The Trouble with Physics is number one on bestseller list

[Martin]

I hope Snail will confirm since he has been reading "3 roads".

 

I believe one of the 3 roads IS the string approach.

 

(Smolin has spent several years off and on doing string, and has written over a dozen string papers----he gives a careful and, one could say, loving explanation of string and its appeal----like you could say of an old girlfriend----he just thinks something else is more promising so he's shifted away from string. I am basing this on his new book TwP which has all of section II devoted to string.)

 

I haven't read 3 roads, but I believe that at least a 3rd of the book is devoted to string and based on an intimate knowledge of the field. Snail please confirm or correct if I am mistaken

 

At the time smolin wrote 3 roads which I think was some 5 years ago or so, he seems to have thought that eventually string and nonstring QG might complement each other and merge, or turn out to be different aspects of the same future theory.

 

that might still be true but I havent heard much about it from Smolin in the past 2 or 3 years.

 

Lately he has a somewhat different overall view which we could discuss if you want (when we get around to reading TwP)

[Royston]

I have that one but haven't read it. Are any of the roads extra dimensional or is that too stringy?

 

No, the arguments put forward are a whittling down of questions to already solved equations and answers. That is the theme of the book.

 

It concentrates on 'topos' and a mathematical means to 'limit' certain questions that could have far-reaching implications. So QM could hold many questions, but there's a way of limiting those questions. if you stick to underlying principles of cosmology. It relies on already established theories in physics, and sits on those principles, and comes to a few conclusions.

 

But I found the book wandered off, trying to explain QM and Relativity to the layperson, which didn't follow from the theme it promised...but I'm only half way through.

 

I'm more interested in the maths the book brought up, from the first few chapters.

[Royston]

I hope Snail will confirm since he has been reading "3 roads".

 

I believe one of the 3 roads IS the string approach.

 

(Smolin has spent several years off and on doing string, and has written over a dozen string papers----he gives a careful and, one could say, loving explanation of string and its appeal----like you could say of an old girlfriend----he just thinks something else is more promising so he's shifted away from string. I am basing this on his new book TwP which has all of section II devoted to string.)

 

I haven't read 3 roads, but I believe that at least a 3rd of the book is devoted to string and based on an intimate knowledge of the field. Snail please confirm or correct if I am mistaken

 

At the time smolin wrote 3 roads which I think was some 5 years ago or so, he seems to have thought that eventually string and nonstring QG might complement each other and merge, or turn out to be different aspects of the same future theory.

 

that might still be true but I havent heard much about it from Smolin in the past 2 or 3 years.

 

Lately he has a somewhat different overall view which we could discuss if you want (when we get around to reading TwP)

 

 

Sorry, I missed your post Martin, and you're dead right, there are several chapters devoted to string theory. Remember it's for the layperson, so of not much interest.

 

I don't think there's anything to be gained by what has been proposed, but the first few chapters are very interesting.

[Royston]

J. C. Macswell, Martin, sorry a few friends came over last night, and I had rather an absurd amount of wine, so my posts didn't follow.

 

So to clarify, one of the 'roads' Smolin discusses is string theory.

[bascule]

I hope Snail will confirm since he has been reading "3 roads".

 

I believe one of the 3 roads IS the string approach.

 

I too purchased this book recently, and yes, it is.

 

At the time smolin wrote 3 roads which I think was some 5 years ago or so, he seems to have thought that eventually string and nonstring QG might complement each other and merge, or turn out to be different aspects of the same future theory.

 

Yep, that's really the take you get from it... his hope that string/non-string quantum gravity might both be approximations of some underlying theory.

 

that might still be true but I havent heard much about it from Smolin in the past 2 or 3 years.

 

Heh, I've really gotten the vibe (as well as you can get vibes through the Internet) that, well, he's not nearly as optimistic about string theory as he was when he wrote Thee Roads

 

Lately he has a somewhat different overall view which we could discuss if you want (when we get around to reading TwP)

 

Yes, please!

