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Yusef

How does predestination work in your belief?

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Hi,

There are at least two choices

  1. Jabr: God Forces everything. How!? Before creating everything God Was Written their predestination 
  2. Ikhtiyar: God CreatED everything and LetS everything work anyhow themselves will, work.

 

I researched and found some beliefs Jabr, and some other, Ikhtiyar.

But i wanna introduce "Bada'" بداء that it seems there is in Shi'a-Islam alone.

 

Well,

I made connection between several concepts of the Religion with today's science that there are specially within Shi'a alone, and even some other beliefs CONDEMN us for that!! And we discuss/debate here for find and access to other parts of the Crossword i proved!

These are:

  • 1. Bada' (predestination/ freewill&forcing)
  • 2. Bodily Ascension (of the prophet/ curving the time)
  • 3. Rij'at (a series of resurrection in the same world)
  • 4. Invisible God forever (not material God like gods of indians or new christians)
  • 5. Race (not racism)
  • 6. Following scientists (bcz of they discover the facts faster than others)
  • 7. Kingdom (against republic[voting], in system of government)

 

These are the beliefs which other beliefs condemn us and we debate/discuss for find the truer for if they are truer we engage them in that concept

It's the better that be through the science!

Discuss/Debate based on your own experiences/study not based on your minds! but if you admit that it will be your opinion not the more.

Thanks.

Well,

I forgot write about Bada'

I created a thread https://www.scienceforums.net/topic/123951-before-the-big-bang/ and I showed a clear scientific reason to others that there is a thing before everything that Has To Be Existing!

The Same Thing Has all descriptions that God of Shi'a-Islam Has!

  1. He Is Invisible at all
  2. He Has Intelligence
  3. He Is The Greatest
  4. Everything be created after Him, those are include the creatures. even if He Will Make any face/body/voice/size/place/time for Himself, He Can't! because those will be include the next things after Him
  5. Anddddd.... here about the Bada'!! As you see, He Is Extended all the TIME from start/beginning to the End!

 

The number 5 proves the Bada' which Shi'a-Islam says!

According to the doctrines of Shi'a:

  • The default is Ikhtiyar[FreeWill],
  • Then God May Edit[Force] bit by bit of the Timeline!

And Bada' means each point of the Timeline that God Made/Makes/Will Edit!

For example,

Someone said according to the Mayan calendar the world should be ended!! but is hasn't been done!!

 

Shi'a Hadith:

One day prophet Solayman[pbuh] stands in his palace and tells people ask everything they will..

One came to him and asked: o' Solomon, a man came to me and was angry and i afraid him! Who is he!?

- He was the Angle Izra'il[Azrael pbuh]

- Wow!! God Has Given you key of everything! Could I ask you take me far from here

- Okay

Then the prophet moved him to jungles of India at the moment

After some day Azrael[pbuh] came to the prophet Solomon[pbuh]:

- O' Azrael, why did you make him worried!? that servant of God!?

- Nooo!! He misunderstood! Because i wasn't angry! And i was wondering that God Was Commanded me to get his soul in the jungle of India at that time! Take a while i met him in Israel a few minutes before death!! Then i was wonderful that how can he go from Israel to India during few minutes even if he has had many wings!!!

 

And i mentioned that The Science is such as an infinity circle crossword puzzle that each concept you solve, it will access you to connect at least two new concepts

Now i eat my launch then use these connections to the above thread and continue together...

Write your

Or Opinions,

Or Knowledges,

Or Experiences

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I use procrastination, rather than predestination, when it comes to matters of belief.

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Neither is compatible with science.
Which is what we discuss here !

Beliefs are discussed on Religious sites.
( and I don't go there and post about Evolution; hint, hint ! )

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1 hour ago, MigL said:

Neither is compatible with science.
Which is what we discuss here !

Beliefs are discussed on Religious sites.
( and I don't go there and post about Evolution; hint, hint ! )

I see you are smoking all times in the scientific site!!

Doesn't your cigarette be end!??:huh:

 

I had mistaken here..

Except God, the same people can make Bada' for the events have been predicted!

Others condemn us and say like the same narration:

One came to Imam Sadiq[S.A.A] and said:

- With Bada' you say that an event shall be happening, then it won't be done and God is not aware for that!!!!

