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Does Gauss's Law explain a Higgs field and universal inflation ?


Pbob
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4 minutes ago, studiot said:

So how does it bind neutrons ?

Is a Neutron required in reality ? If a+b=1 and 0 net charge why is the Neutron required ? 

To be honest though what happen within the interior of a Higgs field is different physics to an exterior of a HIggs field . A Higgs field can contain mono-pole particles such as free electrons but the exterior has no containment. A free electron will simply transform into radiant energy outside of a HIggs field and disperse to a density of 0 . 

Charge bottling is a natural process of the assumed Higgs field , a+b required to bottle a+

Sorry  , another new term you hopefully you can understand , Newtons law , every action has an opposite and equal reaction . 

 

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1 hour ago, Pbob said:

To be honest though what happen within the interior of a Higgs field is different physics to an exterior of a HIggs field

How does this claim not contradict the earlier claim ?

On 12/3/2021 at 5:30 PM, Pbob said:

''The Higgs field is a field of energy that is thought to exist in every region of the universe.

 

As a matter of interest what do you think a 'field' is ?

That is how do do define a 'field' ?

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1 minute ago, studiot said:

How does this claim not contradict the earlier claim ?

 

As a matter of interest what do you think a 'field' is ?

That is how do do define a 'field' ?

I define a field as an observable , indistinguishable energy from space . For example you can not see the Earths magnetic field between you and visual objects , the field is ''invisble'' to your eyes and transaprent in physics terms . 

Energy passing through the Earths magnetic field such as television pictures , is also observable  indistinguishable from the space it is passing through but detectable by the mind or a mirror .  

What you need to consider is that we observe the space between visual matter in its precise location because fields and light are transparent and indistingusiahble from space . In simple terms we can see 1ft in front of us because the space , EM fields and energy passing through them fields is not opaque or translucent . 

 

 

 

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16 minutes ago, Pbob said:

I define a field as an observable , indistinguishable energy from space . For example you can not see the Earths magnetic field between you and visual objects , the field is ''invisble'' to your eyes and transaprent in physics terms . 

Energy passing through the Earths magnetic field such as television pictures , is also observable  indistinguishable from the space it is passing through but detectable by the mind or a mirror .  

What you need to consider is that we observe the space between visual matter in its precise location because fields and light are transparent and indistingusiahble from space . In simple terms we can see 1ft in front of us because the space , EM fields and energy passing through them fields is not opaque or translucent . 

 

 

 

Thank you for this answer.

Do you not consider the direction field of a fluid flow to be a field then ?

 

I also asked you if you had not contradicted yourself.

Since you did not answer perhaps you did not understand so I will rephrase my question.

If, as you claim, the Higgs Field pervades the whole of the universe, where is the exterior of this field to be found ?

 

You have also claimed that light accelerates which I why I asked if you had been here before.

Since you say not here is a recent discussion thread about that very subject.

 

I will post the one about the strong force and the neutrons when I have found it again, since you seem to be presenting the same arguments as that poster.

Edited by studiot
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Aww, come on !

The 'strong' force is otherwise known as the color force because it acts on a property of quarks called 'color', and mediated by gluons. It is an asymptotic force which will not let quarks separate, but results in pair creation and color confinement. In hadrons, like protons and neutrons,color confinement results in almost no residual interaction, but just like neutral atoms and the Van der Waals forces holding molecules together, some residual color force provides for interactions outside the hadrons themselves. This 'residual' interaction has been modelled as a Yukawa potential and is mediated by pi meson exchange. That is commonly known as the 'nuclear' force, and it has nothing to do with charge.

The Higgs field is a product of the Higgs mechanism and spontaneous symmetry breaking ( as Joigus poined out ), and is a scalar field. That means each point in space has a directionless vacuum energy value associated with it. There are also fields with value and direction, such as vector fields of electromagnetism. Or the tensor fields of gravity.

You are simply pulling stuff out of your ass, and trying to relate things you don't understand, to each other.

Stop it.
That is not science; it is nonsense.

 

Edit
The vacuum energy inherent in the Higgs field ( false zero point energy ) is one of the candidates for Einstein's Cosmological Constant, and Dark Energy, which may account for ( accelerating ) universal expansion.

Edited by MigL
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2 hours ago, studiot said:

Thank you for this answer.

Do you not consider the direction field of a fluid flow to be a field then ?

 

I also asked you if you had not contradicted yourself.

Since you did not answer perhaps you did not understand so I will rephrase my question.

