Theredbarron

I already connect static electricity to all the way outside out solar system on another chat that you were in. The one about the moon.

Just now, Moontanman said:

Planets are smoother than marbles to scale, the Earth is smoother than a billiard ball, you really need to back your baseless assertions up with something more than your baseless assertions. Exactly how does drafting cause a magnetic field? 

No its not. Mountains are Hugh and can push air if you moved one fast enough. 

Your talking about the porosity of a marble. Thats not even close to the large variations of mountains displacing air. 

re read 

Static electricity is a pretty good sign of what im talking about. 

Do I need to back static electricity?

5 minutes ago, Moontanman said:

No, mass relies on volume and density, that is why Saturn has a gravitational field similar to earth's yet has many times the mass of earth. 

That is what I have trying to tell you. But it has nothing to do with movement, if you think it does please provide a citation for that assertion.. 

Nothing in the universe is sitting still yet mass is not connected to any intrinsic movement..  

Nothing in the universe is or can be not moving at all.. 

Given that definition a marble in orbit has an atmosphere.. .

Then please point it out to me, give a link and a quote from that link that supports your position... 

You do realize that what your saying is the same thing that I'm saying? I have cited it,  its called drafting. 

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Drafting_(aerodynamics)

 marbles are smooth so no its not the same. 

If nothing in our existence is sitting still then it cant be just matter because it is in motion. How can anyone on earth confirm that is just matter thats creating gravity if all if it is moving. No mention of motion on how gravity works but everything that is producing gravity has we can observe is moving. Where did that get eliminated throughout history?  

1 minute ago, Moontanman said:

You are just moving the goal posts now, all through this we have been talking about a planetary magnetic field. Your own links did not include mars as a planet with a magnetic field. This is from the link you just gave.

Now how about you stop making baseless assertions about things you have no idea about how they work... 

No I'm not. You just missed all the right info. And you didn't read it. Do you know drafting because thats what I'm talking about. The chemical make up should have been a given when I came to a science site. So if I have to explain how different chemicals have different densities then you need to brush up. 

2 minutes ago, Moontanman said:

No, mars does not have a planetary magnetic field, saying does doesn't make it true... 

Citation please, you are making claims that need to be backed up by more than your baseless assertions... 

I feel the need to correct ignorance when ever I can... 

Oh now its a planetary magnetic field. It does have one

Sorry magnetosphere which is cause by the static charges given from the solar winds. 

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Terraforming_of_Mars

Still the same thing im talking about. 

Who really is being ignorant 

I do accept when Im wrong but when you use information out of context it doesn't mean your correcting ignorance. You are even running to the people who are watching for help by asking for a citation instead of showing me something that is crating gravity as it sits perfectly still in our existence. not something someone wrote down.  

Leave if you dont like it. 

Do you even know what drafting is? 

18 minutes ago, Moontanman said:

Well let's see, killing of ocean plankton and fish would be one negative...

So I guess humans lives dont matter then. 

Just now, Moontanman said:

Only relative to the volume, the planet Saturn is less dense than water yet masses many times the mass of the earth. 

I already said that... 

Yet the movement has no effect on gravity, only the mass matters.. 

So now you say it's the chemical makeup instead of movement and density? make up your mind. What exactly does a hurricane have to do with a magnetic field? 

I did. your confused. Density is no one specific thing. So the chemical make of the gases surround the planets effects the density. Like mars with its co2 and its not as dese but it rotates the same speed and is half the size of earth. It has a magnetic field. But gravity is lower even though the surface speed is the same. I never said it didn't. I said density. check your verbiage. 

Mars has a weak one but its there. Same ground speed different density of matter surrounding it. 

You cant say that this isn't interesting. That why your still here. 

3 minutes ago, Moontanman said:

No, mass is based on... mass, if you replaced the sun with a black hole the same mass as the sun the solar system would continue on with the planets orbiting the same as they do now. 

No, not true, given a specific volume more mass would be more dense. 

Very true. 

False, the mass of the entire universe should be neutral in charge. Density has nothing to do with it.. 