[Martin]

Lately he has a somewhat different overall view which we could discuss if you want (when we get around to reading TwP)

 

Yes' date=' please![/quote']

 

Great! We can discuss TwP as soon as anybody besides me has read some substantial chunks or chunks of it. I think some or all of the following people might be interested in doing that: Snail, Locrian, bascule, MacSwell...

it's enough to have a lively discussion.

 

BTW as of 11:00 today Saturday 23 September the amazon general physics top six were

 

1. The Trouble with Physics #307

2. The Elegant Universe #991

3. Physics for Dummies #1059

4. Not Even Wrong #1089

5. The Road to Reality #1234

6. A Brief History of Time #1873

[Martin]

As soon as anyone has gotten the book and had a look, please let us known!

 

Yesterday's interview with Smolin on Canadian radio gives a clear brief picture of the book.

http://www.cbc.ca/quirks/media/2006-2007/mp3/qq-2006-09-23e.mp3

 

Note that the book is not negative to string, it says why string was good and wants to go beyond---explains what string does and what it fails to do (appreciates the beauty of ideas which sofar just didnt quite work out). What I am saying here is too imprecise----please listen to the CBC interview to get it direct from Smolin in his own words.

 

Great! We can discuss TwP as soon as anybody besides me has read some substantial chunks or chunks of it. I think some or all of the following people might be interested in doing that: Snail, Locrian, bascule, MacSwell...

it's enough to have a lively discussion.

 

BTW as of 11:00 today Saturday 23 September the amazon general physics top six were

 

1. The Trouble with Physics #307

2. The Elegant Universe #991

3. Physics for Dummies #1059

4. Not Even Wrong #1089

5. The Road to Reality #1234

6. A Brief History of Time #1873

 

UPDATE ON THE BESTSELLER STANDINGS

as of 25 September 9:30 AM

 

1. The Trouble with Physics #244

2. God's Universe #1292

3. The Elegant Universe #1311

4. Cracking AP Physics #1534

5. Physics for Dummies #1614

6. Not Even Wrong #1748

7. 3000 Solved Physics Problems #1859

8. The Road to Reality #1967

 

Hawking's books were not in the top ten: "Briefer" was #12 and "Brief" was #17. These standings fluctuate quite a bit: Hawking usually a bit higher than he was this morning.

 

Here is the amazon general physics bestseller list, if you'd like to check it out

http://www.amazon.com/gp/bestsellers/books/14560/ref=pd_ts_b_nav/102-4540543-7840144

[Martin]

Smolin's book has been #1 on the amazon general physics bestseller list since 30 August, which is 4 weeks, now going into its fifth week

 

it is a revolutionary book which I think will change the view of fundamental physics, spark interest in trying new approaches to the five main problems he talks about, and help US theory research break out of its stringjacket.

 

as of Wednesday 27 September 12:00 PM pacific, the standings were

 

1. The Trouble with Physics #270

2. The Elegant Universe #995

3. Not Even Wrong #1046

...

...

6. A Brief History of Time #2091

7. The Road to Reality #2328

 

the overall sales rank number gives a rough comparative idea of how many copies are selling----assuming sales are uniformly distributed it suggests that Smolin's TwP is selling roughly 3 times faster than its nearest competitor. For now, at least, a comfortable margin.

 

http://www.amazon.com/gp/bestsellers/books/14560/ref=pd_ts_b_nav/102-4540543-7840144

 

This has been the approximate lead (this factor of 3 or so) nearly every time I have looked in the past month. Varying between 2 and 4 but mostly around 3. The book which happens to be in second place has changed from time to time, but the lead has been fairly steady.

[ecoli]

I think it's hard to compare Smolin's book (which I haven't read yet, sorry) with books like A brief history of time or an elegant universe, which are somewhat older. I would like to see a normalized sales ranking, based on released date.

[Martin]

I think it's hard to compare Smolin's book (which I haven't read yet, sorry) with books like A brief history of time or an elegant universe, which are somewhat older. I would like to see a normalized sales ranking, based on released date.

 

that would be so nice to have! total number of copies sold in the first month, or the first year.

 

I tried googling for that sort of information, unsuccessfully. Maybe someone will show up who knows how to get booksales information like that.

