CanadaAotS

Ohhhhh

Yes that makes sense then.

That unfortanetly doesnt help me -_-'

Some math showing what I did wrong in get ~3m/s would be good lol

A billion years? They MUST have thought of something to get to the next galaxy. A billion years is a lot of time... and a billion years for technology to develop is an extremely long time.

So, any estimates on how long till we having quantum computers?

I'm thinking 15 yrs probably. We'll probably hit the processor speed "wall" soon with our current computer chips, and when that happens funding will be poured into possible alternatives...

Well Said

Isnt that egotistical

It may be possible that we are the most advanced civilization in our galaxy (or at least, any other civilzations are a million or less years ahead).

How about inter-galactic travel?

statistically, there HAS to be intelligent life in the universe. If not in our galaxy, then perhaps in another. If they had a 1 billion yr head start then I'm sure they could make it intergalactically

exactly... thats it, I'm drawing a diagram! lol

EDIT: damn photobucket... it made my diagram alot smaller I dont know if you are able to read it.

Anyways the small circle with the black dot is the birds-eye view of the tunnel. It forms a 'ring' and inside the ring charges cancel each other out (2 dimensional version of a sphere). This means that the object falling down the tunnel isnt effected by the sides at all. The bigger circle shows the front view where the only force acting on the object is the vertical pull of gravity.

By the way, the object would (apparently) be going at 3 m/s when it reached the center. I think this is wrong though... check out my thread where I try to figure it out here

Edit: What are you doing reading Fox 'news' anyway?

Good point lol

The strong force does not hold electrons to their orbits, the magnetic charge (pos neg) between the proton and electron does.

And if the green squiggles are magnetic, then why do they connnect protons to neutrons? the strong force does that...

Yay! thanks

so...

[math]v = \sqrt{\frac{GM_e}{{r_e}^2}}[/math]

I wasnt THAT far off.

[math]v = \sqrt{\frac{(6.673 \mbox{ x } 10^{-11})\cdot (5.9742 \mbox{ x } 10^{24})}{6378100^2}}[/math]

[math]v = 3.13 ms^{-1}[/math]

wtf?!?

Is this right? I thought you'd be going ALOT faster...

You cant have 2 of the strong force poles "working" and the others just sitting back in the nuclei...

I'm pretty sure you wouldn't be able to walk on the cylinder walls for the same reason that gravity wouldn't let you walk on the walls of a sphere from the inside.

Try looking at how the forces work from birds eye view (only looking laterally).

What you get is the object inside a ring. This is the 2D analogy of charges canceling out in a sphere. This means that laterally, no forces are effecting the object. When you look at it from a front view, the earth is still pulling down to the center so all you have is a vertical force.

yah I realize that now that I look. result is the same though, just screwed up the units

Well I've been told that my whole change in gravity is wrong lol.

Apparently gravity decreases linearly from the surface to the center

so...

[math]\frac{dF_g}{dt} = \frac{F_g}{r_e} = \frac{686N}{6378100m}[/math]

So force of gravity is dropping at -1.0756 x 10^-4 N/s

Acceleration = Force / mass

[math]a = \frac{F_g}{m_o}[/math]

[math]\frac{da}{dt} = \frac{\frac{dm_o}{dt}*{F_g} - \frac{dF_g}{dt}*m_o}{{m_o}^2}[/math]

I think I'm still right with change in mass being 0. plus I can substitute 1.0756 x 10^-4 N/s for [math]\frac{dF_g}{dt}[/math]

[math]\frac{da}{dt} = \frac{1.0756\cdot 10^{-4} Ns^{-1}}{m_o}[/math]

Again things simplify nicely the [math]m_o[/math]'s cancel out leaving me with a nice equation. When I put 70 kg in for mass of object I get da/dt equaling [math]1.5365*10^{-6} ms^{-3}[/math]

And now I'm stuck again lol... I know I have to take an integral somewhere here because I have to get from acceleration equation to velocity.

you must be missing an equation. I'm sure with 3 variables you'd need 3 equations...

EDIT: nvr mind if you had 3 equations it wouldnt be inequality, you'd just solve it -_-' lol

Apt title... hehe

Anyways, I was trying to do some calculations based on the "Tunnel Through Earth" thread.

I wanted to actually find out how fast an object, that was dropped from earths surface to the center, would be going.

This involves Physics, but its more math intensive, so I put it in Math. If that rubs anyone the wrong way, then move it

Earths Radius: 6378100 m

Earth Mass: 5.9742 x 10^24 kg

Object (Sphere with app. human mass): 70 kg

Now, I'm thinking that throughout the fall the force of gravity is constantly changing.