No gravity is mass warping space time. 

False a stationary mass would have to same gravity as a moving mass unless it was relativistic speed. The Earth and Venus has the same gravitational pull per kilo of mass but the earth spins far faster than venus...  

It can be zero, why do you think it is not? 

Not true, gravity is mass warping space time, gravity is only an attractive force, magnetism is a polar force with positive and negative charges...  

Mass weight is based on density of the mass. So if you have the same area occupied by different density the more dense it is the more it weights. So yes mass does rely on density. 

The more density in a given space is more mass

Support you claim on stationary because nothing that has gravity is sitting still. everywhere. 

It can be zero when you add 1 + -1 = 0   1 proton and 1 electron = 0 magnetic charge. 

the chemical makeup of the atmosphere is different so like a hurricane it will act different. 

1 minute ago, Moontanman said:

 

Not if the volume changes as well. 

 

Find me something that is creating gravity like you say  that is not moving at all. There isn't anything. 

4 minutes ago, Moontanman said:

 

The socalled atmosphere of mercury is a hard vacuum by our standards yet very light and much less dense ganymede has a magnetic field... 

Its an atmosphere of that planet even by our standards. Just because it doesn't support your version doesn't make it not gasses surround a planet. 

7 minutes ago, beecee said:

Venus has a dense atmosphere but no measurable magnetic field.

 Lightning also goes from the ground up.

It doesn't have an atmosphere either.

 

A body will stay in its state of rest or uniform motion unless acted on by a force...A law as proposed by a guy called Newton. Nothing to do with density. 

No, gravity/spacetime curvature is always the dominating force that is shaping our universe.

Nonsense...

Venus is also rotating a lot slower then all the other planets and the opposite direction I might add. So when you slow a generators armature you tend to lose you ability to create voltage just for comparison on that.   Almost no measurable is not the same a no field. The materials involve do effect magnetic properties. 

Change the density and now its not the same. 

mercury does and its made of hydrogen and oxygen and helium. 

4 minutes ago, Ghideon said:

I did not understand this. Can you explain what movements that are required for gravity? Movement relative to what?

The drafting thing that I was mentioning. It creates a low spot behind whatever is moving. Now take the surface of earth and all its imperfections and move it at 1000 mph. Mountains moving at that speed. The draft behind a semi is lower pressure and density because the matter thats following it is not moving fast enough to occupy the space behind it. This makes it less dense. 

6 minutes ago, Moontanman said:

At the distance from shore hurricane develop the input of rivers is negligible at worst.  Adding a significant amount of salt would be environmentally dangerous to say the least. But if it worked and made air fall due to being dense it would simply displace less dense air which would rise and feed the storm..  

What kind of environmental things are we talking about? I should be clear that this wouldn't happen near shore and the aim is at the moist air. 

3 minutes ago, Moontanman said:

Gravity is based on mass, what do you mean by density? If magnetism is based on density wouldn't that show your ideas are wrong?  

Mass is based upon density. The more dense the more total mass. Magnetism isn't based on density. Each masses total electrical value is increase as density is increased. Gravity is the density differentials in motion. You cant create the differential if you dont move. No magnets cant attract everything base upon what I'm saying. It only attract the opposite charges. Which is not zero in magnetism. Gravity uses all the properties. To include neutrons. Its part of it. If everything has gravity then you just prove my point. Everything also has electrons and protons which have there own magnetic properties. Its all one thing not separate. Science studies these parts separately which is what I'm getting at. They are the same thing. 

1 minute ago, Moontanman said:

You do realize that hurricanes form over the ocean which is rather highly saline already... right? 

Right but not salty enough. Fresh water is being dumbed into the ocean from rivers. This mixing of salt water and fresh water dilutes currents. This will increase the evaporation of the water. The storm will use the evaporated water as fuel. More salt will slow evaporation. 

Just now, Ghideon said:

Ok! No problem!

Why use a bomb? If you drop salt from an airplane into a storm about to turn into a hurricane the salt will spread quite fast anyway?