- O' folks,[fools], isn't that that you say 'God Willing[If God Will]!???

- Yes

- But we don't say 'If God Know'!

You should look at the scientific thread to realize what here were said 1400years ago!

'God Willing' is not against 'God Knowing'!

Exactly the science explains that God Is Upon the Timeline and SeeS bit by bit of from the beginning to the last!

May God Bless the great scientist Albert Einstein that opened our minds to find the facts more and more...

Opened our minds to realize what the ancient scientists were said..

 

Also the concept Barzakh[Purgatory] that has been detected scientifically!

That showed the same 'Curving the Time'

 

Well,

An other example:

Quote

 

Shi'a-Hadith

Mobeds[spirituals of Zoroastrianism] of Eafahan, Shiraz, Hamedan, Marv, Samarqand,... made a consultation and told each other that we saw through stars that a prophet came to the Arab with name 'Muhammad' then after him one came with name 'Abubakr' then the second after him will be 'Umar' that in his ruling they add lands of Iran to their caliphate!

Therefore we kill all Muslims of Iran, then attack to their land..

Then the spy reports their decision to Umar, then Umar said: May there was a fire mountain between we and Persians that neither they attack to us nor we to them..

Then he asked each one oftheme to consulting 

Then Hadhrat Ali[S.A.A] said: "we create three armies in Basra,

  1. One be defenders of Ahl-ul-Kitab[Jews/Christians]
  2. One be defenders of women and kids
  3. One be ready IF they attack!

Then they attacked and were been lost versus them!

 

Well,

<ALGORITHM>

IF They didn't attack, they wouldn't attack them too!

 

Well,

  • God Lets all be Free.
  • One is able to change one other's future [But God Knows!]
  • One wants to make one's life lost, but God KnowS that and SeeS on the Timeline that it will be useful for him and Laughs[Therefore LetS him to act] - such as prophet Yusef[pbuh] that his brothers threw him to the well and by this act they made him King of Egypt..

Although God LetS people free! But He Can Force bit by bit on the Timeline..

Quote

 

Shi'a-Hadith

God Said prophet Moses[pbuh] I will punish your nation by famine at X time..

Then the Jews made their houses connected together..

Then the time was been arrived and there wasn't been any famine!

Prophet Moses[pbuh] asked God,

God Said: I Cancelled and forgave them bcz of their behaviour 

 

And God Is on whole the Timeline and Himself Knew that they will connect their houses together!

 

At all this thread and the thread of the link are both complete makers of each other! And only mixing these both makes the Crossword solved!

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Quote

 

Shi'a-Hadith

God Gave prophet Yusef[pbuh] several attributes that one of them was that everything he was said, the same thing would be happened!

One came to him and was decided to kidding him

- O' Yuzarsif, I dreamed last night x-y-z.... a thing that it's interpretation should be his death

- It shows you will be died soon

- LoL 😹

Then tomorrow he died!!

 

He wasn't had that dream but wanted to kidding the prophet means wanted to Yusef's interpretation be untrue but God Made his saying true![FORCE]

 

Bada' is such as when you see a girl in a street and tell her:

- I am seeing you after 10years are sleeping in a corner of a W.C and dogs and cats are pissing on you!😠

- Why do i drug /drinking wine/ being slut/x/y.... that he told me such these things😢

And the girl changes herself and upgrades then after 10years you will see her has been a doctor! engineer! teacher!

Or counter.

Well,

What the better if we use a series political methods that make all the evil events cancelled!

3th world wars,

Armageddon wars,

Etc...

Or at least make them the weakest!

But if our ideas be satanic, then God DeceiveS us and Programs how the events will be against ourselves!

Quote

 

Shi'a-Hadith

Some years before the AkhiruzZaman[end time] God MakeS:

1. Sun Eclipse and Moon Eclipse will be reversed!

2. Sun will be paused center of the sky for several hours!

2. The Sun rises from the west![the earth rotates counter]

Therefore all of calculatings of predictions of astrologers will be error!

 

I wrote all of this post for say this!

And that opens our minds to the theory i brought link to other topic removed by moderator

Edited by Phi for All
Stop advertising your other threads!