If, as you claim, the Higgs Field pervades the whole of the universe, where is the exterior of this field to be found ?

 

You have also claimed that light accelerates which I why I asked if you had been here before.

Since you say not here is a recent discussion thread about that very subject.

 

I will post the one about the strong force and the neutrons when I have found it again, since you seem to be presenting the same arguments as that poster.

The poster you are asking about is not myself , I have been working on this far longer .  

The Exterior or S for surface of an assumed Higgs field H can be located in either of two positions :

1.Before that furthest observed visual body 

2.Beyond the furthest visual body 

S= r1 or r^n 

where r is radius and n is n-dimensional or unknown . 

 

I assume the Higgs field could be pushing distant bodies away but also distant bodies could be pushed away from central bodies . 

If you can imagine distant body m2 is attracted to a central body m1 but field is pushing m2 away because of m/V increase , then that is one possible way of physical cosmological expansion . 

The second way is that m2 is being attracted by exterior force F(<hf) , expanding with field H . 

Light does accelerate when exiting a medium , have you ever shun a laser through water ? 

The distant bodies may be beyond a Higgs field ''event horizon'' , attracted centripetal to the center but pushed away by the HIggs field . 

 

 

 

 

 

 

1 hour ago, MigL said:

 

 

Edit
The vacuum energy inherent in the Higgs field ( false zero point energy ) is one of the candidates for Einstein's Cosmological Constant, and Dark Energy, which may account for ( accelerating ) universal expansion.

(kE/V)/t  may increase the density of light within the field interior that in turn , causes field H to expand . 

Edited by Pbob
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8 hours ago, Pbob said:

The poster you are asking about is not myself

You posted both statements here, just as I used the quote function to place them together in my question.

Where you obtained those words is not relevent, exccept you should attribute them if they are someone else's words and be prepared to back them up.

I even rephrased that question to ask

11 hours ago, studiot said:

If, as you claim, the Higgs Field pervades the whole of the universe, where is the exterior of this field to be found ?

That asks where the exterior of the Higgs field is if the H field fills all space

Since the universe, by definition, comprises all there is, where is this 'exterior' ?

You answer does not satisfy this property of the universe as being universal.

8 hours ago, Pbob said:

The Exterior or S for surface of an assumed Higgs field H can be located in either of two positions :

1.Before that furthest observed visual body 

2.Beyond the furthest visual body 

S= r1 or r^n 

where r is radius and n is n-dimensional or unknown . 

 

You are still ignoring my question of what binds uncharged nucleons to other nucleons if the strong force is electromagnetic ?

 

I also asked you what you thought a Field to be and, in fairness, you did reply.

But your definition was far to narrow, involving only energy for isntance.

Here is my working definition. I don't claim that it is complete.

A connected region of any space, whether a real physical space or an artificial theoretical space such as phase space, is said to contain a field of a quantity of interest if a value for that quantity can be assigned to every point in that region.

That defines a Field in the way that Physicists use it.

A Field in Mathematics is quite a different thing, so be careful which sort you mean.

So to specify a field, you need to specify three things. The region, the quantity, the boundary conditions if any, since some Fields have no boundary.
Relationships in the form of equations are also useful in analysing the properties of that Field.
 

The last statement about relationships is vitally important because the field of a single isolated source eg gravitational or electrostatic or magnetic,  contains no energy.
 

I am fond of the expression "It takes two to tango", which expresses the fact that you need at least a second object to introduce 'energy'.

 

Edited by studiot
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14 hours ago, Pbob said:

I have only just joined this forum looking for help . 

 

Maybe you don't see it this way, but everything I've seen so far upstream of this thread is help.

You first need to understand what the Higgs field does in the standard model. The job description of the Higgs field is to provide mass for particles that, for some fundamental reason, shouldn't have one.

The first class is gauge bosons that are found to be massive (W+, W-, and Z0 of the weak interaction).

The other (quite important class) is charged fermions (not Majorana fermions, provided they exist).

That includes quarks, and all leptons (electron, tau, muon...).

It's not through strong coupling, as you've been told; it's through spontaneous symmetry breaking. In a manner of speaking, the particles get 'dressed' with a mass term. It's not at all like a coupling.

How does your Gauss-law-based 'Higgs' do that? How does the symmetry get broken? How does it even work as a Higgs field?

The Higgs field enters the physics through a potential, but it's a potential in the Higgs-field variable itself, not the space variable, as in Gauss' law.

Etc.

You need to understand basic physics. Let alone quantum field theory, and how the vacuum operates in that theory.

