Mel Gibson - Against Jews?

[john5746]

Mel Gibson Tirade

 

I gave the benefit of the doubt to Gibson for the Passion of the Christ, but I think the latest tirade puts in serious doubt his purpose for showing the Jews in such a bad light in the film.

[Severian]

His apology seems quite sincere:

 

"After drinking alcohol on Thursday night, I did a number of things that were very wrong and for which I am ashamed. I drove a car when I should not have, and was stopped by the LA County Sheriffs. The arresting officer was just doing his job and I feel fortunate that I was apprehended before I caused injury to any other person. I acted like a person completely out of control when I was arrested, and said things that I do not believe to be true and which are despicable. I am deeply ashamed of everything I said. Also, I take this opportunity to apologize to the deputies involved for my belligerent behavior. They have always been there for me in my community and indeed probably saved me from myself. I disgraced myself and my family with my behavior and for that I am truly sorry. I have battled with the disease of alcoholism for all of my adult life and profoundly regret my horrific relapse. I apologize for any behavior unbecoming of me in my inebriated state and have already taken necessary steps to ensure my return to health."

 

He should still get the book thrown at him for drink driving though.

[Pangloss]

I agree with Severian. And frankly, trying to parse the man's inner feelings from this kind of distance is pretty absurd. This is fodder for the likes of "Access Hollywood" and "The View". Nothing more.

 

Most of the tirades against Mel Gibson in the blogosphere have nothing to do with this event. Just ideologues looking for an excuse to slam the man while he's down. What-evah.

[gcol]

Give the man a break, he was in his cups, blotto, stoned. We should all be thankful there's not a man with notebook and pen ready to take down all the things we blurt out in moments of stress and inebriation. He is only an actor after all, it's not as if he could ever be a politician, not even a mayor in California.... er, what am I saying!

 

I don't in any way condone his words, but I give him a couple of "freedom of speech" brownie points for questioning the unquestionable

[Bettina]

Mel Gibson Tirade

 

I gave the benefit of the doubt to Gibson for the Passion of the Christ' date=' but I think the latest tirade puts in serious doubt his purpose for showing the Jews in such a bad light in the film.[/quote']

 

I agree with you. People who drink lose their inhibitions and usually reveal their innermost feelings. He meant what he said at the time he said it and all the apologizing won't make it go away.

 

I think we got a glimpse of his inner self...

 

Bettina

[FreeThinker]

I agree with you. People who drink lose their inhibitions and usually reveal their innermost feelings. He meant what he said at the time he said it and all the apologizing won't make it go away.

 

I think we got a glimpse of his inner self...

 

Bettina

 

The way he said it was wrong. No doubt about it. What he said, is his opinion. Freedom of speach, I think thats what you call it in America.

[Pangloss]

I heard an amusing bit on talk radio this evening where the host was wondering why Mel Gibson can't be forgiven, but Jesse Jackson's "hymietown" comment is ancient history (and Jackson's a saint again).

 

It's sad the double-standards out there when it comes to statements like this, and ridiculously stupid the way organizations exact politically correct retributions. I read somewhere that the Anti-Defamation League has formally accepted Gibson's apology. WTF?! Stuff like that makes me wonder if I'm an alien.

[-Demosthenes-]

I agree with you. People who drink lose their inhibitions and usually reveal their innermost feelings. He meant what he said at the time he said it and all the apologizing won't make it go away.

 

I think we got a glimpse of his inner self...

 

Bettina

 

Have you ever heard a drunk person talk...?

[CPL.Luke]

^I agree with demosthenes, you can never take what a person says when their drunk as a serious representation of how that person feels.

[silkworm]

^I agree with demosthenes, you can never take what a person says when their drunk as a serious representation of how that person feels.

 

I've been really drunk quite a few times and it never gave me notions of Zionist plots nor made me a Holocaust denier. It just made me tell a few girl's that shouldn't have known that I think they're charming. Booze is not going to make Gibson into Dr. Hyde, it'll just keep him from protecting Mel Gibson so much.

 

With that said, I didn't find "The Passion" to be anti-semetic, I found it to be "anti-fundamentalism." Either way, I'd like to see Gibson somehow deported because I'm far beyond tired of him.

[Bettina]

Have you ever heard a drunk person talk...?

 

Nope... well except on tv.

 

I still believe people will say things when their drunk that otherwise would be kept suppressed when sober. Also, it wasn't what Mel Gibson said, it was how he said it... full of hate.

 

Their is no doubt in my mind that he has issues with the Jewish.

 

Bee

[In My Memory]

Bettina,

I agree with you. People who drink lose their inhibitions and usually reveal their innermost feelings. He meant what he said at the time he said it and all the apologizing won't make it go away.

 

I think we got a glimpse of his inner self...