I did not find any references to actual tests using lasers. It was one of the proposed ideas. If salt makes sense in theory or have any effect at all on weather I do not know, I have not researched that. You suggested that

So you have to show why salt makes sense. The sources referenced at https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Weather_modification#Storm_prevention did not mention salt, my best guess* is that the test required a chemical that absorbs more water than salt.

 

*) The sources hints that commercial interests were involved in the tests which of course could have impact on chemicals use. Note also that the results were not conclusive. 

I'm not sure if they actually used a laser it just mentioned it and thats what I thought. The reason for a bomb is to cover a larger area with whatever it is used. I mention salt because it dramatically effects waters boiling point and evaporation as to keep the water in the water or put it back so that the mixing of cold air and warm moist has less moisture. Less moisture less power the hurrican can develop. Its just one leg of what a hurricane needs. A pretty important piece I might add. Even with the chemicals they are still trying to change salt point in the water that could potentially evaporate. 

25 minutes ago, studiot said:

 

Well I don't understand this comment, sorry.

I totally missed this. What I mean is that the methods is flawed for this understanding due to facts that were ignored. I meant that people believe in it due to the numbers always working. Im dont think the numbers are wrong. I think the initial understanding is where mistakes were made. 

3 minutes ago, beecee said:

Because not all astronomical bodies are magnetic? But all have gravity?

All matter has magnetic properties. It has protons and electrons. These have magnetic properties by them selves. If you wanted to attract these properties into moving then you would have to have the opposite of the magnetic values which are zeroed out due to the same amount of electrons and protons. The opposite would then be less protons and electrons giving it less total electrical values. This value is dependent upon density. 

The motion of these electrical properties causes density changes following it and in front of it if its moving in one direction. Drafting is creating a lower density area for other things to be attracted to. The cars of Nascar use it for there advantage. Airplanes use it to defy gravity. Same with helicopter and all other flying things. To defy gravity you have to create pressure differential which is changing the densities. Once you have enough of a differential it will then move whatever it is your trying to move in the direction of less density. 

5 minutes ago, Moontanman said:

The source of planetary magnetic fields is well known, if you want to explain them some other way then the burden of proof lies with you not us... 

If its so well known then why haven't you pieced together that the magnetic fields are conveniently happening along side gravity? Magnets attract things. Why couldn't it be so that gravity is magnetic attraction just not what we use for electricity? I use atmosphere because its the most visible results from density changes. Then static electricity shows you what happens when matter moves away from each other. That would have to be a magnetic attraction to attract the electrons onto whatever it is attracted to. Not Just because its moving but the electrical properties are moving. 

You think its a phenomenon I think its actually physics. 

Just now, Moontanman said:

I doubt anyone does but you.. 

Thats fine with me. I'm not the one missing it all.

You cant say density has nothing to do with it when its everything even how a hurricane comes to be. 

If everything I say ruffles feathers then maybe you should take a look around and see whats happening right in front of you. Because phenomenon is not enough. Stopping there cant be the answer. 

Drafting is real

phenomenon is an unanswered question. 

3 minutes ago, Moontanman said:

None of this in anything but nonsense... 

Its pretty clear that you dont understand what I'm actually talking about. You should try and read all the stuff I put before you get stuck on atmosphere. 

24 minutes ago, Ghideon said:

Then why are you asking us questions about this?

So the question is if anyone has tried anything missing from all physics that will answer the questions.

How should I know since you claim that:

If you mean has anyone tried storm or hurricane prevention using chemicals? Yes, see my answer above.

I actually missed those. Was any bomb used to disperse chemicals to cover a larger area? They tried laser but salt doesn't make sense?

3 hours ago, Ghideon said:

 

Ok Air pressure and air movements affect magnetic fields according to your idea? Then you can use a compass to measure that? Do you get lost if you navigate with a compass on a windy day?

Not if the total value of the earth magnetic field is stronger. The only time its not is when electricity can flow from the clouds to the ground or another cloud. This is base upon density which is the total electrical properties. 