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19 hours ago, Yusef said:

Then tomorrow he died!!

Do I sense a time paradox? :D 

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On 1/1/2021 at 6:39 AM, Salik Imran said:

Salam, I am a Muslim.

Salam,

This is a scientific forum and we say anything based on the science and if we will say a thing that haven't had any reason for that, therefore we QUOTE from the scientists and we just analyze their sayings.

 

On 1/1/2021 at 7:48 PM, joigus said:

Do I sense a time paradox? :D 

I said my English is very week and I wrote 'paladox' in the dictionary and it wrote the same 'paradolf' 😹

 

At all connection between God and 'Bada'' is such as a Laptop that a company for example Dell makes, and lets us any thing install in that we will!

And it depends on ourselves that what thing we install and what duty we run in that..

But the maker is able and has complete power to change anything you have entered in that..

1. You see your child and say him/her preaching that IF he continue his behavior, then his life will be X manner!

Then he listens to your preaching and changes himself

Then the thing you predicted for his future, won't be done!

2. A predictor foretell a thing for you!

Then you change yourself and or pray to God to cancel the prediction!

3. Shi'a-Hadith

God punished Jews for 400 years be under tyrannies of Egyptians then they cried and prayed a lot..

Then God Forgave their 130years and after 270years prophet Moses[pbuh] came.

 

It's not against the Knowledge of God!

And God Himself Knew that they will pray purely after the 270year of their slavery

It's Bada' that others specially Sunni-muslims condemn us because their imams hadn't had any knowledge about that

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17 minutes ago, Yusef said:

 

I said my English is very week and I wrote 'paladox' in the dictionary and it wrote the same 'paradolf' 😹

 

At all connection between God and 'Bada'' is such as a Laptop that a company for example Dell makes, and lets us any thing install in that we will!

And it depends on ourselves that what thing we install and what duty we run in that..

But the maker is able and has complete power to change anything you have entered in that..

1. You see your child and say him/her preaching that IF he continue his behavior, then his life will be X manner!

Then he listens to your preaching and changes himself

Then the thing you predicted for his future, won't be done!

2. A predictor foretell a thing for you!

Then you change yourself and or pray to God to cancel the prediction!

3. Shi'a-Hadith

God punished Jews for 400 years be under tyrannies of Egyptians then they cried and prayed a lot..

Then God Forgave their 130years and after 270years prophet Moses[pbuh] came.

 

It's not against the Knowledge of God!

And God Himself Knew that they will pray purely after the 270year of their slavery

It's Bada' that others specially Sunni-muslims condemn us because their imams hadn't had any knowledge about that

Yusef,

I'm interested in holy texts mostly from the point of view of historical criticism. I think they give you clues to the concerns and strife of our ancestors, whether they be Muslim, Christian or Jew, or any other religion. I also enjoy the poetry in them, occasionally. They are literary works of art at some points, political manifestos at another. Not even for a second do I consider that they could be an accurate account of anything. Let alone use them as a proper guide for use in our daily lives.

My kind of questions would be like: What kind of man must Mohammed have been? Why did the monotheists in the 6th century's Middle East --first years of the Hegira or الهجرة‎-- feel compelled to raise in arms against polytheism and "stranded" versions of their faith in one God? Why did the Kaaba --ٱلْكَعْبَة‎-- end up in Mecca? Why did the Qibla --قِبْلَة‎-- change? What consequences had the vying for power between Caliphs during the first few centuries of Islam in the later developments into different branches?

Very similar questions I ask myself about Christianity and Judaism.

I also have faith in archaeology: What you dig from the ground is what it is, far more robust an evidence than anything written in a book. And the reason is I can write in a book now whatever I want, and people now, or people centuries from now, can choose to believe me or not. But if I do this or that, I eat or drink this or that, if I worship to this or that god, the remains of my activity cannot easily misrepresent me and my environment. They are what they are. And they will be there when they're dug out, speaking about me volumes more than anything about myself I write down. And they will be proof of what I did or didn't do. Some data, of course, are lost forever.

That, in a nutshell, is why I don't take literally anything my ancestors said.

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Posted (edited)
2 hours ago, joigus said:

I also enjoy the poetry in them, occasionally.