I'm not at all willing to dismiss his comments as drunken rambling. Mel Gibsons father' date=' Hutton Gibson, is a viciously anti-semitic and a Holocaust denier, see wikipedia:

Hutton Gibson is a Sedevacantist (a form of Traditionalist Catholicism). His ideas, however, are rejected by many in the Traditionalist Catholic community. He believes that the Second Vatican Council introduced heretical doctrines into the Catholic Church, and he believes that every Pope elected since Pope John XXIII, including Pope John Paul II (whom he refers to as "Garrulous Karolus the Koran Kisser"), have been illegitimate anti-popes.[3] He has also stated that the Second Vatican Council was the result of a secret anti-Catholic plot orchestrated by both Masons and Jews.[4] He has shown some sympathy with the Siri Thesis.[citation needed]

 

Gibson adheres to the theory that the September 11, 2001 terrorist attacks were not carried out by Islamist terrorists aboard the planes, but rather by an unknown party using a "remote control," a view he has expressed on The Alex Jones Show.[5] He futher believes that Jews want to take over the world and establish a one world religion and government. [6]

 

Many of Hutton Gibson's beliefs and actions, including his promulgation of Holocaust revisionist theories, his association with known Holocaust revisionists and his contention that malevolent Jewish conspiracies exist within the Catholic Church and around the world, are consistent with traditional anti-Semitism. When Cardinal Joseph Ratzinger (prior to becoming Pope) stated that, although Judaism did not accept Jesus, it was nevertheless the "elder brother" of Christianity, Gibson observed that Abel also had an elder brother.[7]

 

Echoing the claims of numerous other Holocaust deniers, he questions aspects of the Jewish Holocaust, especially the commonly accepted statistic that between five million to seven million Jews were killed, arguing that it would have been impossible for the Nazis to have disposed of so many bodies.[8] He further claims that most of the Holocaust was "fiction,"[8] that the thousands of Jews who disappeared from Poland during World War II "got up and left",[8] and that census statistics prove there were more Jews in Europe after World War II than before (a claim that is disputed by mainstream historians).[9] In support of his father, Mel Gibson claims that his father's beliefs do not amount to Holocaust denial. (Mel Gibson also says that he will not speak out publicly against his father.)

 

Hutton Gibson publishes a quarterly newsletter called The War is Now! in which he details many of his views.

 

I dont think Mel Gibson would have regretted his comments at all if he wasnt so publically embarrassed.

[Phi for All]

Alocohol is not an excuse, it's a reason. It doesn't put the thoughts inside your head, it merely erodes the barriers keeping those thoughts in.

 

Alocohol affects judgement, it doesn't affect your belief system.

[ecoli]

Alocohol is not an excuse' date=' it's a reason. It doesn't put the thoughts inside your head, it merely erodes the barriers keeping those thoughts in.

 

Alocohol affects judgement, it doesn't affect your belief system.[/quote']

 

From my own observations of other people, this is certainly the truth.

 

The way he said it was wrong. No doubt about it. What he said, is his opinion. Freedom of speach, I think thats what you call it in America.

 

Unfortunate for Mr. Gibson, public figures don't get that particular curtousy. They can say whantever they want, true, but don't expect them to be held with public esteem when they say something controversial.

 

I heard somewhere that MEl Gibson is filiming a documentary about the holocaust as a way of apologising. Did anybody hear this, or is that just conjecture?

 

I read somewhere that the Anti-Defamation League has formally accepted Gibson's apology. WTF?! Stuff like that makes me wonder if I'm an alien.

 

Really? Normally the ADL takes a hard-line approach with these things... weird.

[Phi for All]

I read somewhere that the Anti-Defamation League has formally accepted Gibson's apology.

Could you find that for us? I could only find this, from Abraham Foxman, ADL National Director:

Mel Gibson's apology is unremorseful and insufficient. It's not a proper apology because it does not go to the essence of his bigotry and his anti-Semitism.

 

His tirade finally reveals his true self and shows that his protestations during the debate over his film "The Passion of the Christ," that he is such a tolerant, loving person, were a sham.

 

It may well be that the bigotry has been passed from the father to the son. It is unfortunate that it took an excess of booze and an encounter with a traffic cop to reveal what was really in his heart and mind.

 

We would hope that Hollywood now would realize the bigot in their midst and that they will distance themselves from this anti-Semite.

It doesn't make sense that the ADL would be so forgiving of the director of The Passion of the Christ after being so concerned about the impact of the movie.

http://www.npr.org/templates/story/story.php?storyId=5595512&ft=1&f=1001

[ecoli]

It doesn't make sense that the ADL would be so forgiving of the director of The Passion of the Christ after being so concerned about the impact of the movie.

http://www.npr.org/templates/story/story.php?storyId=5595512&ft=1&f=1001

 

One of the reasons why the ADL was fearful about the impact of the Passion, was that the play it is based on incited many progroms in Russia against Jewish villages.

 

While the ADL weren't expected a reponse so violent, it's still important to consider public opinion... Which seemed to me unaffected. But then again, I didn't know too many people who saw the movie.

 

My Rabbi saw it, however, and he found it to be very historically innacurate, and since he has made the study of ancient histories his life's work, I'd trust his judgement about that.

 

I'm too worried about the effect of Gibson's comments. Most of the articles I've read and people's reponses have been in condemnation of Gibson's remarks.