 

 

one thing would be to compare smolin sales with other HARDCOVER books that have come out recently

 

like Hawking's "A Briefer History of Time" which is still selling in hardcover,

and Lisa Randall's "Warped Passages", and especially appropriate for comparison: Leonard Susskind "The Cosmic Landscape, String Theory and the Illusion of Intelligent Design" which is very much intended to have mass appeal.

 

Randall's is still selling in hardcover (although paperback edition just came out) and Susskind's is hardcover----both are recent---in the past year.

 

 

6. "A Briefer..." #1859 (out exactly one year, came out 27 Sept 2005)

 

27. "Warped..." (paper) #7796

28. "Warped..." (hard) #7917

 

67. "The Cosmic Landscape..." #15,355

[Martin]

I think it's hard to compare Smolin's book (which I haven't read yet, sorry) with books like A brief history of time or an elegant universe, which are somewhat older. I would like to see a normalized sales ranking, based on released date.

 

I found another angle on it,

 

a good comparison is another popular hardcover book that just came out (5 September 2006) namely E.O. Wilson The Creation: an Appeal to Save Life on Earth

 

http://www.amazon.com/Creation-Appeal-Save-Life-Earth/dp/0393062171/ref=pd_ts_b_10/103-6432418-0205431?ie=UTF8&s=books

 

currently the two books are selling about equally fast

as of 10 AM pacific time today, Wilson's was #198 and Smolin's was #210 overall sales rank

 

Actual numbers of books sold are not available----I did a fairly thorough search including trade newsletters like Publisher's Week, and the publishing houses themselves, and various booksellers besides Amazon. The practice is, except for a small number of very popular titles, to keep sales numbers secret. About all one can get is rankings. Or dollar sales in some broad category.

 

still, have a look at the Amazon "science" bestseller list---it gives lots of titles to use as benchmarks, and some are NEW RELEASE HARDCOVER so they are more comparable and can give some perspective:

 

http://www.amazon.com/gp/bestsellers/books/75/ref=pd_ts_b_ldr/103-6432418-0205431

 

=========================

 

update:

as of 11 AM today, The Trouble with Physics and E.O. Wilson's The Creation were running neck and neck.

 

their overall sales ranks were #185 and #191

and their bestseller ranks in the broad "science" category were #11 and #12

[Martin]

Here is the amazon "science" bestseller list. Smolin's book is #11 at the moment. "Science" is a much broader category than the "general physics" listing I was looking at earlier: with diet books, self-help books, health, saving the planet, how to write English.

 

The "science" list is a good field to place high in because these kinds of books are very popular. E.g. the first on this list is currently at or near the top including all non-fiction categories. "You: the owner's manual" is an overall nonfiction bestseller, so it is remarkable for Smolin's to be as close as #11.

 

1. YOU: The Owner's Manual: An Insider's Guide to the Body that Will Make You Healthier and Younger

by Michael F. Roizen

 

2. Blink: The Power of Thinking Without Thinking

by Malcolm Gladwell

 

3. A Good Dog: The Story of Orson, Who Changed My Life

by Jon Katz

 

4. An Inconvenient Truth

by Al Gore

 

5. Publication Manual of the American Psychological Association, Fifth Edition

by American Psychological Association

 

6. Omnivore's Dilemma

by Michael Pollan

 

7. The Elements of Style, Fourth Edition

by Roger Angell

 

8. The Language of God: A Scientist Presents Evidence for Belief

by Francis S. Collins

 

9. The Female Brain

by Louann Md Brizendine

 

10. Stumbling on Happiness

by Daniel Gilbert

 

11. The Trouble With Physics: The Rise of String Theory, the Fall of a Science, and What Comes Next

by Lee Smolin

 

http://www.amazon.com/gp/bestsellers/books/75/ref=pd_ts_b_ldr/103-6432418-0205431

 

============

to a rough approximation there is no hard-sciencey science book between TwP and the top. Less you count "The Female Brain".

Changes though, could look different later today.

[Martin]

I spoke briefly with Lee Smolin yesterday. He was in San Francisco as part of a book tour.