3 hours ago, studiot said:

So here is your introduction to the Scientific Method.

You have thrown out (postulated) some unsubstantiated claims about a relationship between planetary atmospheres and any magnetic field that plant might have.

So what does a Scientist do?

He goes and finds out some facts and figures and looks at them to see if the agree with or disagree with his postulate (hypothesis).

So I will start this process off with a recent table of magnetic information (2003 Tufts University / Cambridge University) Note Mars and Venus are dealt with in the footnotes.

I will then leave you to obtain corresponding atmospheric data to link up with these figures.

 

 

This scientific method of yours came up with the answer of phenomenon. That is not a scientific answer. All of you believe because the numbers hold up. 

2 hours ago, Moontanman said:

I'm not sure i follow you, you seem to be saying a magnetic field is generated by an atmosphere but then you say that mercury and the moon have magnetic fields when their surfaces are for all practical purposes hard vacuums. Yet Mars and Venus, which do have atmospheres, have no global magnetic fields. Ganymede which has no atmosphere has a global magnetic field. Am I misunderstanding you? 

 

The movement of any matter of any density cause a differential of density. Density is total electrical properties. 

Atmosphere is matter at a density. What happens when you change vapor to a liquid? its density is changed. The vapors or gases are the easiest molecules or matter to manipulate in our existence. This is why its the first thing to get effected by this action. The separation of matter cause static electrical charges. This is the sign of the magnetic attraction between none magnetic matter. Even our solar system has an atmosphere. Its just not at the pressure that you are used to. Its density changes as the denser solar winds pass by. At the levels of density in space it definitely can have a major effect on planets and it blows right by us. Space doesn't care about what its like on earth. So all the comparing should be done from space. Take a pic of the planet in motion and see all of what is happening. Now zoom out to see all our solar system. Our planets are orbiting the sun just like satellites orbing our planet. Our solar system has  an edge that the voyage passed not to long ago that is conveniently at the end of solar winds. So when I say atmosphere I'm talking about the density that surrounds the planet or moons that is there. Are all hurricanes alike or just similar in whats happening? So no 2 fields are going to be alike as well. 

All those planets have more dense atmosphere on that list. I guess the insignificant details were ignored just because its not exactly alike the other planets for example mars. It still has one just not the same. It also has a different chemical makeup so all the factors are effected. To each its own

41 minutes ago, Moontanman said:

I can't see anyway that the detonation of a bomb at the start of a hurricane  would do other than make it more powerful. A detonation would result in rapidly rising air, a hurricane forms from rapidly rising air. The Earth's rotation gives it spin, if you could somehow remove energy you might make a difference but as far as i know there is no way to do this on a large scale. Salt is already sucked up by hurricanes, salty water anyway, I don't see how physics would allow you to stop a hurricane with a bomb. Maybe drop liquid nitrogen into the forming center but dropping dry ice has been done and it actually made it worse. 

Hurricanes use much more then rapidly rising air. Its a combination of things that have to be a certain way in order for it to begin rotation. Increasing the salt content of the moisture condenses it now becoming water and not moist warm air dropping from the sky on one side of its beginning throwing the whole start off and delaying it enough for hopefully it cant gain fast enough to become a monster instead its a smaller storm not that its small. It most likely cant work with what you guys understand. There is a few things missing from all of physics. Those things will answer the questions. Has any one tried it? I would love to see this. Even if it doesn't work. 

10 minutes ago, studiot said:

True, but then the magnetic field of every planet is unique.

Yes and so is gravity. The density or everything involved in a planet is a big factor. 

10 minutes ago, studiot said:

 

Do you have any evidence to support this claim?

 

When I say atmosphere I mean gasses collected around the surface just like the moon. It has one. 

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Magnetic_field_of_the_Moon

Its not even a planet. 

Mercury has one

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mercury's_magnetic_field

Asteroid's have magnetism but its assumed it captured it from whatever event it came from. Thats possible and so is a static electrical charge being absorbed by a conductor when it speeds past gasses in space or colliding with something else. 