[math]F_g = \frac{G*m_e*m_o}{{r_e}^2}[/math]

So I need to find out what [math]\frac{dF_g}{dt}[/math] is. (Force of gravity changing over time)

[math]\frac{dF_g}{dt} = \frac{({r_e}^2)*(G*m_e*m_o)' - (G*m_e*m_o)*({r_e}^2)'}{{r_e}^4}[/math]

[math]\frac{dF_g}{dt} = \frac{({r_e}^2)*(G*(\frac{dm_e}{dt}*m_o + \frac{dm_o}{dt}*m_e)) - (G*m_e*m_o)*2r_e*\frac{dr_e}{dt}}{{r_e}^4}[/math]

Now I think the change in masses are all 0 (mass never changes). I can probably simplify alot with that because it cancels out [math]\frac{dm_e}{dt}*m_o + \frac{dm_o}{dt}*m_e[/math] completely. I'll try fixing it up a bit...

[math]\frac{dF_g}{dt} = \frac{-2Gm_om_e\frac{dr_e}{dt}}{{r_e}^3}[/math]

Well, that worked out better then I thought it would

Not sure how to proceed from here...

I think I need acceleration or something so that I can take the integral to get velocity. But I'm in the dark... never took Physics Calculus, just regular Calculus lol

Pointing me in the right direction would be great

Thats good. I like it when I'm not completely wrong

I think you are confused with "electron shells" and electron energy levels.

An electron shell is a shell of an atom, and only the outtermost shell is effected at any one time, the inner shells are full.

However, when an electron loses energy or gains energy it jumps (or lowers) its energy level.

I think this is where you got mixed up.

(Unless I'm wrong as well lol)

er...

CO2 and methane are 2.

Water Vapour as well.

pffft fine, reproduce then evolve

maybe not the moon bacteria, but theres a very good chance that bacteria left on the rovers can survive and reproduce on mars.

The enviroment that NASA created forced them to sustain themselves on the rovers themselves. I'll go look it up in Discover magazine archives and quote it if you like.

EDIT:

Found it here

Requires a membership though, so I'll just quote it.

First' date=' however, you must be decontaminated. A visitor places one foot, then the other, into an automatic shoe scrubber, a box on the floor with spinning bristles that flagellate the soles for a minute or so. A guide provides blue paper booties to slip over shoes, a blue shower cap to cover hair, and a white gown, made of paper with a shiny cling-free coating, to wear over your clothing. Finally, an air shower—a glass booth with several nozzles blowing furiously. Then and only then, ruffled but purified, may you enter. Inside the facility, a company of blue-bootied, shower-capped, paper-gowned technicians fuss over the skeletons of spacecraft-to-be. The room is arid as a desert, the humidity a drastically low 42 percent. The floors are regularly scrubbed to remove dander and bacteria. NASA’s intent is to create an environment hostile to any microbes that might hitch a ride aboard the outbound spacecraft yet benign to the human engineers who must assemble these delicate vehicles. If that sounds like an impossibility, it is. Welcome to the paradox of planetary protection.

 

In 1967, inspired by a new international outer-space treaty, the space-racing nations of the world agreed to spare no effort in preventing the potential spread of organisms from one moon or planet to another. At NASA, this mandate evolved into an official planetary protection policy, a Sisyphean effort to shield the universe from the people exploring it.

 

Traditionally, the assumed beneficiary of planetary protection has been the planet Earth. We’ve all seen the movies, we know the disaster scenarios: Extraterrestrial spores return from outer space, and in no time the citizens of Earth are heaps of dust or brain-dead zombies. Accordingly, NASA has developed an elaborate quarantine protocol to handle soil samples retrieved from other planets—comforting, perhaps, but statistically of marginal value. Contagion spreads from the haves to the have-nots, and so far as scientists have yet determined, Earth is the only planet with life to give. Besides, virtually all the spacecraft that leave Earth depart on one-way missions: They drift eternally through interstellar space, or they burn up in foreign atmospheres, or they sit on Mars, never rusting, transmitting data until their batteries fade away. Among all the lawns in the cosmos, ours is the one with dandelions, and the wind is blowing outward.

 

No, if anybody should be worried about biocontamination, it’s our planetary neighbors. In the coming decade, NASA has scheduled no less than four major missions to Mars to grope for hints of water or life. Down the road is a robot that will drill below the icy surface of the Jovian moon Europa to probe a briny ocean believed to exist there, and the Titan Biological Explorer, which will plumb the atmosphere of the Saturnian moon Titan for the chemical precursors of life. Interplanetary traffic is picking up, and NASA would like to avoid going down in history as the agency that accidentally turned the Red Planet green with life.

