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Melting Wood?


Gness
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dragonstar57 ,

 

I don't know what I can say to continue the conversation or even if further explanation is needed . There is another thread over in the Chemistry section called ' to melt or not to melt ' , have a read if it interests you . I'm not trying to be arrogant or rude , just as you would like , no repetition .

I was merely commenting that the quality of discussion was suffering by the repetition and was attempting to lead the conversation into some new territory. it was starting to be a ya'huh na'huh lvl debate and i was concerned about possible admin closing of this thread

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  • 2 weeks later...

dragonstar57 ,

 

do you think I say that an object which has been hal.'s melted is incapable of returning to it's original state ?

I think you say that to be hal's melted it does not have to be able to return to it's original state so therefore i was asking for an example of hal's melt where it is not capable of returning to it's original state

Edited by dragonstar57
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dragonstar57 ,

 

I don't say that materials that are hal.'s melted can't return to their original state , hal.'s melting has nothing to do with the reverse process , whether something is hal.'s melted would be decided upon based on evidence which would not involve anything to do with the reversible process . That is the qualification of independence of reversibility which is not the same thing as a qualification that accomplishment of reversibility is not possible .

 

I am not placing a condition of reversibility to decide whether something is hal.'s melted , that is simple . That doesn't mean you can't reverse the process . That means it doesn't matter whether you can or can't , hal.'s melting will be decided upon independently of whether you can or can't .

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dragonstar57 ,

 

I don't say that materials that are hal.'s melted can't return to their original state , hal.'s melting has nothing to do with the reverse process , whether something is hal.'s melted would be decided upon based on evidence which would not involve anything to do with the reversible process . That is the qualification of independence of reversibility which is not the same thing as a qualification that accomplishment of reversibility is not possible .

 

I am not placing a condition of reversibility to decide whether something is hal.'s melted , that is simple . That doesn't mean you can't reverse the process . That means it doesn't matter whether you can or can't , hal.'s melting will be decided upon independently of whether you can or can't .

...you said that they don't need to be able to return to their original state.

so what would be an example of something melting without being able to return to it's original state?

if you say "dogs are a four legged animal which may or may not bark" and i say "name a example of a dog that does not bark" i am not saying you are claiming that all dogs do not bark.

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dragonstar57 ,

 

I do think you understand the Hal.'s melting viewpoint , you couldn't question like this otherwise . I think you realise that not needing to be able to return to an original state and needing to not be able to return to an original state are different things . The former doesn't impose a condition which may or may not be attainable whereas the latter imposes a condition which must .

 

Maybe there are materials which can't return to their original state , would you like to suggest such ? If you look at melting and freezing as a journey like a return train trip from New York to Chicago to New York , Hal.'s melting will describe the journey from New York to Chicago . It is simple .

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If you look at melting and freezing as a journey like a return train trip from New York to Chicago to New York , Hal.'s melting will describe the journey from New York to Chicago . It is simple .

... and it does not distinguish whether the passenger dies when the plane crashes at Chicago O'hare airport, or arrives safely. :)

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... and it does not distinguish whether the passenger dies when the plane crashes at Chicago O'hare airport, or arrives safely. :)

 

 

:P

 

 

Hal, would you explain again why there is any advantage in introducing a term whose meaning conflcits with the well established meaning of melting and which seems to offer no benefits whatsoever?

 

 

Ophiolite , I'm not trying to tear down the well established scientific principles of melting , I have my viewpoint of what happens to objects , I think there is enough information to describe the viewpoint , if you would like to use the term Hal.'s melting , do . Try to be careful not to attribute viewpoints to me which aren't mine .

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[...] if you would like to use the term Hal.'s melting , do .[...]

The main problem that I have with this, is that there is really no need for an additional name.

All known phenomenons of a solid turning into a liquid already have a name (liquifying, melting, condensing, smelting, dissolving, etc.).

Edited by CaptainPanic
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Try to be careful not to attribute viewpoints to me which aren't mine .

It is precisely because I wish to avoid attributing viewpoints to you, that you might not actually hold, that I have asked you to explain what benefits could possibly be derived from using your definition of melting. Will you please provide that explanation now.

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CaptainPanic , you are arguing with yourself , you introduced the term , I have the viewpoint it applies to , I have explained it , it is melting .

I am indeed arguing with myself. I shouldn't have called it "Hal's Melting". I should have said that what you describe is commonly called liquifying.

 

And you're not allowed to have a "different viewpoint" on something for which there is a clear definition. It's like a law. You must abide the law.

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Ophiolite ,

 

I'm describing melting , I never claimed anything other than to be describing melting , if you see benefits and would like to use the term for the viewpoint , do so .

 

CaptainPanic ,

 

What I describe is called melting .

 

I will choose to have as many viewpoints as I like .

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Ophiolite ,

 

I'm describing melting , I never claimed anything other than to be describing melting , if you see benefits and would like to use the term for the viewpoint , do so .

 

CaptainPanic ,

 

What I describe is called melting .

 

I will choose to have as many viewpoints as I like .

You can have your viewpoints, sure. Nobody can force you to think in a particular way. But since everybody else is happy with the existing definitions, and we all refuse to use your viewpoints, don't you think it's easier to use the conventional definitions in your communications to the rest of the world??

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No. As has been repeatedly pointed out to you melting is a reversible process. You wish to apply the term melting to some processes that are not reversible. That is an incorrect application of the term. what do you find so difficult to understand about this?

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CaptainPanic ,

 

If you understand the viewpoint I have then there is no confusion . I understand the conventional definition dependence on reversibility for it's proof . If you ever melt something and wish to describe this as melting with no reference to it's proof which is dependent on reversibility then you will have something in common with me , Hal . Until then I wish you luck in the scientific community .

 

Ophiolite ,

 

you don't know what you are talking about .

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