It's true that in the past the religous establishments sponsored and promoted the best of human arts in pretty well all artistic fields, writing, painting, architecture, sculpture, drama....etc.

They still do so today  but less prominently.

+1

Edited by studiot

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On 1/5/2021 at 12:05 AM, joigus said:

Yusef,

I'm interested in holy texts mostly from the point of view of historical criticism. I think they give you clues to the concerns and strife of our ancestors, whether they be Muslim, Christian or Jew, or any other religion. I also enjoy the poetry in them, occasionally. They are literary works of art at some points, political manifestos at another. Not even for a second do I consider that they could be an accurate account of anything. Let alone use them as a proper guide for use in our daily lives.

My kind of questions would be like: What kind of man must Mohammed have been? Why did the monotheists in the 6th century's Middle East --first years of the Hegira or الهجرة‎-- feel compelled to raise in arms against polytheism and "stranded" versions of their faith in one God? Why did the Kaaba --ٱلْكَعْبَة‎-- end up in Mecca? Why did the Qibla --قِبْلَة‎-- change? What consequences had the vying for power between Caliphs during the first few centuries of Islam in the later developments into different branches?

Very similar questions I ask myself about Christianity and Judaism.

I also have faith in archaeology: What you dig from the ground is what it is, far more robust an evidence than anything written in a book. And the reason is I can write in a book now whatever I want, and people now, or people centuries from now, can choose to believe me or not. But if I do this or that, I eat or drink this or that, if I worship to this or that god, the remains of my activity cannot easily misrepresent me and my environment. They are what they are. And they will be there when they're dug out, speaking about me volumes more than anything about myself I write down. And they will be proof of what I did or didn't do. Some data, of course, are lost forever.

That, in a nutshell, is why I don't take literally anything my ancestors said.

Both of your questions have filled tables of the Crossword in that post and we arrived to a row/column of the Crossword that your questions make them filled!

Quote

 

Shi'a-Hadith

Q: What about the face of God!?

A: It's such as when you say 'House of God'[Ka'aba] or friend of God[prophet Abraham pbuh] or Ruhollah[Spirit of Allah - prophet Jesus pbuh]!

 

In that post we arrived at a series of informations that the Heaviest object of the Cosmos is the Arsh[Throne of God] but in the Qur'an says: 'Allaho TSamad' means the Throne of God is TSamad! Not mean Himself![i think- and or maybe wrong]

And in that post we proved by science that

  • God Has To Be Existing.
  • Also Has To Be One.
  • Also Has To Be The First/Last.
  • Also Has To Have Knowledge of whole the Timeline.
  • Also Has To Be Existing everywhere.
  • Also Can't Make any face/place/body/ for Himself but as they will be include His Creatures!
  • If we ask Him to Explain about Existence of Himself, He at very very least will Say: "I don't know why/how i am!" And at very very least if we ask Him about His Will to creating everything, He will Say: "all of the creatures have been created automatically but I am upon whole the Timeline and I am able to change anything I will! [Exactly such as the example of the laptop/smart phone i brought] or other example that you are watching a dead rat is a corner of a room and a group of ants are running from this corner of the room and you predict that they will be arrived to the rat at the end of the room! but you are able to change their path or kill some of them... etc...

This is a scientific forum that I say these informations! And you are all scientists or science lovers! And are able to realize/recognise what i say.. otherwise the rest of people[non-scientific] will be crazy if read these concepts!

If God Wanna Speak with prophet Moses, He Should Make a fire and Move the molecules of air for Make His Voice simulation.

And by the same fire Shows to the prophet that he look at that place!

Quote

 

Shi'a-Hadith

At the Akhir-uz-Zaman[end of time] you will see those who seems are followers of Qur'an and waiting for coming of the Saviour, many of them rise against him!! And you will see many people who seemed like to Sun/Moon worshippers, they will be engaging to his army!!

 

I'm sure 99% that it's about all scientists especially the astronomers 

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36 minutes ago, Yusef said:

And in that post we proved by science that

  • God Has To Be Existing.
!

Moderator Note

NO! You proved nothing like this. Preaching is bad enough, but lies like this can't be tolerated. Please find somewhere else to post crap like this.

 

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