# simplex

Members

12

1. ## The Wright brothers’ patent: Plane stabilized in roll by a pendulum. It seems impossible.

You are a big idiot.
2. ## The Wright brothers’ patent: Plane stabilized in roll by a pendulum. It seems impossible.

I am not talking with idiots. I do not answer stupid questions.
3. ## The Wright brothers’ patent: Plane stabilized in roll by a pendulum. It seems impossible.

"The turn and slip indicator can be referred to as the turn and bank indicator, although the instrument does not respond directly to bank angle." (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Turn_and_slip_indicator) If the plane takes a turn in a coordinated way the bubble of air will rest in the middle of the tube regardless the bank angle. A pendulum hanging from the ceiling of the plane will do the same thing. It will point toward the floor of the airplane (the rod stays perpendicular to the longitudinal and transverse axes of the airplane) no matter of the roll angle, assuming the centripetal acceleration during the turn remains constant. However, neither the bubble nor the pendulum can say anything about the bank angle and in consequence they can not be used as governors which correct the unwanted roll. In the case of the Wright brothers, they correct the roll with a pendulum! The turn and slip indicator is one more piece of experimental evidence that a pendulum or a bubble can not be used for measuring the bank angle of an airplane.
4. ## The Wright brothers’ patent: Plane stabilized in roll by a pendulum. It seems impossible.

That is a Turn and slip indicator (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Turn_and_slip_indicator). It works using gyroscopes. It has nothing to do with the pendulum of the Wright brothers.
5. ## The Wright brothers’ patent: Plane stabilized in roll by a pendulum. It seems impossible.

I am the victim of an idiot.
6. ## The Wright brothers’ patent: Plane stabilized in roll by a pendulum. It seems impossible.

You are a total ignorant. You are not even able to write the equation of a simple pendulum with a static pivot. You wrecked the topic I opened. CLOSE IT PLEASE, DELETE IT. I did not know that the level of moderators on this forum is so low from the technical point of view. What is your background. Have you graduated a technical university?
7. ## The Wright brothers’ patent: Plane stabilized in roll by a pendulum. It seems impossible.

Useless discussion that goes to nowhere. I want this topic deleted.
8. ## The Wright brothers’ patent: Plane stabilized in roll by a pendulum. It seems impossible.

Without the book we have no base for any discussion so I propose this topic should be closed. What copyright restrictions? There is no copyright restriction. Fore somebody who reads the first post, there is no way to take a look at the Patent no. 1,075,533 and the comments made there about it and other patents.
9. ## The Wright brothers’ patent: Plane stabilized in roll by a pendulum. It seems impossible.

Get a life man. Write to the author and ask him if the book can be freely distributed. You are really annoying. I did not copy the book, I just quoted it.
10. ## The Wright brothers’ patent: Plane stabilized in roll by a pendulum. It seems impossible.

1) The book is free. I found it here: http://wright1903dec17.altervista.org/Wright-patents.htm 2) I have just made an experiment with a simple pendulum built by me. While moving its suspension point to the left or to the right, the trajectory of the bob is always random. There is no relation between the degree of rotation of the pivot and the position of the rod relative to the vertical of the place. In fact, on the gif animation I posted, it is quite visible, immediately after the moment the suspension point starts to move form the point (0, -1) to the right, that the bob travels also to the right. However, after the second pass of the pivot through (0, -1) the bob goes to the left, despite the fact the pivot performs the same movement as immediately after the start. It is a total mess. Such a "stabilizer" can not work. I should have made the experiment by myself before opening this topic not after.
11. ## The Wright brothers’ patent: Plane stabilized in roll by a pendulum. It seems impossible.

1) That document I posted appears to be free. There is no restriction on it. Also, the patents of the two brothers are freely available on the net. 2) I am not talking about the acceleration of the pivot along the longitudinal axis of the plane but about its centripetal acceleration as the plane rotates to the left or to the right. Even if the rotation movement is at a constant speed (which is not the case with inside an airplane) the acceleration of the pivot will not be zero (see the animation below)! The random trajectory of a pendulum when its pivot rotates at constant speed about the point (0, 0). Source: https://www.maplesoft.com/applications/view.aspx?SID=4888&view=html
12. ## The Wright brothers’ patent: Plane stabilized in roll by a pendulum. It seems impossible.

The Wright brothers’ patent: "Plane stabilized in roll by a pendulum" (US Patent no. 1,075,533). It seems impossible. "The pendulum rocket fallacy is a common fundamental misunderstanding of the mechanics of rocket flight and how rockets remain on a stable trajectory." Robert Goddard fell into this trap as late as March 16, 1926 when he tested a liquid fuel rocket. The Wright brothers filed their US Patent no. 1,075,533 in February 1908, tested the stabilizer in December 1913 and it worked flawlessly. Orville Wright even got a prize for his achievement (see the book below). How is it possible? A pendulum with its pivot in an accelerated movement (like inside an airplane) does not tend to align to the vertical and can not be used as a reference like a gyroscope. Is there another case when somebody succeed in stabilizing a plane in roll using a pendulum? The 5 Wright brothers' patents: - The US patent no. 821,393, granted on May 22, 1906, and its foreign versions, claim: (1) the method of wing warping, in particular, and the ailerons (already invented in 1868 by M. P. W. Boulton), in general, for stabilizing an aeroplane type machine in roll, (2) a movable vertical tail aimed at counteracting the adverse yaw generated by twisting the main wings, (3) a flexible front elevator for maintaining the pitch stability of the same machine, (4) various constructive details. - The French patent no. 384.124, published on March 30, 1908, and its foreign versions, claim two more vertical rudders, placed in front of the main wings, one fixed and the other mobile. They were aimed at better counteracting the adverse yaw. - The French patent no. 384.125, published on March 30, 1908, and its foreign versions, claim two additional vertical rudders, placed close to the tips of the main wings. Their purpose was also for eliminating the adverse yaw. -> The US Patent no. 1,075,533, granted on October 14, 1913, and its foreign versions, claim automatic stabilization mechanisms: in roll, driven by a pendulum, and in pitch, governed by wind vanes (two models are proposed). - The US patent no. 908,929 - “Mechanism for Flexing the Rudder of a Flying Machine or the Like”, granted on January 5, 1909, and its foreign versions, claim systems aimed at flexing the rudders of an aeroplane type machine for the purpose of modifying their lift. The book contains the patents of the Wright brothers in full and can be downloaded from here: removed by moderator due to copyright restrictions
×