m@ Posted September 5, 2003 Share Posted September 5, 2003 Ok, heres the story. I am doing a group project in biology, studying pill bugs, sow bugs but it you don't really have to know what bug it is to answer my question. Ok, we would be studying which foods these bugs would prefer. There scavengers so they eat a large variety of foods. Now the lab would include giving these bugs a choice of what to eat in a choice box. Now this "smart" group decides, lets see if they like dead plants and live plants. I am in awe how somebody can really think a pill bug, a scavenger, can tell the difference. They also thought, oh what if we put peroni in it. You can see what pain I'm in. Now there not doing the peroni thing but they are doing one thing that makes me go absolutely insane. They want to make the control for the data, get this, pill bug food. Ok so lets review what we have again, we are comparing which of the following foods that a pill bug prefers: 1. A live plant: Fair enough, but its sort of stupid that their defrenciating live from dead. 2. A dead plant: Ok, um these bugs are scavengers, do you really think that they are going to tell the difference between the fact that its alive or not. The amount of glucose might be slightly more but it really doesn't make that much of a difference. Well, from my opinion. 3. Peperoni: ok maybe not but i just wanted you to see the intellegence of one of these group members. 4. Some sort of meat: Ok, another thing that bothered me, they were going to take some turkey, leave it outside over the weak end, and then use it. Wow, don't even get me started. 5. Pill bug food: Yah makes alot of sense (not), why don't we give them a food that scientists have researched to be their perfect diet. Then we could put it into our lab to make sure they stay their and eat it and corrupt our data. But to make this the control, it makes me wonder how many people get into honors biology. The control should be no food and in the CENTER of the choice box. The reason i say it should be in the center was because they were planning to put it in the bottom right corner. Now, you can see, that this is making me go absolutely insane. First of all, why does this have to happen to me? What did a nice smart kid do to anybody to make him suffer like this? Now I would like lots of replies saying that you agree with me and why you do and maybe your position in school or if you are some sort of scientist. Please address the fact that they want to use food as a control!! NO food should be the control thanks for holding up and reading this Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dudde Posted September 6, 2003 Share Posted September 6, 2003 in future posts, please refrain from using caps (yelling) and keep the blatant insulting of your peers at a minimum thanks;) also, the experiment wasn't to find out if the bugs can tell the difference, so which would they prefer? so a live plant and a dead plant may be a perfectly logical choice to use you can't just use plants, which are found everywhere in nature, so pepperoni or whatnot can also be used, maybe to see if the bugs preferred processed meat to natural foods? although I'm willing to bet my life savings ($0.16 currently) that the bugs will pick the plants because of the more nutrient value (which could very well be the reason the bugs will eat food, more substance for less work) I do agree that pill bug food is not the greatest idea for a control however, because it has been tested to find the best mix of whatever for the bugs....though you could try it anyway to see if they still like natural over artificial? I'm not real big on biology though;) so you'll have to wait for blike or sayo Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
m@ Posted September 6, 2003 Author Share Posted September 6, 2003 Well the idea was to get an idea of which foods in it diet it prefered more. There is not much difference between a dead plant and a live plant. Well of course they are but it could make alot more sense to use to spots of the choice box deticated to meat and plants, weather decaying or not, it doesn't matter. But as far as the pill bug food goes, it would corrupt the data, because it may be a mix. And I'll stop using caps from now on. I'll save them for the gaming community. I'd do that winking symbol but i can't find it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
m@ Posted September 6, 2003 Author Share Posted September 6, 2003 Woops, of course theres a difference between a live and dead plant, but i don't think there's much contrast between the 2 from a pill bugs perspective. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dudde Posted September 6, 2003 Share Posted September 6, 2003 ? ; ) there's the winkin' dude. you have a point, there are several kinds of foods (probably, I don't know bugs man) so try and convince your group to use like..certain KINDS of plants and meats, vegetables and fruits and whatever you can find I don't think you should take in the data from another scientist (bug food) you're quite correct Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JaKiri Posted September 6, 2003 Share Posted September 6, 2003 Saying 'live plant' and 'dead plant' as seperate things is about as useful as saying 'food'; I'd presume that 'different types of plants' was the condition undergoing testing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
m@ Posted September 6, 2003 Author Share Posted September 6, 2003 exactly... thanks guys....or girls....either way thanks, il ask the group Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JaKiri Posted September 6, 2003 Share Posted September 6, 2003 Oh, and a control should be, say, a brick or something rather than just nothing. Something that shares all the properties of the things you're testing apart from the variable. Paper, or similar. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
m@ Posted September 6, 2003 Author Share Posted September 6, 2003 A brick....Why a brick, do you mean that just to have the texture of the other foods or something? Ah makes sense. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dudde Posted September 6, 2003 Share Posted September 6, 2003 to be sure the bugs aren't just going by feel ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
m@ Posted September 6, 2003 Author Share Posted September 6, 2003 good point......I've discussed this with one of the group members, we have decided that I will provide the procedure, all of your support has pretty much convinced him. More Input=GREAT. (i had to use the caps im sorry, lol) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JaKiri Posted September 6, 2003 Share Posted September 6, 2003 Getting a control/test subjects is pretty easy. You just have to sit down and think 'What am I going to measure?' For instance, if I was measuring the effect certain chemicals had in the water of plants as to respiration, then my control would be identical (plant in water) without the things you're testing (the added chemicals). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dudde Posted September 6, 2003 Share Posted September 6, 2003 right, exactly what MrL said and don't worry about using caps, as long as you don't have entire sentences composed of the things;) (it can be very hard on ones eyes after staring at a photoshop screen for 5 hours) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
m@ Posted September 6, 2003 Author Share Posted September 6, 2003 Another thing, in the choice box, there are five "circles" joined together(didn't know if there were different types). There is a circle in the center and 4 other circles attached to it, in each corner. Sort of like the arrangement of the number five on dice except that the circles are joined. Now right now, we have the following foods and control: 1. Roast beef. 2. A plant. 3. Strawberrys or some fruit. and the control: 4. Paper or something(i don't know). I am thinking of placing each food and control in each corner of the choice box, then leaving the center circle free, which would be the initial start of the pill bugs location. Does this make sense or should the control be in the middle? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
m@ Posted September 6, 2003 Author Share Posted September 6, 2003 i might also use another food if anybody recomends a good one Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
YT2095 Posted September 7, 2003 Share Posted September 7, 2003 start them all from an equidistant place from each sample (the middle) then watch them. if your going to use paper though, make sure it`s not something they`de goto for other reasons, (shade, rest, mating etc...) so maybe tape down the edges so they cant get under it Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
m@ Posted September 7, 2003 Author Share Posted September 7, 2003 Does anybody know a better solution to the control, paper could work but it could add some more factors that could mess up our data, for example a pill bug gets stuck or something i don't know. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
m@ Posted September 7, 2003 Author Share Posted September 7, 2003 this is the procedure so far Procedure 1. The strawberries were cut up and placed in it's own corner of the choice box. 2. This was repeated with the plant, and potatoe. 3. Then, the non-nutritional material was placed in it's own corner. 4. The pill bugs were placed in the center of the choice box. 5. The timer was started. 6. The pill bugs were observed. 7. After five minutes, the pill bug's locations was recorded. 8. Steps 6 and 7 were repeated six more times. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Create an account or sign in to comment
You need to be a member in order to leave a comment
Create an account
Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!
Register a new accountSign in
Already have an account? Sign in here.
Sign In Now