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Mrs Zeta

Is Death really necessary?

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Evolution favours survival. So, (specifically referring only to humans) why must we die? What is the point of (Nature, God, whatever) creating the most advanced, most complex organism in the universe and then killing it?

 

I can understand deaths through random events, predators microscopic and macroscopic, but I fail to see the point of ageing, an unnecessary and cruel process that deliberately leads to death.

 

I dismiss a priori any replies mentioning death as ‘a necessary means for making room for new generations’, natural selection, and the like. We can also evolve and attain higher levels of fitness by living healthily for many centuries or millennia.

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What is the point of (Nature, God, whatever) creating the most advanced, most complex organism in the universe

 

Arrogant much?

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Death is necessary at 120 years because we become Godless the longer we live. Our free choice becomes s choice of selfishness. Why? I don't know. What I do know is in the bible, I summarize, is that through our ancestor's actions we tried to eliminate the true God from our lives and that would have lead to our own destruction, a spiritual snd physical death. Our lives changed direction, a few times because of major learning experiences but we never lost the spiritual life. In other words, we don't die, we become spiritually what you desire physically. It is not a metamorphosis but an actualization of ..... Let's just say it's cool...

 

It's kinda funny that if God's word is not good enough, that some think man created God and not the other way around, the bible is just storys that they can not explain how man knew thousands of years ago that we could take a rib cell and make another human being, eve. We just figured it out this year that we can take any cell. Interesting how predictable.

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!

Moderator Note

Moved to Religion, since that's the direction it's heading.

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Arrogant much?

 

I couldn’t agree more.

 

 

 

Evolution favours survival. So, (specifically referring only to humans) why must we die? What is the point of (Nature, God, whatever) creating the most advanced, most complex organism in the universe and then killing it?

 

I can understand deaths through random events, predators microscopic and macroscopic, but I fail to see the point of ageing, an unnecessary and cruel process that deliberately leads to death.

 

I dismiss a priori any replies mentioning death as 'a necessary means for making room for new generations', natural selection, and the like. We can also evolve and attain higher levels of fitness by living healthily for many centuries or millennia.

 

 

There is no point to life, we are what we are, we have evolved intelligence; but that doesn’t necessarily equal most advanced or most complex. We are simply talking apes on an organic spaceship in a universe so vast that to imagine we are anything special is absurd. Dismiss what you will; no death would very quickly become a major problem.

 

 

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Is Death really necessary?

 

Not to me.

 

But there is not only death, there is also suffering which is worse in many cases IMHO.

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no death would very quickly become a major problem.

 

Why? What problem?

Edited by Mrs Zeta

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I couldn’t agree more.

 

 

 

 

 

 

There is no point to life, we are what we are, we have evolved intelligence; but that doesn’t necessarily equal most advanced or most complex. We are simply talking apes on an organic spaceship in a universe so vast that to imagine we are anything special is absurd. Dismiss what you will; no death would very quickly become a major problem.

(bolded mine)

 

Maybe that is a supportable scientific POV but that is a politically incorrect. It opens the door wide to any sort of massacre. It should be better to say that we are all (all living things) very special.

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(bolded mine)

 

Maybe that is a supportable scientific POV but that is a politically incorrect. It opens the door wide to any sort of massacre. It should be better to say that we are all (all living things) very special.

 

Point taken, however, the intention was not backhanded; meaning I really don’t think we’re special in any way.

 

 

 

Why? What problem?

 

Given that procreation will continue, can you really not see a problem?

 

 

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Can you suggest a more complex organic creation than the human brain?

 

Well for one that's a loaded question since you phrased it as a creation.

 

Ignoring that I would say a mouse's brain is more complex due to it having a higher neuron to unit body mass ratio. I could also say that the digestive system of almost any animal is more complex than the brain in many ways; such as housing an entire ecosystem, the incredible specialization in each area, etc. Depending on what you mean by complex I could give quite a few examples. This is coming from a person that is planning to work in neurobiology as well, so don't think I don't have a love for the brain.

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Well for one that's a loaded question since you phrased it as a creation.