I'm watching how TwP does in both the UK and the US markets now. It's pretty clear that it is will be an influential book---I think will have a constructive influence on the conduct of science---on fundamental physics---and also on the public's informed support of science.

 

for the moment the best indices of the books sales and readership I have found are amazon links.

here is the US amazon "science" bestseller list

http://www.amazon.com/gp/bestsellers/books/75/ref=pd_ts_b_ldr/103-6432418-0205431

TwP is currently (Friday 29 September 1PM pacific) #1 in "general physics" and #11 in the broader category "science" and

#171 in overall sales rank.

 

It has been #1 on the general physics bestseller list for a month now. The broader category "science" contains self-help, diet, exercise, pets, and style handbooks for writing good English, so it is pretty competitive and it is remarkable that Smolin can place #11 in the science bestsellers. He has virtually no competition from other real science books.

 

I've also been watching the UK market a bit, by checking here:

http://www.amazon.co.uk/gp/bestsellers/books/ref=sv_b_3/026-8303087-5718006?ie=UTF8

 

this is the all-categories bestseller list (where Dawkins new one is #1)

and to narrow it down you click on "science and nature", and then narrow that down further to "physics" and thence "general" physics.

 

http://www.amazon.co.uk/gp/bestsellers/books/278431/ref=pd_ts_b_nav/026-8303087-5718006

 

so far, I think the book's UK sales have been hurt by having only one review---a hostile one one, not balanced by other customers' reviews---on the UK amazon page. As of now, there are two, making for more balance: and the book is doing better

 

not great, but better than before the good review. it is currently #11 on the UK "general physics" bestseller list, compared with Brian Green Elegant Universe #17.

[Royston]

I talked with Lee Smolin yesterday.

 

Hi Martin, what did you manage to talk about ?

[bascule]

I spoke briefly with Lee Smolin yesterday. He was in San Francisco as part of a book tour.

 

Awesome. I wish I could talk to him.

[J.C.MacSwell]

I spoke briefly with Lee Smolin yesterday. .

 

I hope he appreciates your efforts!

[Martin]

Hi Martin, what did you manage to talk about ?

 

Basically just how-de-do. He knew me from things I had written. Now he knows what I look like. We chatted briefly a couple of times during the evening. the guy's time is extremely valuable towards what I care most about, so I am not inclined to take up much of it.

 

He gave a 40 minute talk and at the end had a crowd of people standing in like to buy books and get them signed by the author AND a plane to Seattle he had to catch----so he was signing as many books as he could and then driving straight from the bookstore to the airport.

 

Interesting booktour schedule of appearances

http://www.thetroublewithphysics.com/

September 2006

Sept 20, 7:30 pm Innis Town Hall, Toronto, with Jay Ingram0th

Sept 25, 6:30 pm New York City Hayden Planetarium space theater

Sept 26, 7 pm Princeton NJ, Princeton University Store

Sept 27, 7:30 pm Kepler's book store, Menlo Park, California

Sept 28, 7 pm Bookshop West Portal, San Fransisco California

Sept 29, 1:30 pm Microsoft, Seattle

Sept 29, 7:30 pm Pacific Science Center, University Book Store, Seattle

October 2006

Oct 1, 6 pm Ottawa International Writers Festival

Oct 4, 7 pm Milwaukee, Harry W Schwartz Bookstore, Donner Ave.

Oct 5, 7 pm Chicago, Seminary Coop bookstore

Oct 6, 7 pm Chicago, Adler Planetarium, Far-out Friday

Oct 7, 3:15 pm Mensa Colloquium, Albany NY

Oct 17, 6:30 pm New York City, Cooper Union, Panel on Intelligent Thought

 

I think he has a smart agent. (maybe Edge.org John Brockman helped set up the tour---just a wild guess)

 

he seemed in great shape. calm. happy. not tired (except a little around the eyes)---he comes across as clear, generous, open----not talking down----able to address complex issues carefully and honestly and still making sense. impressive

 

the talk at the bookstore will be aired on the radio (one of the SF public stations)

he had just done an interview with KQED Michael Krasny earlier in the day

http://www.kqed.org/programs/program-landing.jsp?progID=RD19

http://www.kqed.org/epArchive/R609280900

http://kqed02.streamguys.us/anon.kqed/radio/forum/2006/09/2006-09-28a-forum.mp3

 

great guy, and really taking care of business on this tour!