 

While I do believe Mel Gibson is sorry, I don't believe that he didn't mean what he said. I think he's sorry that his remarks hurt his rep., not retraction of his statements.

[Phi for All]

While I do believe Mel Gibson is sorry, I don't believe that he didn't mean what he said. I think he's sorry that his remarks hurt his rep., not retraction of his statements.

I agree. The alcohol made him say something he normally wouldn't have *said*. It didn't make him say something he normally wouldn't *believe*.

[Severian]

Do you have any details about what his anti-semitic comments were? the only bit in the article is:

 

"F*****g Jews... The Jews are responsible for all the wars in the world." Gibson then asked the deputy, "Are you a Jew?"

 

It would be useful to know what he actually said which is causing all this fuss. I presume there was more than this.

[YT2095]

what if someone says exactly the same when drunk as sober? (this is prolly a Little OT but...) making it almost impossible to tell if someones had a drink or not?

holds the same opinions, says things the same way, very litttle alter (barring a possible slur and off ballance).

 

I`m wondering if something in the brain is Missing, the part that acl over-rides?

[ecoli]

Museum of Jewish Heritage invites Mel Gibson to visit: http://www.newsday.com/news/local/wire/newyork/ny-bc-ny--gibson-museum0803aug03,0,5015485.story?coll=ny-region-apnewyork

[gcol]

Do you have any details about what his anti-semitic comments were? the only bit in the article is:

Quote:

"F*****g Jews... The Jews are responsible for all the wars in the world." Gibson then asked the deputy' date=' "Are you a Jew?"

 

It would be useful to know what he actually said which is causing all this fuss. I presume there was more than this.[/quote']

 

Is that really the sum total of his "antisemitic" remarks that are in the public domain and causing all the fuss? All I see there is a bit of bad language and exaggeration. Islam, Jehovah's witnesses, Plymouth brethren and even Mormons have have been talked of in worse terms without making such a histrionic fuss about it, not to mention Moonies and Scientologists. Couldn' be that the Jewish lobby just has the most powerful lobbying organisation in The U.S. government, could it?

 

Just asking nicely in the interest of rational, logical and axiomatic justice and politics:-) .

[Pangloss]

Could you find that for us? I could only find this' date=' from Abraham Foxman, ADL National Director:

It doesn't make sense that the ADL would be so forgiving of the director of [i']The Passion of the Christ[/i] after being so concerned about the impact of the movie.

http://www.npr.org/templates/story/story.php?storyId=5595512&ft=1&f=1001

 

This is just timing -- it's a fast-moving story. I found several stories via Google News on the subject of the ADL accepting Gibson's apology.

 

http://www.postchronicle.com/news/original/article_21231759.shtml

http://www.newsmax.com/archives/ic/2006/8/2/143040.shtml

 

To be honest, I find the fast-moving pace of this story to be amusing and indicative of the inherent hypocrisy of both the news industry and the public relations/special interest group complex*. This thing was played out behind the scenes in a matter of hours on Sunday night, from the issuance of statements to the acceptance of those statements and how the whole thing would play out in the media. So busy was the tail wagging the dog that it's a wonder they bothered to actually report it to a disinterested general public.

 

 

(*That's my new thing, stealing from the concept of Ike's "military-industrial complex". What do you think? The inherent irony of naming a collective bent upon labelling things is intentional. I admit the name could be catchier; suggestions are welcomed!)

[john5746]

It would be useful to know what he actually said which is causing all this fuss. I presume there was more than this.

 

 

I don't think there needs to be any more comments. This comment, his history of intolerance and acceptance of his bigot father are what makes him suspect. I have had a blood alcohol level higher than .12 and I do understand that people say and do stupid things while under the influence. If a group of Jewish people had just harrassed him, I could see why he would say something while drunk, but just pulling it out of nowhere suggests he has suppressed hatred, IMO.

 

I will probably watch his movies, although they tend to be the same, simple good guy, bad guy dribble.

[-Demosthenes-]

Is that really the sum total of his "antisemitic" remarks that are in the public domain and causing all the fuss? All I see there is a bit of bad language and exaggeration. Islam' date=' Jehovah's witnesses, Plymouth brethren and [b']even Mormons[/b] have have been talked of in worse terms without making such a histrionic fuss about it, not to mention Moonies and Scientologists. Couldn' be that the Jewish lobby just has the most powerful lobbying organisation in The U.S. government, could it?

 

Just asking nicely in the interest of rational, logical and axiomatic justice and politics:-) .

 

Doesn't happen to Mormons much anymore... never know who might be one

[5614]

Do you have any details about what his anti-semitic comments were? the only bit in the article is:

"F*****g Jews... The Jews are responsible for all the wars in the world." Gibson then asked the deputy' date=' "Are you a Jew?"[/quote']It would be useful to know what he actually said which is causing all this fuss. I presume there was more than this.

I think it was the bit where he said "F*****g Jews" and blamed them for all the wars, then again, I think watching your (Severian) avatar bounce up and down is more interesting.

 

Some people hate Jews, some hate Christians, some hate Muslims and some hate all religions. Everyone has a view, why do people care so much?