 

Ignoring that I would say a mouse's brain is more complex due to it having a higher neuron to unit body mass ratio. I could also say that the digestive system of almost any animal is more complex than the brain in many ways; such as housing an entire ecosystem, the incredible specialization in each area, etc. Depending on what you mean by complex I could give quite a few examples. This is coming from a person that is planning to work in neurobiology as well, so don't think I don't have a love for the brain.

 

I mean 'complex' as related to intelligence (i.e.the ability to select a correct option out of many choices). I can't see any comparison whatsoever between the brain of a mouse and that of a human. And I truly believe that my brain is cleverer than my stomach (on most occasions). If I had to choose to have any complex organ I like, I would go for the human brain. Without it, nothing exists.

 

Point taken, however, the intention was not backhanded; meaning I really don’t think we’re special in any way.

 

 

 

 

 

Given that procreation will continue, can you really not see a problem?

 

But this is the issue here. Procreation will not continue at the current rate, in a society in which its members live for several centuries. Procreation is only needed because we die, and so the survival of our species needs to be assured.

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I mean 'complex' as related to intelligence (i.e.the ability to select a correct option out of many choices). I can't see any comparison whatsoever between the brain of a mouse and that of a human. And I truly believe that my brain is cleverer than my stomach (on most occasions). If I had to choose to have any complex organ I like, I would go for the human brain. Without it, nothing exists.

 

Then you are not speaking of complexity, you are speaking purely of intelligence which is not necessarily correlated with neuronal complexity. If you don't see a comparison between a mouse brain and human brain you may be fairly upset to learn most studies of neurodegenerative disorders are done on mice. If it were not for our digestive systems, and diet in general, we would not have the brain we do have. Also, Black birds show large amounts of intelligence and there brains our fairly simplistic in comparison to most mammalian brains. So what you're arguing for is not complexity, but a specific human trait, to show humans are better? That seems pretty anthropocentric.

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Then you are not speaking of complexity, you are speaking purely of intelligence which is not necessarily correlated with neuronal complexity. If you don't see a comparison between a mouse brain and human brain you may be fairly upset to learn most studies of neurodegenerative disorders are done on mice. If it were not for our digestive systems, and diet in general, we would not have the brain we do have. Also, Black birds show large amounts of intelligence and there brains our fairly simplistic in comparison to most mammalian brains. So what you're arguing for is not complexity, but a specific human trait, to show humans are better? That seems pretty anthropocentric.

 

Yes it is anthropocentric, and I am proud to be human.That is why I believe that it is a waste for me to die of ageing, whereas if mice or blackbirds die, so what?

Sorry, but I am deliberately arrogant, in order to prove my point.

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Yes it is anthropocentric, and I am proud to be human.That is why I believe that it is a waste for me to die of ageing, whereas if mice or blackbirds die, so what?

Sorry, but I am deliberately arrogant, in order to prove my point.

 

Such arrogance is worthy of nought but contempt, as history shows.

 

 

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Yes it is anthropocentric, and I am proud to be human.That is why I believe that it is a waste for me to die of ageing, whereas if mice or blackbirds die, so what?

Sorry, but I am deliberately arrogant, in order to prove my point.

 

But if no body died the sustainability of resources would be nil. So yes, we have to die if we want our progeny to live.

 

Nothing cares if we die other than us, the mice and blackbirds think the same about us. On the other hand there are many bacteria that if they died we would go with them, but if we died they would hardly notice (anthropomorphising I know, but you get my point).

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Evolution favours survival. So, (specifically referring only to humans) why must we die?

Because after processes of the the ends of Chromosomes shortening, the aging process happens, and over time the body functions less and less at it's optimal capacity. However, this only becomes a problem at ages 30-40+ in most cases, and humans reproduce before that, so the genes that cause the aging process survive.

 

What is the point of (Nature, God, whatever) creating the most advanced, most complex organism in the universe and then killing it?

Nature isn't some mystical force, the other animals aren't any more aware of a point to anything than you are, nature is just the culmination of our physical world.

 

I can understand deaths through random events, predators microscopic and macroscopic, but I fail to see the point of ageing, an unnecessary and cruel process that deliberately leads to death.

Nature is not a conscious thing, therefore it cannot have the capacity to care about anything or have an opinion about anything.

Edited by EquisDeXD

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