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Lighting questions on the Perseverance landing video.


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There is something very strange about the lighting on the Perseverance landing video.
1) Reflection of the “Sun” on the surface of “Mars” as if from a searchlight (too small bright spot). The height of the device at the time of this reflection hitting the frame is 9.5 km.
2) This reflection should be exactly under the Sun, that is, perpendicular to the surface of Mars, that is, point exactly at noon, but judging by the smooth movement of the shadow (on the separating heat shield) in the northeast direction (diagonally at 13:30), there is some kind of contradiction with lighting. The movement of the shadow over the heat shield indicates the position of the Sun in the southwest direction (19:30 hours) relative to the vehicle. The reflection of the "Sun" on the surface of "Mars" indicates the position of the Sun in an easterly direction (15:00 hours) relative to the vehicle.
Perseverance Rover’s Descent and Touchdown on Mars (Official NASA Video)

ezgif-3-cc50997a6900.gif ezgif-7-5fcc6bebdabf.gif
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There nothing glinting on the Mars' surface accorting to official surface photos of that area. The more - there are no round shaped "bright spots" on the surface of that area of Mars.
1) https://www.google.com.ua/maps/space/mars/@18.4982121,77.6169751,26455m/data=!3m1!1e3?hl=ru
gm.jpg
2) https://mars.nasa.gov/mars2020/mission/where-is-the-rover/
pl.jpg

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2 hours ago, AlexandrKushnirtshuk said:

There is something very strange about the lighting on the Perseverance landing video.

I'm sure there's a logical mundane answer to your rather creative conclusion...strange?? Naa, not really. But hey, NASA would be the place to get that mundane answer.

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@AlexandrKushnirtshuk you may look a few seconds further into the video you linked to. The heat shield is probably just wobbling after being dropped? That makes the heat shield look oval from the camera's point of view and reflections are moving.

image.png.3da5164e77970ccab68a4a9fd6c949fb.png

image.png.7568c4fd5730e456ada0c13f8c159a29.png

https://youtu.be/4czjS9h4Fpg?t=36)

7 hours ago, AlexandrKushnirtshuk said:

“Mars”

Why do you say "Mars" instead of Mars? Your point?

 

20 minutes ago, beecee said:

strange?? Naa, not really. But hey, NASA would be the place to get that mundane answer.

I agree.

 

 

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1 hour ago, Ghideon said:

@AlexandrKushnirtshuk you may look a few seconds further into the video you linked to. The heat shield is probably just wobbling after being dropped? That makes the heat shield look oval from the camera's point of view and reflections are moving.

I agree with that. Thanks. There is one source of light there.

But is it possible to explain such a small size sun reflection on the surface of Mars? Yellow dot on the image below is the size of Jezero Crater on Mars. Bright spot on the animation below is reflection of the Sun (from Perseverance landing video), which located inside the Jezero Crater and makes up no more than 10% of the area of Jezero Crater. Last (third) image shows how sun reflection spot looks like on Earth's surface.

jc

ezgif-7-5fcc6bebdabf.gif Ess

Location and size of bright spot (Sun reflection), from animation above, inside Jezero Crater. That bright spot is not in the middle of the crater, and there is nothing bright in that area on two photos of that area, which are posted in the first message of this thread.

jcref

Edited by AlexandrKushnirtshuk
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37 minutes ago, AlexandrKushnirtshuk said:

But is it possible to explain such a small size sun reflection on the surface of Mars?

Why not tell us exactly what you are driving at? Did you notice these "fabricated mundane anomalies" with the other rovers and landers? You know, like the Vikings,  Sojourner, Spirit and Opportunity, and of course Curiosity...Not to mention Phoenix. 

Edited by beecee
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2 hours ago, AlexandrKushnirtshuk said:

But is it possible to explain such a small size sun reflection on the surface of Mars?