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3 hours ago, joigus said:

Maybe you don't see it this way, but everything I've seen so far upstream of this thread is help.

You first need to understand what the Higgs field does in the standard model. The job description of the Higgs field is to provide mass for particles that, for some fundamental reason, shouldn't have one.

 

You need to understand basic physics. Let alone quantum field theory, and how the vacuum operates in that theory.

My question isn't focused on what the Higgs field does , my question is focused on the components that make up the Higgs field which must be in a binded state as explained previous . 

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Bound state? You do have Yukawa couplings in the SM. Are you changing the SM?

Your question isn't focused on what the Higgs field does? Can you 'hear' yourself?

The Higgs field was summoned into physics because of what it does. Why else would we have a Higgs field? To make physics more spicy?

Edited by joigus
minor correction
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5 hours ago, studiot said:

 

 

 

Here is my working definition. I don't claim that it is complete.

A connected region of any space, whether a real physical space or an artificial theoretical space such as phase space, is said to contain a field of a quantity of interest if a value for that quantity can be assigned to every point in that region.

That defines a Field in the way that Physicists use it.

A Field in Mathematics is quite a different thing, so be careful which sort you mean.

So to specify a field, you need to specify three things. The region, the quantity, the boundary conditions if any, since some Fields have no boundary.
Relationships in the form of equations are also useful in analysing the properties of that Field.
 

The last statement about relationships is vitally important because the field of a single isolated source eg gravitational or electrostatic or magnetic,  contains no energy.
 

I am fond of the expression "It takes two to tango", which expresses the fact that you need at least a second object to introduce 'energy'.

 

Here's what I think , before the Big bang there was never a time when there was an absence of space , the big big started from a high dense state . It is my opinion that this high dense state was of two opposite signed point charges that converged to become dense . I then think that the single formed mass then expanded into space because of transition force , all adjacent space having less energy than the dense state singularity  . Then as the formed mass  expanded, the density decreased to 0 becoming field like. As the singularity expanded , the interior did work (See Big Bang explanation of work ) . Presently the field is still expanding into adjacent space .

a+b/F=V 

The strong bond is because either signed opposite point charge of the HIggs field does simultaneously occupy the same position . You can't split the bond because of the low density and ''flexibility'' of the whole , the Higgs field has the ability to curve and become more dense . The HIggs field also grows over time , adding produced kE . 

(a+b)+kE /F =V/t 

 

 

21 minutes ago, joigus said:

 

The Higgs field was summoned into physics because of what it does. Why else would we have a Higgs field? To make physics more spicy?

No , not at all and I haven't suggested such . 

A spider needs a web like particles needs containment . 

Edited by Pbob
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41 minutes ago, Pbob said:

It is my opinion

!

Moderator Note

This is a place for discussing science.

Either mainstream science, or some model you are proposing and can support with evidence. Not your opinion. Not untestable WAGs

 
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1 hour ago, swansont said:
!

Moderator Note

This is a place for discussing science.

Either mainstream science, or some model you are proposing and can support with evidence. Not your opinion. Not untestable WAGs

 

Fare enough but you confirmed earlier the speed of light mechanism was not known . Isn't the idea of discussion to found new theories and build them up to a testable stage ? 

I am terrible at maths and asked for help . 

Some of what I am saying is already tested , water will reach room temperature and other similar scenarios . 

The Earths magnetic pole is being curved towards ''China'' ? because of this . The Earths magnetic field not independent of the Earths mass , the poles cannot flip but can curve by force . 

 

I give up , no idea what people expect . 

 

 

 

 

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2 hours ago, Pbob said:

Here's what I think , before the Big bang there was never a time when there was an absence of space ... this high dense state was of two opposite signed point charges that converged to become dense . I then think that the single formed mass then expanded into space because of transition force , all adjacent space having less energy than the dense state singularity 

This sounds familiar.
Is a previously banned poster trying for another bite at the apple ?

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1 hour ago, Pbob said:

 

I am terrible at maths and asked for help

It is not strictly necessary to excel at maths in order to have a good idea. Historically, Faraday was a perfect example of this.. Although it helps knowing your maths. But you need to understand how the ideas of physics relate to each other.

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7 minutes ago, joigus said:

It is not strictly necessary to excel at maths in order to have a good idea. Historically, Faraday was a perfect example of this.. Although it helps knowing your maths. But you need to understand how the ideas of physics relate to each other.

