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I just came across this, its Crazy!

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/education/4697461.stm

whats next? "Oh you didnt Lose, you were just Winningly Challenged".

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...and I'm not a sloppy housekeeper, just "neatness challanged".

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YOU CAN'T CALL IT MAD!! What are you thinking!?!!?! It's intelectually destabilized.

Most of political correctness is madness. like changing the words of baa baa black sheep cos it might offend coloured people. its called baa baa black sheep cos its a sheep that is BLACK not white or purple or yellow but black. (doesn't say anything about snow white being offensive to white people though). While i agree with not being prejudiced things are now going too far, to me it failure will always be failure and not deferred success.

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So... why exactly do you guys keep voting for Labour?

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most of us dont.

democracy in action

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To me, this is like hiding all the sharp knives in the house from a 6 year-old. You may think it keeps them from harm but it doesn't teach them what to expect when they eventually get hold of one.

They should be teaching that the only failure is in not trying. To me, not exposing children to the concept of failure is not trying. There are ways to be positive without avoiding the issue.

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Phi for All, I totally agree with you. By not teaching a child to face the real world would be even more damaging when they grow older, mentally they may not even mature.

I just wondering why the authorities keep suggesting or implementing crazy ideas that majority of us don't even agree to? Is it becuase they have more senses than us, or they just simply out of touch with reality?

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Sounds ok to me actually. They haven't learned the required material seems more accurate than them failing. The problem is that they will probably still go to the next stage, without the proper foundation. If we had kids go through school at the rate they learn rather than at a set metric I think it would make school more valuable for kids at both extremes.

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I just wondering why the authorities keep suggesting or implementing crazy ideas that majority of us don't even agree to?
Tbh, this kind of thing has been going on in the US for years. I'm really sorry the infection has spread across the pond. I truly hope the UK can show the US how to find their common sense again.

Besides what they're proposing in this article, in the US the schools are really concerned about what I call STDs (Suddenly Too Dangerous). Games and equipment kids have played with for 100 years are now being removed from schools. Tetherball poles, seesaws, dodge ball, all have the potential for either bruising the kids physically or mentally so out they go.

I think this mentality is creating kids who aren't ready for the real world by the time they're 18-20. Not trusting kids to deal with potential harm means they have no defenses built up when it finally finds them.

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It actually scares me that supposedly intelligent people can hold and express such opinions. Esp teachers who are responsible for introducing children to the concepts of logic and reasoning.

If there was a way to combine a Meme like the ' deferred success' idea with a dose of drug resistant Anthrax i think the human races bloodstock would improve considerably. Homo Sapiens is one species which needs some urgent culling.

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I just came across this' date=' its Crazy!

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/education/4697461.stm

whats next? "Oh you didnt Lose, you were just Winningly Challenged".

It reminds me of the George Carlin routine on euphemisms.

The moral of the story is to bury the pain under a mountain of jargon.

"Bobby, you didnt flunk the 8th grade, you're just a penultimate achiever!"

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Maybe it's the teachers unions and academia, our body of knowledge who have gone mad.

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Re the George Carlin routine. Whilst I agree on the whole, I do think his take on the transition from 'Shell shock' to 'Post-traumatic Stress Disorder' is a poor example. This transition was a refinement in diagnosis, not the 'softening' of the term. In the first world war, they used to think the the condition was caused by the shock waves generated by shells passing overhead (hence 'shell-shock'). These days we know this to be inaccurate. We know now that the condition is a syndrome of maladaptive psychphysiological stress responses that present after exposure to psychological trauma exceeding what one would normally expect to have to deal with in life (hence post-traumatic stress disorder). I pretty much agree with everything else he says

Maybe it's the teachers unions and academia, our body of knowledge who have gone mad.

This seems more likely. I know there are some pretty whacked out theories coming from the teaching and learning groups regarding 'student empowerment' and suchlike. I have a little talk I give first year students. I tell them that whilst they have the right to Higher Education, they do not have a right to a degree. They have the right to try for a degree, but they also have the right to fail and whilst I will help them attempt to gain a degree, I will not interfere with any of their rights in the process. I come from the Tommy Lee Jones school of teaching

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Why is this mad PC rather than just normal PC?