I would have to investigate a lot more information to have an opinion on what actually causes the bright spot; sun light, properties of the mars surface at the location, camera optics, signal processing, digital artifacts, combination of these and/or other causes I can't tell from the video.

 

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4 hours ago, AlexandrKushnirtshuk said:

But is it possible to explain such a small size sun reflection on the surface of Mars?

!

Moderator Note

If you continue to use this conspiracy style of questioning, I'm going to shut this down. Why would anyone want to discuss this with you if you keep dodging and hinting at something you can't support? It's not a style that works well in discussion with others. You're  simply calling something into question rather than actually trying to determine an explanation. 

 
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15 minutes ago, AlexandrKushnirtshuk said:

Bright spot is an evidence of the sphericity and size of the sphere, respectively. I think there can be no other explanation.
ezgif-7-5fcc6bebdabf.gif Image.png

But in this case, the shadow on the animation below should move in the diametrically opposite direction.
ezgif-3-cc50997a6900.gif

Have you done as much questionable research into such mundane circumstances with the other many rovers and landers? Will you keep on avoiding answering questions re your intent?

7 hours ago, Ghideon said:

I would have to investigate a lot more information to have an opinion on what actually causes the bright spot; sun light, properties of the mars surface at the location, camera optics, signal processing, digital artifacts, combination of these and/or other causes I can't tell from the video.

 

Exactly! There could be many explanations and as I have said, NASA would be the place for the correct explanation.

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2 minutes ago, beecee said:

Have you done as much questionable research into such mundane circumstances with the other many rovers and landers? Will you keep on avoiding answering questions re your intent?

1) There is video only from the landing of this mars rover.

2) I am trying to understand the nature of the bright spot on the surface of Mars in the Perseverance landing video.

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31 minutes ago, AlexandrKushnirtshuk said:

Bright spot is an evidence of the sphericity and size of the sphere, respectively. I think there can be no other explanation.

Can you show the reasoning and information you use to rule out other possible explanations? I presented some possibilities above. 

 

31 minutes ago, AlexandrKushnirtshuk said:

But in that case, the shadow on the animation below should move in the diametrically opposite direction.

Why should it move in the other direction? 

 

7 minutes ago, AlexandrKushnirtshuk said:

I am trying to understand the nature of the bright spot on the surface of Mars in the Perseverance landing video.

With the information available so far we do not yet know if the bright spot is on the surface of Mars. 

Edited by Ghideon
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12 minutes ago, AlexandrKushnirtshuk said:

1) There is video only from the landing of this mars rover.

2) I am trying to understand the nature of the bright spot on the surface of Mars in the Perseverance landing video.

Oh, OK, my apologies for my suspicious nature. it's just that there is always the ratbag conspiracy nut, all too willing to cry fake, despite the overwhelming, convincing and irrefutable evidence that NASA is the world's leading expert on Martian landings. So, as I previously suggested, why don't you approach the people who launched and landed the rover, and are responsible for maintaining contact with it? Ghideon has also explained the myriad of possibilities.

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3 minutes ago, beecee said:

Oh, OK, my apologies for my suspicious nature.

I think suspicion was appropriate when opening post says:

19 hours ago, AlexandrKushnirtshuk said:

“Sun” on the surface of “Mars”

Instead of: Sun on the surface of Mars. 

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26 minutes ago, Ghideon said:

With the information available so far we do not yet know if the bright spot is on the surface of Mars. 

Bright spot is not moving, it is stationary. So it can not be some kind of lens flare, hence it cannot be anywhere else, except the surface of Mars.

29 minutes ago, Ghideon said:

Why should it move in the other direction? 

Can't explain better than in this image.

mbs.jpg

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1 minute ago, AlexandrKushnirtshuk said:

Bright spot is not moving, it is stationary. So it can not be some kind of lens flare, hence it cannot be anywhere else, except the surface of Mars.

Can't explain better than in this image.

mbs.jpg

You seem to be an expert on light and its reflective and/or refractive properties. So again, why do you keep ignoring the suggestion to check with NASA, who has successfully landed half a dozen or more probes and rovers. They will probably give you a evidenced based, reasonable answer.

