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Kyros

How can we apply accoustics to tell the difference in power between these two characters?

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Posted (edited)

Hi! I wonder if you guys could help me with applying some basic knowledge of accoustics to analyze these two situations.

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vs this is what happens in the very next chapter (meaning that the author I think wants to portray a difference in power between these two, but by how much is the question...? (And btw in japanese you read from right to left (if you were a bit confused by that)

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So we have a situation where two swords are clashing (two blades of extremely fine quality that are by far sturdier and tougher than regular swords), and in the other situation she is using the same blade to attack Vergo who is merely blocking and using a hard coating on the outside of his arm (as in just the outside of his arm is coated, not his entire arm) to defend against the strike. The sound from respective clashes are the same basically (and disregarding the difference in the size of the rooms they''re in, here I think the author focuses in on the sounds of the clashes themselves and not the acoustics of the room; as in the acoustics produced as a result of the material properties of the sword, Vergo's defensive coating, and the relative forces applied)

SItuation 1: Zoro uses a lot of force (with one arm) but doesn't go all-out, and Tashigi just blocks rather casually in my opinion (she has no will to fight, as per his own statement).

Sitution 2: Tashigi goes all out (in order to defend her subordinates that are being slaughtered by Vergo) and as such uses all her force, and Vergo just casually blocks by applying the coating, but also because he is just that much stronger physically he doesn't budge at all.

The fact that the accoustics here are close to being very similar is very interesting, and certainly a hint from the author about how powerful they are in relation to one another (as these two instances are one chapter apart). But I'm just really unsure of how to judge this situatin from a purely accoustic point of view. Vergo's arm is thicker than the sword, but the coating is only applied on the outside, so that leaves me a ibt confused as to how that affects the sound output. Should  use this formula for frequency (the same used to calculate the frequency of tuning forks)

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The answer relates to the difference in elastic modulus and the density between Vergo's coating and Zoro's sword, but I'm wandering in the dark here. How would you using your knowledge of how sound and accoustics work (and given the parameters I jsut described) evaluate this situation if your life depended on it? ;)

Appreciate any input here!

 

 

 

Edited by Kyros

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Before you dive into the physics are you familiar with the difference between hard and soft magic systems in literature? If so, do you know which one this is (i can't tell from the excerpt )? I ask because if the author uses a soft system then you're going to be chasing rainbows. Even if it's a hard system -  with explicit rules - there's no reason it needs to be based on real laws of physics - it just needs rules that are consistent within its world. That said, some authors do try to make their systems consistent with real world physics, to a degree.

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30 minutes ago, Prometheus said:

Before you dive into the physics are you familiar with the difference between hard and soft magic systems in literature? If so, do you know which one this is (i can't tell from the excerpt )? I ask because if the author uses a soft system then you're going to be chasing rainbows. Even if it's a hard system -  with explicit rules - there's no reason it needs to be based on real laws of physics - it just needs rules that are consistent within its world. That said, some authors do try to make their systems consistent with real world physics, to a degree.

Yes he tries to comply with the laws of physics and science, and for the purposes of this thread I want you to work under that assumption. If so, how would you judge the situation?

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Sound we regularly experience carries very little energy.

80 dB is ~ 1 milliwatt, so assuming 100% efficiency:

“to heat up a quarter liter of coffee 50 C it would take:
1 year, 7 months, 26 days, 20 hours, 26 minutes and 40 seconds”

https://www.physicscentral.com/explore/poster-coffee.cfm

 

130 dB is just 10 watts, though it is logarithmic 

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sound_power

 

 

 

 

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And because of the logarithmic scaling...

A sonic boom from a supersonic fly-by can reach 200 dB.
Or in terms of power, the shock front may approach 100 megawatts per square meter.

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!

Moderator Note

Since this is more "Fantasy Fun with Physics" rather than actual physics, I am moving it to the lounge.

 

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Posted (edited)

Anyone has any idea? The coating is harder than the swords, but it is only coated superficially, and it only envelops the hand and forearm. The density and the the elastic modulus is higher for the coating comapred to the swords, but there is no real resonance being formed here as the coated arm essentially stops her short. The metals cling so loud they're essentially clashing equally here, with their resonance building on one another, as in it forms a overtone or second harmonic (if that a correct way of describing it?). The difference with the coating here is that it's level of toughness and hardness is much higher. I'm not quite sure how this all effects the pitch and the frequency output

Edited by Kyros

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34 minutes ago, Kyros said:

Anyone has any idea?

You need to ask Agatha Heterodyne

ggenius.thumb.jpg.b884ea857f658f3ab043a4b5928860da.jpg

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Posted (edited)
On 7/4/2020 at 2:43 PM, Strange said:

You need to ask Agatha Heterodyne

ggenius.thumb.jpg.b884ea857f658f3ab043a4b5928860da.jpg

Sure I will!

But here is a question for you, engineer. Would not the swords (similar quality swords) produce resonance if clashed together, ie they are high grade metals (as such sonoric) with enhanced sonoric output due to achieving resonant frequency, ie the fundamental frequency of swords in this case? And in the case of the guy who is capabel of cladding the outside of his arm with a superhard substance, he blocks her attack such that she almost falls down from the direct impact (as such the sonoric output should be lower I imagine as the impact is more elastic than inelastic compared to clashing of the the swords, as such producing less vibratio of the air). She also imbues her sword with this substance in the clash, but the guy is simply far too capable of this and his arm is simply way harder, and he himself is physically stronger by far here.

The wave speed is a function of metal stiffness and spring caracteristics. Spring steel is used for tuning forks for instance. When she strikes his arm, the sound output is actually higher (three exclamation points compared to two) in spite of the impact being such that it shouldn't lend itself well to sound production. As such, the loudness or sonority in this case is more due to the stiffness of the substance he clads his arm with which should be >>> Zoro's sword. Is that something you can dig it or is it a wrong way to look at it from a physics point of view (I see you like physics ;))?

Edited by Kyros

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