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The Greatest President in History of All Time!

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45 minutes ago, Ten oz said:

At a minimum the govt should strive to implement the sort of regulations people mistakenly assume already exist.

As a minimum, government should start by not being one of the biggest producers of lies.
Clearly, that's not going to happen until there's a change in President.

 

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49 minutes ago, John Cuthber said:

As a minimum, government should start by not being one of the biggest producers of lies.
Clearly, that's not going to happen until there's a change in President.

TBH, I don't think that will happen unless the government/populace understands what amendments actually mean, or why a polarised system is grist to the mill.

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8 hours ago, Ten oz said:

However asking the Social Media giants to label professional accounts is easy. Alphabet Inc (Google) knows which YouTubers they are sending money to and can add revenue source disclosures that application process. I think knowing that the RNC, DNC, NRA, NAMBLA, Scientology, or whomever is paying the personality and or for the content viewed would make a big difference in how people view that content. 

While I think that is a step in the right direction, I doubt it would have a lot of impact for a range of reasons. In no particular order:

- Information and entertainment have been mixed to such a degree that most folks apparently do not distinguish them anymore. Fox News has a small news segment and a huge opinion making machinery, for example. The latter has a much higher impact on public opinion than the former. One could say the same about talk shows and other entertainment segments that have become alternatives to news.

- Media consumption has changed to a degree that a significant proportion of the population does not care where information comes from, as long as it is something that they feel strongly about. Case in point, stupid conspiracy theories are spreading like wildfire, and there is not a single serious news source behind it. Just random folks sharing it and to many this is enough to make it reality.

- Studies have shown that lies created to evoke emotions (typically outrage) spread much faster through social media than anything informative. Again, I think the distinction between trusted and fake or entertainment sources is of no relevance for many folks and I suspect it will get worse. People now grow up in constant communication with folks that may not even be real persons. Maybe this is an old man yelling at cloud situation, but in class I see an increasing proportion of students that are outrageously misinformed. While many (if not most) can still be educated I feel that it is getting harder and harder. The signal to noise ratio has been so bad, that you have to fight noise almost constantly now.

- Connected to that, folks have grown more skeptical of experts of any sorts, but at the same time random folks with no expertise are declared experts, which further erodes trust. This can be expanded to traditional news outlets, which are not trusted by a significant segment of the population. It is like the Murdoch empire on steroids but more nebulous. 

 

 

 

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So many tools exist for evaluating an argument, believing in fantastic conspiracy is a choice.
I guess if you substitute "jewish bankers" for "lizard alien" Q sounds familiar enough, but what is the real appeal?
Does it satisfy the little Conan (the barbarian) in us all who wants to see our enemies driven before us and hear the lamenting of their women?
Would teaching Rhetoric in school help cut down on newstainment/newspinion?

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5 hours ago, CharonY said:

While I think that is a step in the right direction, I doubt it would have a lot of impact for a range of reasons. In no particular order:

- Information and entertainment have been mixed to such a degree that most folks apparently do not distinguish them anymore. Fox News has a small news segment and a huge opinion making machinery, for example. The latter has a much higher impact on public opinion than the former. One could say the same about talk shows and other entertainment segments that have become alternatives to news.

- Media consumption has changed to a degree that a significant proportion of the population does not care where information comes from, as long as it is something that they feel strongly about. Case in point, stupid conspiracy theories are spreading like wildfire, and there is not a single serious news source behind it. Just random folks sharing it and to many this is enough to make it reality.

- Studies have shown that lies created to evoke emotions (typically outrage) spread much faster through social media than anything informative. Again, I think the distinction between trusted and fake or entertainment sources is of no relevance for many folks and I suspect it will get worse. People now grow up in constant communication with folks that may not even be real persons. Maybe this is an old man yelling at cloud situation, but in class I see an increasing proportion of students that are outrageously misinformed. While many (if not most) can still be educated I feel that it is getting harder and harder. The signal to noise ratio has been so bad, that you have to fight noise almost constantly now.

- Connected to that, folks have grown more skeptical of experts of any sorts, but at the same time random folks with no expertise are declared experts, which further erodes trust. This can be expanded to traditional news outlets, which are not trusted by a significant segment of the population. It is like the Murdoch empire on steroids but more nebulous. 

 

 

 

I am not opposed to incremental improvement. Steps in the right direction is a useful place to start. Of course more needs to be done but good isn't the enemy of great.

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On 9/13/2020 at 3:45 PM, MigL said:

Gibbon, an ape, as in Rise of Planet of the Apes ?
Or E. Gibbon, as in The Decline and Fall of the Roman Empire ?

I wasn't sure if anyone would pick up on that, but it just didn't work using Spengler and the Decline of the West. :)

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