I understand that and I admire Faraday for his persistence and work . I am aware of the Higgs Boson that gains energy from the Higgs field but also produces energy in the form of kinetic energy , as it moves through the field . I am not a novice at science but I don't know everything , including some of the maths . I can explain Quantum mechanics quite well and add my  thoughts on the mechanics . 

I was hoping Guass's Law could explain a possible Higgs field but it fails . 

We are stuck at C/(d/t)=V/t  if we was to use Coulombs ?

 

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28 minutes ago, MigL said:

This sounds familiar.
Is a previously banned poster trying for another bite at the apple ?

It is certainly a poster previously banned, on numerous occasions, from several other forums I belong to. However I don't know if he has history here.    

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4 hours ago, Pbob said:

Fare enough but you confirmed earlier the speed of light mechanism was not known . Isn't the idea of discussion to found new theories and build them up to a testable stage ? 

You have to meet us partway. It’s one thing to explain why a model is wrong, but it’s too much of a burden to teach basic science on top of that.

 

4 hours ago, Pbob said:

I am terrible at maths and asked for help . 

Which is the bulk of the work.

4 hours ago, Pbob said:

Some of what I am saying is already tested , water will reach room temperature and other similar scenarios . 

The Earths magnetic pole is being curved towards ''China'' ? because of this . The Earths magnetic field not independent of the Earths mass , the poles cannot flip but can curve by force . 

The poles have flipped several times over the history of the earth.

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Just now, swansont said:

 

The poles have flipped several times over the history of the earth.

That is not really possible and speculation. The Earths components ''emit'' fields , these fields are ''fixed'' to the mass but can wave etc . For a field to flip it would have to be independent of the mass , free to move . We have never witnessed a bar magnetic poles flip , If we turn the bar magnet , the field moves with the magnet , it is ''fixed'' . If you spin a magnet fast enough the field will curve but remain ''fixed'' . 

I want to learn maths but how can I learn maths that does not yet exist ? 

I am trying very hard in maths terms to explain a Higgs field and an expansion of this HIggs field , I can represent it easy enough but we aren't getting any math that gives a value . 

What if we said , 

(a+b)(a+b)=1/V 

Could we say that the HIggs field components are 0.5 and 0.5 times kE , 0.5 and 0.5 ? 

 

 

 

 

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1 minute ago, Pbob said:

That is not really possible and speculation. The Earths components ''emit'' fields , these fields are ''fixed'' to the mass but can wave etc . For a field to flip it would have to be independent of the mass , free to move . We have never witnessed a bar magnetic poles flip , If we turn the bar magnet , the field moves with the magnet , it is ''fixed'' . If you spin a magnet fast enough the field will curve but remain ''fixed'' . 

 

https://www.usgs.gov/faqs/it-true-earths-magnetic-field-occasionally-reverses-its-polarity?qt-news_science_products=0#qt-news_science_products

We can see evidence of magnetic polarity reversals by examining the geologic record. When lavas or sediments solidify, they often preserve a signature of the ambient magnetic field at the time of deposition.

You should stop digging

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21 minutes ago, swansont said:

https://www.usgs.gov/faqs/it-true-earths-magnetic-field-occasionally-reverses-its-polarity?qt-news_science_products=0#qt-news_science_products

We can see evidence of magnetic polarity reversals by examining the geologic record. When lavas or sediments solidify, they often preserve a signature of the ambient magnetic field at the time of deposition.

You should stop digging

Ok, but a polarisation reversal is not the same as a flip . A flip would consist of a 180 degrees displacement  . A pole reversal would consist of a change of direction of ''flow'' . 

Do we agree on that ? Or do you think the matter of the field can flip causing tidal surges etc , if so what evidence is there that the field is independent of the Earths mass ? 

IMO the North pole  is presently being forced to curve more South Easterly  from what  information I have read ?

Edited by Pbob
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14 hours ago, swansont said:

 

There is no “matter of the field” - it’s a field, which is not matter. 

Magnetic levitation and the Northern lights disagrees with you . Also a car doing a 180 is not the same as a reversal of polarity . 

 

I'm sorry I have to leave this forum , was hoping to find some intelligence here but I was sadly mistaken .

 

 

 

 

Edited by Pbob
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1 hour ago, Pbob said:

Magnetic levitation and the Northern lights disagrees with you . 

This is pathetic, to be honest. 

Northern lights come from charged particles accelerating - that's where the matter is: the particles. The magnetic field is there even when the northern lights aren't. Similarly, whatever is levitating is where the matter is. Not the magnetic field.

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