The scientific method already has already been performed on the effect of density, static electricity, electricity, ventures, drafting, pressure, vacuum, temperature, and chemical reactions. I'm just piecing it all together since it looks obvious to me that density effects everything including movement and attraction in all aspect of physics which is everything.

All testing based upon wind speed compared to the earth is incorrect due to not factoring in land speed in comparison to the earth. The scientific method missed that.

8 minutes ago, swansont said:

If this were true the effect would be easily measurable during e.g. hurricanes and thunderstorms. It's not the atmosphere that causes this.

If anything, the effect is in the other direction. Having a magnetic field could make it easier to keep an atmosphere, all else being equal (which it isn't). A magnetic field diverts the solar wind, and atmospheric ions would spiral around the field lines, which might help keep them near the planet.

Thats assuming that the field was there first. I thought they did measure our magnetic field. Your talking about it right now.  Rotating faster could make it hold the air easier as well. Drafting more as speed goes up. Since we are going the same speed it stays the same. You cant honestly say that density is not a factor. Its applies to everything including the atmosphere resistance. When lightning strikes is when there a bigger differential of electron build up which is measurable and detectable. During all that. Yes it might keep things closer that only prove what I'm saying. The density of the matter around us has electrical properties. Everything has electrical properties. The changes in electrical properties causes a magnetic attraction. This looks like pressure differentials. Observations of this would do exactly what your describing. This is all happening at the same time. You cant have one without the other.

You can measure this on other planets that do the same thing and have lighting just like we do. The common denominator even in electrical charge choose whats stronger. The build up of electrons is more density and its attracted to the opposite which is less electrons or less density. Then the lightning strikes.

Density, Its what its made of.

What does pressures and temperatures effect?

Density of everything like the periodic table of elements.

We cant go into certain density environments because of our own density.

Like the bottom of the Ocean or Space. We physically have to protect ourselves from density even. 

An ampere or coulomb is the density of electrons in a given space

I'm coming up with this as I go.

Wind is measured at a point on the surface of earth. The surface is moving faster at the equator in a direction then half way up to the pole. If wind is the differential from land to air speed the its not the total air speed to the rest of the earths air. It does matter. 

So all information that is based upon wind is assumed information when trying to compare it to the entire planet. 

So it looks like the north pole has faster moving air in comparison to the equator.

Its only going in a direction at a speed just faster or slower depending on the direction then the land that its compared to. 

The Coriolis Effect is drafting

Our solar system does the same thing with density changes by solar wind.

Density moving in a direction.

Belief is the hardest thing to get over. So I dont believe anymore. 

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Drafting_(aerodynamics)

The static exchanges are happening all the time between pretty much everything. 

In Motion

So I was wondering if all the planets have magnetic fields. Then I noticed that the planets with the magnetic field have an atmosphere. As the density of the atmosphere increases so does the magnetic field. What if the movement of the planet and atmosphere are what causes this? Static electricity shows that when matter separates there is an attraction of the electrons and if the matter is correct it will give up an electron. This would be a magnetic attraction between none magnetic material correct? So when something is moving it creates a lower density behind it like drafting. This lower density has less total electrical properties. In electricity the higher the voltage the stronger it is. The higher density the stronger it is. So could the density of the atmosphere combined with the airspeed and land speed differential cause the same magnetic attraction as static when the air separate's from the ground leaving a magnetic charge behind? Lightning always goes to ground or a lower charge attracting the electron to the earth like CO2 exiting a fire extinguisher leaving some electrons behind on the tube. 

Mercury is the smallest and spinning slow and it doesn't have the same magnetic properties as all the other planets. 

Nascar drafting, Semi drafting, Bicycle drafting, Airplane wing drafting, Rockets use pressure behind it to displace matter, this all seems a bit obvious that density moves stuff and density is based upon total electrical properties not if its a gas or solid.

We are constantly in contact with everything all the way outside our own solar system. The density is the common denominator between everything in existence. Not vacuum or pressure or gas or solid by themselves. They all have this same trait. 

Like a magnetic grid lock