In the meantime, I think this is relevant.......

https://scitechdaily.com/curiosity-image-captures-mysterious-bright-spot/

Curiosity Sees Mysterious Bright Spot

A newly released Curiosity image shows a bright spot on the surface of Mars, which was possibly caused by the sun glinting off a rock or cosmic rays striking the camera’s detector.

Images taken by NASA’s Curiosity Mars rover on April 2 and April 3 include bright spots, which might be due to the sun glinting off a rock or cosmic rays striking the camera’s detector.

extract:

“In the thousands of images we’ve received from Curiosity, we see ones with bright spots nearly every week,” said Justin Maki of NASA’s Jet Propulsion Laboratory, Pasadena, California, leader of the team that built and operates the Navigation Camera. “These can be caused by cosmic-ray hits or sunlight glinting from rock surfaces, as the most likely explanations.”

:::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::

 

51 minutes ago, AlexandrKushnirtshuk said:

1) There is video only from the landing of this mars rover.

No that is wrong.

https://scitechdaily.com/image-of-nasas-curiosity-and-its-parachute-heading-towards-the-surface-of-mars/

Curiosity rover and its parachute were spotted by Mars Reconnaissance Orbiter

NASA’s Curiosity rover and its parachute were spotted by NASA’s Mars Reconnaissance Orbiter as Curiosity descended to the surface on Aug. 5 PDT (Aug. 6 EDT). Image credit: NASA/JPL-Caltech/Univ. of Arizona

As NASA’s Curiosity rover descended on Mars, NASA’s Mars Reconnaissance Orbiter captured an image of Curiosity and its parachute with the High Resolution Imaging Science Experiment (HiRISE) camera.

Curiosity and its parachute

Curiosity and its parachute are in the center of the white box; the inset image is a cutout of the rover stretched to avoid saturation. Image credit: NASA/JPL-Caltech/Univ. of Arizona

The image was taken while MRO was 211 miles (340 kilometers) away from the parachuting rover. Curiosity and its rocket-propelled backpack, contained within the conical-shaped back shell, had yet to be deployed. At the time, Curiosity was about two miles (three kilometers) above the Martian surface.

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47 minutes ago, AlexandrKushnirtshuk said:

Bright spot is not moving, it is stationary. So it can not be some kind of lens flare, hence it cannot be anywhere else, except the surface of Mars.

Or it is an artifact in the low res animation. Or post processing of video. Or it is an illusion. Which picture below appears to have the brightest spot? The small inlay or the large picture? 

large.thumb.png.0e18aa2fcf1d7ae23a89883620fb7bd6.png

47 minutes ago, AlexandrKushnirtshuk said:

Can't explain better than in this image.

Have you accounted for possible swinging movements due to the open parachute? Is the shadow from the parachute or the backshell protecting the rover?

Edited by Ghideon
Grammar
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1 hour ago, Ghideon said:

Or it is an artifact in the low res animation. Or post processing of video. Or it is an illusion. Which picture below appears to have the brightest spot? The small inlay or the large picture? 

- brightness + contrast. Same thing. This is the reflection of the Sun on the surface of Mars, and it is too small for the indicated footage scale (altitude of 9.5 km). It doesn't depend on the image resolution.

image

1 hour ago, Ghideon said:

Is the shadow from the parachute or the backshell protecting the rover?

Obviously the shadow on the animation below cannot be from parachute, but from the backshell only.

ezgif-3-cc50997a6900.gif

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8 minutes ago, AlexandrKushnirtshuk said:

- brightness + contrast. Same thing. This is the reflection of the Sun on the surface of Mars, and it is too small for the indicated footage scale (altitude of 9.5 km). It doesn't depend on the image resolution.

Obviously the shadow on the animation below cannot be from parachute, but from the backshell only.