 

But the true worry isn’t ecological; it’s epistemological. Any earthly contamination—of the Martian soil or of the instruments sent to study it—would seriously muddy the multibillion-dollar hunt for extraterrestrial life. As Kenneth Nealson, a University of Southern California geobiologist and Jet Propulsion Laboratory visiting scientist, recently told the journal Nature: “The field is haunted by thinking you’ve detected life on Mars and finding that it’s Escherichia coli from Pasadena.” As it turns out, that fear is well founded. Not only does microbial life survive in the Spacecraft Assembly Facility; in some cases it thrives there. There is no question whether we’re exporting life into the cosmos—we absolutely are. What’s left to determine is exactly what kind of life is emigrating and how far it is spreading.

[/quote']

 

In recent years NASA biologists have discovered numerous species of microbes living on the doorstep to the cosmos—in spacecraft-assembly facilities' date=' on rovers, orbiters, and flight-ready circuit boards, and aboard the International Space Station. Some are commonplace species; others are entirely new and appear to have adapted to—and perhaps even evolved in—the harsh conditions that NASA decontaminators have devised expressly to eliminate them. Now they’re off to Mars, Saturn, and Europa. Almost certainly a few are already there, alive, quietly waiting for their tiny moment in the sun

 

BACILLUS SAFENSIS

 

Highly resistant to gamma and UV radiation, B. safensis is named for the Jet Propulsion Laboratory’s Spacecraft Assembly Facility (SAF), in which it lives. It can also be found on the current Mars rovers, Spirit and Opportunity.

 

BACILLUS SUBTILIS

 

This spore-forming bacterium is common in soils, dust, and watery habitats—and in the assembly facilities at the Jet Propulsion Laboratory and the Kennedy Space Center, as well as aboard the Mars Odyssey orbiter.

 

BACILLUS NEALSONII

 

A double-spore coating makes this bac-terium especially resistant to gamma radiation, one of the chief obstacles to any potential life on Mars. B. nealsonii, a new species, is particularly well adapted to the dry environment of the Jet Propulsion Laboratory SAF, where it was first discovered.

 

BACILLUS ODYSSEYI

 

A new species, B. odysseyi is one of a dozen microbes found on the surface of the Mars Odyssey orbiter, which has been circling Mars since October 2001. Protected by an extra spore layer, it is 10 times more resistant than B. subtilis to gamma radiation and desiccation.

 

BACILLUS PUMILIS

 

The likely evolutionary ancestor of B. safensis (above), this bacterium has been found in NASA’s spacecraft-assembly facilities and on Mars Odyssey and current Mars rovers. The microbe derives energy from aluminum and titanium; in spore form, it eludes the standard methods of life detection.

 

BACILLUS CEREUS

 

Like B. pumilis and B. subtilis, the spore-forming B. cereus is commonplace in terrestrial habitats, in harsh NASA environments, and—perhaps increasingly—elsewhere in the universe. It has been found living in the intestines of arthropods and in the water supply of the Mir space station.

[/quote']

 

So as you can see, mars is a cake walk for such organisms, and if they reproduce on mars they will climatize themselves to it.

 

I think its awesome that life has pretty much started on mars... there's no doubt about it

nah, the current poll is better. Thats what the "I Don't Know" section is for.

They could've made "I dont know which to believe" or "I dont know what evolution theory is" as two seperate sections to make it a bit more specific I guess

I love that "Magic Fire" dust that makes rainbow coloured fires

I actually think hes right on this. Or at least barking up the right tree, I do know that in making computer chips they make electron holes or something like that for semi-conductors...

What hes saying sounds familar

The diagrams dont help at all though

And I thought I taught you about the magical world of quote tags alpha?!? lol

I wouldnt be surprised if somehow, the few million bacteria or so that was left on equipment left on the moon and/or mars has somehow evolved itself and is reproducing...

Life (especially those damn hardy bacteria lol) tend to adapt their way out of extremely intense enviroments.

The rovers that were sent to mars were subjected to extreme sanitization... similar to being out in space actually. They put them in a vacuum, put them through intense radiation etc. to kill off any lifeforms since they didnt want to 'infect' mars with our bacteria

Turns out they made an environment perfect for bacteria to live through space... Radiation resistant, vacuum resistant

These super bacteria are probably colonizing mars as we speak

you can make your own stress ball with a balloon and corn starch (or flour or sand).

It's probably the lowest cost solution. Another one could be silly putty placed in a condom lmao.

And (I hope) the condom will be alot more durable then a balloon. haha