marnixR Posted November 11, 2008 Share Posted November 11, 2008 just a comment on the placement of your "banned/suspended users" thread most likely it's the first post people will see when visiting your site + it will give the impression of a repressive forum - it's up to you whether you want to give that impression also, as i've said elsewhere, the introduction thread is well hidden and should be given more prominence e.g. stickied in the "Announcements" part of the forum Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ydoaPs Posted November 12, 2008 Share Posted November 12, 2008 Why would banned users be the first post people see? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr Skeptic Posted November 12, 2008 Share Posted November 12, 2008 This is a moderated forum, and it is a good idea for people to know that at the very start. If they want to know how moderated it is, they can check out the dates and reasons in the banned/suspended users forum. Most people appreciate moderation, as it increases quality of conversation (as you would know if you visited a popular but unmoderated site, if there even are any). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Phi for All Posted November 12, 2008 Share Posted November 12, 2008 It wouldn't hurt to move the Introduce Yourself thread into Announcements, I suppose, and sticky it above Suspended Users. We just put IY in GD because it seemed friendly, plus I believe there are some directions when you join that link you to it. But I think anyone who would peruse our list of Banned/Suspended Users first and assume we were repressive is either a) too sensitive to discuss science, b) not reading the reasons behind the suspensions, or c) worried they'll shortly find themselves on that list. I'll check the links to Introduce Yourself and if the Admins don't mind, I'll move it to Announcements. Good suggestion, marnixR, I hope it encourages newcomers to begin their relationship with SFN on a happy note. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
iNow Posted November 12, 2008 Share Posted November 12, 2008 Just a nod in support of the "Banned/Suspended Users" thread... I quite like that the staff on this forum care enough about the population to let them in on what is happening. So often, we get into these endless arguments with trolls that just go on and on and on... and it's nice to know that the staff has taken action and why. There's something to be said and respected about the transparency of it all. While I can appreciate that a noobie might be turned off somewhat if that's the first thing they saw, I (as a regular contributor) like the sense of inclusion the thread brings to the community and the actions being taken to keep it running smoothly. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ophiolite Posted November 12, 2008 Share Posted November 12, 2008 Most people appreciate moderation, as it increases quality of conversation (as you would know if you visited a popular but unmoderated site, if there even are any).This is true, but it is worth noting that marnix, although a complete neophyte on this forum, is active on other science forums, making valuable contributions to discussion. Therefore, the impression Marnix has formed is well worth taking into account and I'm pleased Phi for All has done so. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Klaynos Posted November 12, 2008 Share Posted November 12, 2008 Maybe keep IY in GD but put a forwarding sticky in announcements? Best of both worlds Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Phi for All Posted November 12, 2008 Share Posted November 12, 2008 This is true, but it is worth noting that marnix, although a complete neophyte on this forum, is active on other science forums, making valuable contributions to discussion. Therefore, the impression Marnix has formed is well worth taking into account and I'm pleased Phi for All has done so.I understand that marnixR joined mainly on your recommendation, Ophiolite. I'm willing to entertain any suggestions that bring you here more often. Maybe keep IY in GD but put a forwarding sticky in announcements? Best of both worlds I like that idea, Klaynos. So much so that I'm requesting your salary be doubled. I had completely forgotten that posts in Announcements go through a moderation queue, to make sure no one is "announcing" their new take on special relativity, or that their left leg length has caught up with their right. It would be disheartening for a newbie to make their first post and have to wait while we repressive Moderators approve their message. We'll probably go with what our Physics Expert tells us would conserve angular momentum (which is forum code for "extra work for the Mods"). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
k99 Posted November 12, 2008 Share Posted November 12, 2008 This is a moderated forum, and it is a good idea for people to know that at the very start. If they want to know how moderated it is, they can check out the dates and reasons in the banned/suspended users forum. Most people appreciate moderation, as it increases quality of conversation (as you would know if you visited a popular but unmoderated site, if there even are any). How does it increase the quality of conversation? If someone really was out of control, it wouldn't really bother anyone other than the vulgarity. Their anger fits would at most make other people laugh at or feel sorry for them. It makes everyone angry when their opponent has a good point, wins the argument, or unfortunately when they resort to specious arguments and sarcasm when they know they cannot win the debate. Neither of these things are ever directly moderated, and only the specious arguments and sarcasm ever should be. That would be hard and would require some logical based evaluation of everyone's arguments. Instead "heavily moderated" just seems to refer to some sort of cult forum where whenever the moderator's opinions are challenged, the moderator's resort to the above behavior and then interpret any response as being "out of control". If you want an example look at any religous forum where the rules state something as innocent sounding as "Behave in a reasonable manner" or "Treat others with respect" and then watch what happens if you question a core belief. Everyone there would go beserk and make sarcastic comments about your mother, then anything you said would be characterized as violating the rules that 30 seconds ago seemed reasonable. Why don't they just label it as a cult forum and say "No questioning of christian ideals allowed?" Because no one would go there to discuss anything knowing that they just censored anyone who expressed something that the backwards reasoning of the forum members couldn't handle. A forum for discussion is supposed to be just that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr Skeptic Posted November 12, 2008 Share Posted November 12, 2008 How does it increase the quality of conversation? The same reason that you empty your trash can. The mods are here to take out the trash. If you don't, you may soon find yourself wading in trash. There is no reason that we need to keep around guys like this guy. This guy came over occasionally and kept starting new threads, replying to threads, all with utter garbage. The stuff in other threads was deleted (some of his posts were thousands of repetitions of "atomikpsycho", quite annoying. Here's an example from another forum). The guy would have buried our site in a day if not for the mods. Why there are people like that, I don't know, but they do show up once in a while. Instead "heavily moderated" just seems to refer to some sort of cult forum where whenever the moderator's opinions are challenged, the moderator's resort to the above behavior and then interpret any response as being "out of control". This forum is "moderated", not "heavily moderated". There is hardly any deletion of posts or threads (atomikpsycho being a notable exception), though threads can be locked and users banned or suspended. You can select a banned user and view all his posts, and you will find out he was banned with good reason. Feel free to browse through the locked threads as well, if you want to see a bunch of garbage. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
swansont Posted November 12, 2008 Share Posted November 12, 2008 There's about a dozen users in the banned/suspended list, over the course of more than 7 months. You can see that with rare exception, the banned users appear multiple times, and suspensions generally don't occur until several violations have been made (except for the unforgivable infractions). There are users who believe the staff are too lenient in handing out the infractions and sending abusers to troll-heaven. As iNow has guessed, the purpose was to both inform the users that something as being done about posters that were disrupting threads, and to lend some transparency to the process, lest anyone think the actions were arbitrary or unwarranted. You can look up users, read their "contributions" and judge for yourself, should you be so motivated. If anything, newbies might get the impression that I'm the Bad Cop™. I can live with that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Phi for All Posted November 13, 2008 Share Posted November 13, 2008 And now there's a brand new sticky, *above* the Banned/Suspended Users, inviting newcomers to Introduce Themselves. Good idea marnixR, good suggestion Klaynos, and I am now officially the Good CopTM. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
marnixR Posted November 13, 2008 Author Share Posted November 13, 2008 And now there's a brand new sticky, *above* the Banned/Suspended Users, inviting newcomers to Introduce Themselves. i had noticed - thank you Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Klaynos Posted November 13, 2008 Share Posted November 13, 2008 (edited) I am now officially the Good CopTM. You fool no one ;p You've always been my favorite Moderator. Edited November 14, 2008 by Phi for All blatant censorship & repression Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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