So your saying, in your "expert" opinion, it isn't anything so mundane. So tell us, what you think it is? I mean someone as "expert" as yourself, must have an opinion. Why havn't you checked with NASA, as obviously with the multitude of tricks light can play, as evident with Curiosity and the link I gave, they would be able to give you a definitive answer.

Edited by beecee
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21 minutes ago, beecee said:

So your saying, in your "expert" opinion, it isn't anything so mundane. So tell us, what you think it is? I mean someone as "expert" as yourself, must have an opinion. Why havn't you checked with NASA, as obviously with the multitude of tricks light can play, as evident with Curiosity and the link I gave, they would be able to give you a definitive answer.

1) I do not know how to ask someone from NASA.

2) I am asking this question on this scientific forum in Astronomy and Cosmology section.

3) At the press conference on the video of the Perseverance landing, specialists analyzed almost every frame of these videos. Explained everything except this reflection (bright spot) on the surface of Mars. Personally, I think this is at least strange. Here is a timecode link for that episode of the press conference: See Mars Like Never Before! NASA's Perseverance Rover Sends New Video and Images of the Red Planet Bright spot on the Mars' sufrace - is the only episode, which NASA specialists skipped and left without any explanations.

Edited by AlexandrKushnirtshuk
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1 hour ago, AlexandrKushnirtshuk said:

1) I do not know how to ask someone from NASA.

2) I am asking this question on this scientific forum in Astronomy and Cosmology section.

Yes, you are and Ghideon has given you possible answers, which "strangely"  you see the need to dismiss out of hand. What are your credentials and what expertise do you have? You see anyway it would be rather difficult to give a definitive answer due to circumstances, just a variation of possibilities.

1 hour ago, AlexandrKushnirtshuk said:

3) At the press conference on the video of the Perseverance landing, specialists analyzed almost every frame of these videos. Explained everything except this reflection (bright spot) on the surface of Mars. Personally, I think this is at least strange. Here is a timecode link for that episode of the press conference: See Mars Like Never Before! NASA's Perseverance Rover Sends New Video and Images of the Red Planet Bright spot on the Mars' sufrace - is the only episode, which NASA specialists skipped and left without any explanations.

 Perhaps something as insignificant, trivial and mundane does not need an explanation? Perhaps it's just, you know, an illusion? not worth really commenting on? Did that ever enter into your now rather strange and weird persistence in something so trivial?  Or do you have some hidden agenda?

Again, if you are fair dinkum, and without any agenda, ask NASA.

1 hour ago, AlexandrKushnirtshuk said:

1) I do not know how to ask someone from NASA.

☺️  Are you serious? You have heard of E-Mail, yes?

You are able to search, google and come up with all your videos and photos, claiming some "silly" anomaly, I'm sure you could E-Mail NASA.

Edited by beecee
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19 hours ago, AlexandrKushnirtshuk said:

1) There is video only from the landing of this mars rover.

The Curiosity Mars Descent Imager (MARDI) captured the rover's descent to the surface of the Red Planet. The instrument shot 4 fps video from heatshield separation to the ground*. Note the faint bright spot. The spherical looking object in the picture below is the heat shield.

image.png.30f2ceaaa7d6be9d09ef61301ac16df2.png

16 hours ago, AlexandrKushnirtshuk said:

- brightness + contrast. Same thing. This is the reflection of the Sun on the surface of Mars, and it is too small for the indicated footage scale (altitude of 9.5 km). It doesn't depend on the image resolution.

Repeating it does not rule out other possibilities. What is the correct size of a reflection under the conditions of the Perseverance landing?

 

Side note: It is within reach for radio amateurs to pick up signals from spacecrafts on mission to Mars**.

*) Source: NASA Jet Propulsion Laboratory at YouTube https://youtu.be/UcGMDXy-Y1I?t=16

**)https://spaceweatherarchive.com/2021/02/16/ham-radio-signals-from-mars/

Edited by Ghideon
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