the notion that societies are not male-dominated because of a handful notable women. It is just being ignorant of history or society and is a malaise of seeking superficial knowledge without putting in the work.

I hear your concern, and I agree that we should always be wary of relying on surface-level knowledge. But with respect, it's not accurate to assume that pointing out prominent women in history is simply parroting factoids or ignoring deeper structures. Recognizing that societies have long been male-dominated does not mean we should erase the contributions of women who challenged those structures. In fact, acknowledging those women is a necessary part of understanding the full picture — they were often working against the dominant current, which makes their impact even more significant. To say otherwise is to flatten history into an either-or binary, when in reality it’s far more layered and complex.

12 minutes ago, CharonY said:

There is a reason why medical data for women is still lacking

This is like the 4% statement. Speaking with the terms modern medicine, there is plenty of information on women’s health and such. I’d say it perhaps needs a more robust database as do all forms of medicine. Saying it’s overall lacking is very misleading.

1 hour ago, Sohan Lalwani said:

Lord, my friend when did I say it’s a one off

The Weimar was a unique situation, etc, etc, and the far right extremists are just a bunch of inexperienced teenagers. Nothing sound familiar?

2 hours ago, Sohan Lalwani said:

Women have overall had a profound effect on societies, believe it or not to some extent they birth the people who run the empires etc. Shocker I know.

There's an influential ten hours, to be sure!

So.... it's all the wimmin's fault.

1 hour ago, CharonY said:

It is just being ignorant of history or society

I don't think so. It looking more and more like deliberate obfuscation to me.

4 minutes ago, Peterkin said:

The Weimar was a unique situation, etc, etc, and the far right extremists are just a bunch of inexperienced teenagers. Nothing sound familiar?

It does

5 minutes ago, Peterkin said:

There's an influential ten hours, to be sure!

So.... it's all the wimmin's fault.

Dawg what are we talking about now

I imagine there must have been some direct links between law enforcement roughing up a senator > the Trump regime's rush toward martial law > Europe's slide into fascism > teenagers on social media > men's access to mental health care > suicide rates > domestic violence > some women in science > women's domination of society through childbirth, but I'm damned if i can follow them. Can we just conclude that fascism is a result of women building dysfunctional societies?

7 minutes ago, Sohan Lalwani said:

Dawg what are we talking about now

Oh, you forgot already?

2 hours ago, Sohan Lalwani said:

Women have overall had a profound effect on societies, believe it or not to some extent they birth the people who run the empires etc. Shocker I know.

Average lenght of labour is actually longer than that, but I was generous. Throw in an extra seven months for breast-feeding. Still a a little way from the ermine.

7 minutes ago, Peterkin said:

Can we just conclude that fascism is a result of women building dysfunctional societies?

I’d like to know where in a rats ass we concluded this

8 minutes ago, Peterkin said:

Oh, you forgot already?

Yes with all the unneeded side commentary and sarcasm

Can we stop victimizing and jumping the gun? Please stop assuming the other sides position or motives, it’s quite frankly stupid. Please stop twisting my words, I’m not blaming anyone for facism or racism, kindly attempt to gain nuance for once.

1 hour ago, Sohan Lalwani said:

Can we stop victimizing and jumping the gun?

Who is victimized now? I tried to follow the sudden changes from politics to suicidal men but it's just too much work.

You can feel safe again, I'm out.

3 minutes ago, Peterkin said:

Who is victimized now? I tried to follow the sudden changes from politics to suicidal men but it's just too much work.

My friend, I mean you.

4 minutes ago, Peterkin said:

You can feel safe again, I'm out.

Now I feel as safe as civilians once Sarajevo was not being sieged. Yipee!