Gravity

[Yvtq8k3n]

I was thinking and got the following ideia.

Imagine 2 planets and an asteroid.

Both A and B have the same speeds and orbit around their suns. To make things more interesting there are 2 ways B can spin clockwise or counterclockwise.

I hope u guys understanded everthing so far.

So my question is, is this prepetual motion? In my opinion the asteroide will be "stuck" while moving in this kind of loop.

[Strange]

I hope u guys understanded everthing so far.

 

Not really. You seem to have two suns with a planet in orbit around each. And an asteroid somewhere in between them.

 

To work out anything about these orbits you would need to know their masses and distances. I don't understand what the asteroid is doing. Which way is it moving?

 

 

 

So my question is, is this prepetual motion?

 

An object in a stable orbit can stay there for a very long time (hence "stable orbit"). But probably not forever there will be tidal losses and interactions with other objects which will eventually change the orbit.

[Yvtq8k3n]

Hep i forget to say that both planets have the same mass so both have the same gravity.

Basicaly the asteroide is being affected by both gravitys from planet A as planet B.

Don't forget this is teoric, it is quite improvavel that this may occour in our universe.

 

I will try to explain better. The asteroid is being affect by the 2 gravitys however when the plannets move the forces that are being applied on the asteroide change. Sometimes the force that the gravity of A applys on asteroid is higher then B so the asteroid will be dragged by A. But after a "few moments" the planet A starts to lose is force and there is when plannet B starts to gain, so the asteroid is being dragged to B.

 

However i dont know which direction B should have to spin in order to this effect to work.

 

This is the only i ideia i had to "gain energy" through the gravity. As long as the system works and there isnt any external forces i beliave this is possible.

Edited June 30, 2016 by Yvtq8k3n

[Strange]

OK. SO I think you are thinking the asteroid will be pulled backwards and forwards between the planets?

 

Some of the problems with this are:

 

1. The effect of the planets will be minute compared to the suns. For example, the mass of Jupiter (the largest planet in the solar system) is about 1,000th of the mass of the sun.

 

2. The system is not stable. As soon as the asteroid moves one way or another it will experience a greater gravitational force from the sun & planet on that side (and less from the other). This will eventually mean it falls towards (and possibly into orbit around) one of the suns. Note that the only way of calculating what happens in this sort of N-body system is through simulation

 

3. If you could extract energy from the asteroid, you have to remember that it will affect the planets so you are removing energy from the whole system. This would, in the very long term, affect the orbits of the planets.

Edited June 30, 2016 by Strange

[Janus]

Hep i forget to say that both planets have the same mass so both have the same gravity.

Basicaly the asteroide is being affected by both gravitys from planet A as planet B.

Don't forget this is teoric, it is quite improvavel that this may occour in our universe.

 

I will try to explain better. The asteroid is being affect by the 2 gravitys however when the plannets move the forces that are being applied on the asteroide change. Sometimes the force that the gravity of A applys on asteroid is higher then B so the asteroid will be dragged by A. But after a "few moments" the planet A starts to lose is force and there is when plannet B starts to gain, so the asteroid is being dragged to B.

 

However i dont know which direction B should have to spin in order to this effect to work.

 

This is the only i ideia i had to "gain energy" through the gravity. As long as the system works and there isnt any external forces i beliave this is possible.

A couple of points to add to what Strange has said.

 

(1) The asteroid is not just attracted to the planets but also to the Suns. This is important because the planet don't just orbit the Suns, but the each Sun and planet orbit a common barycenter. The net effect is that when the planet is at its closest to the asteroid, the Sun actual moves a bit further away. This means that total gravitational effect of the sun and planet on the Asteroid does not change as the planet orbits.

(2)Now if the Suns are close enough to each other ( In which case, the Sun planet pairs themselves would have to be orbiting a common barycenter located at the asteroid's position), it is possible for the planets to have a perturbing effect on the asteroid. But, as Strange has also pointed out, the asteroid is really not stable where it is, any perturbation will cause it to drift out of position and fall towards one of the Sun-planet pairs. (remember, the total net gravitational pull of each pair is the same no matter what point of the orbit the planets are in. So if one plant perturbs the asteroid even the least bit towards one of the pairs, that pairs total gravity pull will now be stronger than the other pair's, and it will move towards it. This just makes the difference greater and increases it rate of fall towards the one pair)

You can compare it to a marble sitting on the very top of a smooth bump. As long as it stays balanced exactly at the apex it will remain there, but the slightest nudge will cause it to roll down one side of the bump or another.

 

The gist is that if you ever think that you've uncovered a way to get energy for nothing, you have overlooked something.

[Yvtq8k3n]

 

Not really. You seem to have two suns with a planet in orbit around each. And an asteroid somewhere in between them.

 

To work out anything about these orbits you would need to know their masses and distances. I don't understand what the asteroid is doing. Which way is it moving?

 

 

An object in a stable orbit can stay there for a very long time (hence "stable orbit"). But probably not forever there will be tidal losses and interactions with other objects which will eventually change the orbit.

 

 

Hep i forget to say that both planets have the same mass so both have the same gravity.

Basicaly the asteroide is being affected by both gravitys from planet A as planet B.

Don't forget this is teoric, it is quite improvavel that this may occour in our universe.

 

I will try to explain better. The asteroid is being affect by the 2 gravitys however when the plannets move the forces that are being applied on the asteroide change. Sometimes the force that the gravity of A applys on asteroid is higher then B so the asteroid will be dragged by A. But after a "few moments" the planet A starts to lose is force and there is when plannet B starts to gain, so the asteroid is being dragged to B.

 

However i dont know which direction B should have to spin in order to this effect to work.

 

This is the only i ideia i had to "gain energy" through the gravity. As long as the system works and there isnt any external forces i beliave this is possible.

I was quite happy whit the answers i forget that the suns have an mass so they also interfer, so basicaly it woudlnt work. Gj Srange. About the 3 statement that u said, if i some how slow down the moon the plannet will lose enegry(like spin less).

 

Atom thx for explaining the net effect, i learned a new thing today.

 

However even if it is imposible why should i stop trying?

[Strange]

However even if it is imposible why should i stop trying?

 

You could keep trying. As you say, it is a good way of learning.