[Martin]

Smolin's book TwP continues to climb in sales rank

 

it is way outperforming other comparable books---that is recent hardcover wide-audience physical science books like Hawking "A Briefer" which has been out a year and Gingerich "God's Universe"----not to mention Leonard Susskind "Cosmic Landscape", out 9 months and still in hardcover.

 

but it is not merely outperforming books in the same category (new hardcover science), it is beating out old paperback favorites and pretty much everything on the market that is at all real science

 

as of 9 AM pacific today Monday 2 October the book had sales rank #151.

 

that made it number NINE in the current "science" bestsellers, the books above Smolin being mostly self-help, diet, excercise etc. Not much between TwP and the top but Al Gore and Francis Collins.

 

#151 is pretty darned remarkable for a serious book about physics.

 

In case anyone is curious here is the ranking in the "general physics" category

 

===gen phys bestsellers as of 9 AM pacific===

 

1. The Trouble with Physics #151

2. Not Even Wrong #855

3. Physics for Dummies #962

4. Elegant Universe #1212

...

...

=========

 

Part of what we are seeing could be a temporary spike boosted by the fact that Smolin just gave two presentations in the Seattle area, one at the MICROSOFT CAMPUS and one at the Pacific Science Center. I heard him talk in San Francisco---he draws a good crowd and he's persuasive. A bunch of those Microsoft and Seattle folks may have bought the book and boosted sales.

[Martin]

The performance of this book has been phenomenal

especially since it is a serious book about the current state of fundamental physics theory----and what it is like to do it.

 

it is not a gee whiz pop phyz book----one gets the impression that the most serious direction is towards fellow physicists---those in other areas, not specialized in quantum gravity and foundations.

 

but he must have had several groups, or types of audience, in mind---so it is written to be very understandable

 

===============

 

somehow it worked. the book has been #1 bestseller in the category of all physics books, since around 15 September (before that it was #1 in "general physics" a narrower category)

 

the amazon sales rank among all books (not just physics) is currently around 300-400.

 

as a snaphot, here is the Saturday 14 October "physics" bestseller list as of 11:30 AM pacific

 

1. The Trouble With Physics: The Rise of String Theory, the Fall of a Science, and What Comes Next

by Lee Smolin (all-books amazon sales rank #326)

 

2. This Is Your Brain on Music: The Science of a Human Obsession

by Daniel J. Levitin (#811)

 

3. The Field: The Quest for the Secret Force of the Universe

by Lynne McTaggart (#1428)

 

4. Surely You're Joking, Mr. Feynman! (Adventures of a Curious Character)

by Richard P. Feynman

 

5. A Brief History of Time

by Stephen Hawking

 

6. What the Bleep Do We Know!?™: Discovering the Endless Possibilities for Altering Your Everyday Reality

by William Arntz

 

7. The Road to Reality : A Complete Guide to the Laws of the Universe

by Roger Penrose

 

8. The Elegant Universe: Superstrings, Hidden Dimensions, and the Quest for the Ultimate Theory

by Brian Greene

 

9. 3,000 Solved Problems in Physics (Schaum's Solved Problems) (Schaum's Solved Problems Series)

by Alvin Halpern

 

10. Beyond Oil: The View from Hubbert's Peak

by Kenneth S. Deffeyes

 

=================

it has been at the top of this "physics" list for essentially a month now---since around 15 September.

some of its earlier rivals (like "elegant universe") seem to have drifted down

while new rivals have risen up, like that book about ESP and the supernatural somehow related by the journalist author to Vacuum Energy and regular physics stuff. the competition is very broad---amazon includes all kind of stuff on the "physics" list that you wouldnt normally think of.

 

the amazon-wide sales rank is also a good indicator-----Smolin's is currently #326 among all books sold

[ima]

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[ima]

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