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because it seems to know no bounds of whats REALLY correct and whats just an excuse to jump on a bandwaggon because MAYBE someone could get offended. Often creating More problems than it solves, or even inventing problems where there are non.

ba ba Green sheep! or Chalk board!

vilifying the word "Black" whats wrong with the word black?

Nothing, so why change it?

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A small and selfish part of me is saying "This is great! The more people who're turned into morons by the educational system, the fewer people who'll be effectively competing with me for jobs!"

And an even darker corner of me is contemplating a long-term fix for the situation that involves the phrase "soylent green".

Mokele

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And an even darker corner of me is contemplating a long-term fix for the situation that involves the phrase "soylent green".

Mokele

Hurrah!

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So... why exactly do you guys keep voting for Labour?

Democracy sucks.

I was also disgusted by the suggestion of winingly challenged.

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Oddly enough, this is the first time I've run across something like this and what they were doing seemed to make real sense. I'm presuming, YT2095, that you object to the term "deferred success." It is a concept that I can get behind, actually, even if there might be a better way to say it. It sounds too stuffy. A child should not have to see tests and grades the way I saw them, a way contrived to hurt and harass people. There are better ways to get better results.

"Happy slapping" is a euphemism that definitely had to go. I was pleased to see in that article that they rejected one example of political correctness which was too obviously stupid. Bullying is bullying.

I just came across this' date=' its Crazy!

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/education/4697461.stm

whats next? "Oh you didn`t Lose, you were just Winningly Challenged".

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If "deffered success" was used widely enough then it would eventually mean the same thing anyways, and become a negative phrase, meaning the same thing as "fail". Then they would have to come up with another one

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I'm glad to see that even on a largely left wing site like this, the vast majority of you (except Thomas K) agree this is ridiculous. It is simply one more example of the left wing deconstruction of all standards in Western civilization. It is moral relativism. There is no right, no wrong. All that matters are feelings. Every society, every idea, every level of performance is equal. There can be no failure and no success. Only high self esteem or low self esteem. Telling a child he has failed a test when, in fact, there is no right or wrong, only serves to lower his self esteem. Allowing children to play competitive games also must be forbidden because this creates winners and losers and will lower the self esteem of the losers. This is the natural and unavoidable consequence of the philosophy of moral relativism.

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Well, this is the first time I've seen something that looked like a symptom of political correctness and it looked like I could actually get behind it.

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...Bullying is bullying.

How is it bullying, if you fail, then you fail... I don't understand.

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Allowing children to play competitive games also must be forbidden because this creates winners and losers and will lower the self esteem of the losers.
I comprehend where you're coming from, but I can't help but feel your method of protection would cause more harm than good. If a child loses self-esteem over something as pathetic as losing a soccer game, then there's obviously a bigger problem, one separate from a harmless, healthy game. If you aren't prepared to lose, don't play the game. A kid has to learn that you don't always come in first, or even never make the top ten. Failure on such a minor scale is necessary to harden us for the times when we must face up to our true failures in life, which are inevitable.

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So... why exactly do you guys keep voting for Labour?
Get off your agenda long enough to read the article Pangloss! The Secretary of Education (that's a Labour government minister) gave the idea 0/10.

To everyone who thinks this is pc gone mad here is a simple story. When my daughter was learning to read she was having big problems. I spent lots of time with her trying every way I knew how with little effect. Finally, in desperation, after she had made another very poor attempt at reading her material I said 'That was very good. Much better than last night.'

In other words I lied through my teeth and kept on lying, until two weeks later it wasn't a lie anymore. Just a thought.

Edit: You are all hypocrites. That was just to get your attention. Those of you in business will have attended sales or management courses. A common theme, implicit or explicit, is the power of positive thinking. At the root of this is that there are no problems, only opportunities; that failures do not exist, they are, indeed, just a matter of deferred success. So, when applied to mature, responsible adults it is not only acceptable, but encouraged to rename failures and setbacks in positive terms, but when we deal with children they must face the full force of 'reality'.

Interesting dichotomy.

[And there is such a wealth of data confirming the advantage of such 'self deception' it is arguably immoral and certainly foolish not to embrace it.]

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