Moontanman Posted July 13, 2014 Share Posted July 13, 2014 The other night I was playing around with a couple of magnets I have, they are very powerful and were sold as toys for a short time but injuries to kids caused them to be pulled off the market. The magnets are oblong, thinker in the middle than the ends, about 2" long and maybe 3/4 of an inch think at the middle. The poles are centered in the middle instead of the ends. The idea of them being a toy was that you could throw them in the air and they would find each other and orbit each other for a fraction of a second. They make a rattling noise as they come together and orbit each other. I was eating boiled eggs, yes I like boiled eggs, and I put an egg that had yet to have it's shell removed and noticed the egg moved toward the magnet. I picked them up and found the magnet and the egg had an effect on each other, it was weak but but real. How or why would a magnet have any effect on a boiled chicken egg? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Acme Posted July 13, 2014 Share Posted July 13, 2014 Iron? 1.6mg of iron in an easy to love hard-boiled large chicken egg according to this source. >> Hard boiled egg nutrition Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John Cuthber Posted July 13, 2014 Share Posted July 13, 2014 The iron in an egg isn't there as the metal. Depending on the chemistry it might be diamagnetic (i.e. repelled by a magnet). However http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pyrrhotite and "When eggs are cooked for a long time, the yolk's surface may turn green. This is due to iron(II) sulfide which forms as iron from the yolk meets hydrogen sulfide released from the egg white by the heat" from http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Iron(II)_sulfide Though I'm surprised to find that the effect is big enough to see. Water- which makes up most of the mass of an egg is diamagnetic, and I'd expect that effect to dominate. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
imatfaal Posted July 13, 2014 Share Posted July 13, 2014 John - what about the Calcium Carbonate in the shell? Can't really find whether it would have an effect (wouldn't have thought so). I have tried a google and I just get pages and pages of adverts for gizmos that supposedly unclog pipes Moon. I have tried to recreate the observation without success. I didn't have a hard-boiled egg but tried with a fresh one. The magnets are those fiendishly strong ball magnets (which can easily support 500 times their own weight - perhaps much more) . I didn't get the least inkling of an attraction or reupulsion. Will upload results. Is it possible the act of boiling changes something? Sounds very unlikely. Need for more observational evidence - Moon you need to boil, test, record and eat more eggs. Just not too many ... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John Cuthber Posted July 13, 2014 Share Posted July 13, 2014 Te (lack of) a magnetic effect with calcium carbonate is surprisingly well documented from the days before they invented plastic. http://nvlpubs.nist.gov/nistpubs/bulletin/02/nbsbulletinv2n1p87_A2b.pdf page 89 The strange thing about the original observation is that not many things are anything other than diamagnetic. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
imatfaal Posted July 13, 2014 Share Posted July 13, 2014 What a fantastic source - and a great name === No sign of attraction or repulsion Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bill Angel Posted July 13, 2014 Share Posted July 13, 2014 I don't know how the chemical composition of an egg compares with the chemical composition of a human head, but one's head does not get jerked around when it is situated in the field produced by the powerful magnets of an MRI machine. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
moth Posted July 13, 2014 Share Posted July 13, 2014 If you know somebody with a magnetic induction heating element, you could try cooking the egg in a glass bowl. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Acme Posted July 13, 2014 Share Posted July 13, 2014 I don't know how the chemical composition of an egg compares with the chemical composition of a human head, but one's head does not get jerked around when it is situated in the field produced by the powerful magnets of an MRI machine. No it does not. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John Cuthber Posted July 13, 2014 Share Posted July 13, 2014 I don't know how the chemical composition of an egg compares with the chemical composition of a human head, probably more similar than most of us like to think. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moontanman Posted July 13, 2014 Author Share Posted July 13, 2014 I plan to try it again, I'll video it if possible, it puzzles me greatly. The magnets are powerful enough to affect each other on a smooth table 12" apart, they do not have a flat side but are amazingly difficult to pull apart or push together... They are ceramic not metal Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Acme Posted July 14, 2014 Share Posted July 14, 2014 I plan to try it again, I'll video it if possible, it puzzles me greatly. The magnets are powerful enough to affect each other on a smooth table 12" apart, they do not have a flat side but are amazingly difficult to pull apart or push together... They are ceramic not metal Good idea. If these are your magnets, they are hematite and still widely available for sale. Magnetic Rattlesnake Eggs Other adverts: magnet eggs Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moontanman Posted July 14, 2014 Author Share Posted July 14, 2014 Good idea. If these are your magnets, they are hematite and still widely available for sale. Magnetic Rattlesnake Eggs Other adverts: magnet eggs Yes that is them, I was under the impression they had been taken off the market, I have an obsession with magnets and lasers, I'll try and repeat the experiment and let you guys know how it went. Thanks for the links, I have been wanting some of the putty stuff that eats magnets, have you seen that stuff? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Acme Posted July 14, 2014 Share Posted July 14, 2014 Yes that is them, I was under the impression they had been taken off the market, I have an obsession with magnets and lasers, I'll try and repeat the experiment and let you guys know how it went. Thanks for the links, I have been wanting some of the putty stuff that eats magnets, have you seen that stuff? Welcome. Don't know about putty stuff. Do you have a linkage? Gotta run; wormhole is closing. Check you tomorrow. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moontanman Posted July 14, 2014 Author Share Posted July 14, 2014 Here it is... https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2bx3PYFwnnA Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Acme Posted July 14, 2014 Share Posted July 14, 2014 Here it is... https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2bx3PYFwnnA Silly putty with magnetic powder mixed in looks to me. Cool though. Try making your own. Grind up the black sand from your placer mining activities; it's magnetite. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moontanman Posted August 13, 2014 Author Share Posted August 13, 2014 Ok I tried it again, I can hold the hard boiled, cold egg and move the magnet very near and feel a slight affect, more of a repulsion than an attraction but it doesn't work on a flat surface. Could be my wishful thinking but the feel of the eggs and magnet in my hands does feel like tiny effect. I might try to suspend the egg on a string and see if it can be seen by a camera. I don't like things that don't make sense and i feel like my own bias my be at play but the feeling of the magnets/egg is difficult to dismiss... I had my wife try it, she had no idea what I was looking for and she said she felt a slight effect. I can't get the effect the display on a flat surface and it might have been the egg just rolling naturally that peaked my interest to begin with. It puzzles me greatly but I admit that confirmation bias might be at work but my wife had no expectations what to so ever and she felt it too.. Ok we tried a blind test, she held the egg with her eyes closed, she was sure she felt the motion 2 out of three times, I scored similarly. I'm going to try it on a neighbor and not tell her anything about the magnet or what i am trying to detect and see what happens. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
imatfaal Posted August 13, 2014 Share Posted August 13, 2014 the best way to blind the test would be to stop yourself knowing when you had a magnet - you would need four+ identical containers (perhaps sections of tube or hose sealed with tape), some dummies (a rummage in my toolbox produced a few bolts the same weight to the gram to the magnets acme showed above) roughly the same weight and size as the magnet, and a scientific curiosity. Mark the containers in a place where you can avoid seeing the mark. Whilst avoiding the marked number load the containers - the more the better - with two magnets and rest dummies. Check (methodologically) that you cannot spot the magnets from outside. Run test with random container still not looking at number - decide yes or no. Check number and note yes or no. Put container aside - shuffle the rest around. Run test with random... Continue till bored. I would do so - but I have no eggs... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moontanman Posted August 13, 2014 Author Share Posted August 13, 2014 the best way to blind the test would be to stop yourself knowing when you had a magnet - you would need four+ identical containers (perhaps sections of tube or hose sealed with tape), some dummies (a rummage in my toolbox produced a few bolts the same weight to the gram to the magnets acme showed above) roughly the same weight and size as the magnet, and a scientific curiosity. Mark the containers in a place where you can avoid seeing the mark. Whilst avoiding the marked number load the containers - the more the better - with two magnets and rest dummies. Check (methodologically) that you cannot spot the magnets from outside. Run test with random container still not looking at number - decide yes or no. Check number and note yes or no. Put container aside - shuffle the rest around. Run test with random... Continue till bored. I would do so - but I have no eggs... I am so convinced there can be no effect and puzzled as to why there appears to be one I don't trust myself for sure. The magnets are so oddly shaped I am not sure a dummy could be convincingly made. I will look into this further for sure... I was thinking of suspending the eggs in the air via a thread and seeing if I could produce a visible effect. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
imatfaal Posted August 13, 2014 Share Posted August 13, 2014 Moon - I would say that the important thing is not to make the reaction of the egg more obvious but to create a situation in which you cannot tell whether it "should" move or not. I have a pair of magnets identical to those Acme provided a photo of above. With a bit of A4 paper (Legal is close enough for US) I made a tube and taped all the way down the long seam. I craft-knifed it into small sections - and the bolts (actually a nut and bolt) and magnets were forced inside. Once the ends were sealed I could not tell the difference. [Technically the magnets and the nut/bolt pairs would be different due to the different moments of inertia - but not so much that I could tell]. Seriously Moon - you need to remove the possibility of confirmation bias before anything else 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moontanman Posted August 13, 2014 Author Share Posted August 13, 2014 I know most here think I am a woo believer but in reality I am very skeptical and things that don't make sense disturb me greatly, I will continue to work on this and find out why I feel an effect... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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