EdEarl Posted June 23, 2017 Share Posted June 23, 2017 Both the House and Senate "healthcare" bills cut funding and will eliminate healthcare for millions of people. The result will arguably be more people die from lack of care than died on 911. It is unethical. Why are people so passive about such treatment from our politicians and the rich who force these policies on us. In reality, the "healthcare" bill is only one assault on the American people by oligarchs, but it is the current issue. I am frustrated and angry. With healthcare costs rising my savings can be quickly consumed, and I may become a statistic of inadequate healthcare. If my death could assure others would not be so denied, it would be OK with me, but thousands of deaths resulting by the actions of our leaders is an insult to humanity. Rage, rage against the dieing of the light. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
imatfaal Posted June 23, 2017 Share Posted June 23, 2017 It is a reduction in service for an increase in price; all to allow tax cuts / breaks for the wealthy, employers, and providers. For many poor Trump voters they will soon realise they have been complicit in the removal of a really good thing; once they understand that ACA is being gutted and ruined they might mourn its passing. And learn, too late, they grieved it on its way 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EdEarl Posted June 23, 2017 Author Share Posted June 23, 2017 Money buys votes, popular votes, senate votes, congressional votes, legislative votes, etc. Large contributions must go to PACs. However, small contributions can go directly to a politician. For example, it is legal for me to send my senator, congressman, legislator, etc. $1. Would it be legal for a non-profit company to hold $1 from many voters who give to "John Doe," a senator, after the senator voted against a specific bill, e.g., the GOP healthcare bill. Could all those $1 contributions go directly to "John Doe?" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
swansont Posted June 23, 2017 Share Posted June 23, 2017 Why are people so passive about such treatment from our politicians and the rich who force these policies on us. Many aren't being passive. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EdEarl Posted June 23, 2017 Author Share Posted June 23, 2017 Many aren't being passive. I do not wish additional violence. But, I wish Gandhi's reincarnation would come to our aid. The people need to speak louder; we are being too passive. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Phi for All Posted June 23, 2017 Share Posted June 23, 2017 Americans aren't really passive in general. It's not like docility, where they don't mind being beaten. They've usually been emotionally hijacked by the way they're (mis)informed. I think it's more like acceptance of the narrative. Many people have been starved of education for quite a while, and now they simply accept that whatever the Republican wealthy elite tells them is good or bad. Whatever the billionaires want will work out best for all in the end. Many can't even tell you specifically why they absolutely, positively, to the root of their souls, hate Obamacare. Isn't it amazing how many People who could really use decent healthcare reject it when it comes from a source other than the GOP? And mind-boggling that the GOP gets them to accept something much worse for more money? I'm sorry, my Republican friends, but right now you guys look like a bunch of rubes at the carnival. Many Americans just accept that billionaires must know what they're doing, and that they'll benefit somehow from helping the rich get richer. How else can you explain why the rural People who helped put this whole perfect storm government in place will remain Republican after the GOP kicks them to the curb because they aren't wealthy enough to take care of themselves properly? Why does the GOP care more about the wealth of the wealthy than they do about the health of Republicans? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
swansont Posted June 23, 2017 Share Posted June 23, 2017 I do not wish additional violence. But, I wish Gandhi's reincarnation would come to our aid. The people need to speak louder; we are being too passive. Gandhi said "I have never advocated 'passive' anything." Passive and nonviolent are not the same thing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EdEarl Posted June 23, 2017 Author Share Posted June 23, 2017 Gandhi also said, "Poverty is the worst form of violence." Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Phi for All Posted June 23, 2017 Share Posted June 23, 2017 Speaking louder is a great start. I'm convinced there are more reasonable People out there (in ALL walks of life) than we're being led to believe. We need to start speaking louder about what we all need, instead of embracing the ruthless, only out for yourself, cutthroat capitalist attitude. We need more ruth around here, not less. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EdEarl Posted June 23, 2017 Author Share Posted June 23, 2017 I've put my senators and representative phone number on my phone so I may call and leave a message. Afterward, I called each of them with a message about voting against them if they vote to pass the GOP health care bill. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
iNow Posted June 23, 2017 Share Posted June 23, 2017 (edited) I'm thinking of becoming a volume supplier in the artisanal pitchfork and flaming torch business Edited June 23, 2017 by iNow 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sicarii Posted June 23, 2017 Share Posted June 23, 2017 (edited) How else can you explain why the rural People who helped put this whole perfect storm government in place will remain Republican after the GOP kicks them to the curb because they aren't wealthy enough to take care of themselves properly? 85% of GOP electorate are (White) Christian, most are Evangelical. I suspect that has something to do with it. Edited June 23, 2017 by Sicarii Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Phi for All Posted June 23, 2017 Share Posted June 23, 2017 85% of GOP electorate are (White) Christian, most are Evangelical. I suspect that has something to do with it. I can see where people who think their god(s) cure disease would be irked at being forced to pay for someone else's doctor. Do these people not go to the doctor themselves? Isn't that only Christian Scientists? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
swansont Posted June 23, 2017 Share Posted June 23, 2017 I can see where people who think their god(s) cure disease would be irked at being forced to pay for someone else's doctor. Do these people not go to the doctor themselves? Isn't that only Christian Scientists? Social resentment would be my guess. They are not willing to have their money go to people who they feel are inferior to themselves. Whites are hard-working, others are lazy or otherwise undeserving. That's the dogma that's been reinforced for years. So much so that they are willing to pass on scrutinizing whether their elected officials are Christians by looking at their actions. The politicians only need to be Christians when it's convenient, and under specific situations. But the ACHA is wildly unpopular. It's not like the GOP is passing this with widespread support. To paraphrase something from twitter I saw earlier today, it's as if they don't think they'll ever have to compete in a free election ever again. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Phi for All Posted June 23, 2017 Share Posted June 23, 2017 But the ACHA is wildly unpopular. It's not like the GOP is passing this with widespread support. To paraphrase something from twitter I saw earlier today, it's as if they don't think they'll ever have to compete in a free election ever again. Sounds ominous when you put it that way. Like why bother putting down plastic tarp to protect the carpet when we're burning the whole house down around your freshly executed bodies? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EdEarl Posted June 23, 2017 Author Share Posted June 23, 2017 (edited) I suspect some Christians believe we are experiencing end of days; thus, there is no reason to be concerned about climate change. Others won't vote for a party that supports planned parenthood and abortion. Edited June 23, 2017 by EdEarl Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MigL Posted June 24, 2017 Share Posted June 24, 2017 Its actually a lot more simple... Americans need to start looking at party policy, not just vote for their grandfather's party. America is so polarized, republicans will always be Republicans and democrats will always be Democrats no matter what policies 'their' party implements, that republicans consider this a good thing, and anything Democrats do a bad thing ( even if good ). The same holds true with good Republican policy. M Romney's health care plan was a 'bad thing' to democrats. Until it was co-opted by B Obama's Democrats. And of course, politicians and Governments are bought and are at the whim of 'big money'. And they're going to bend over backwards to make sure 'big money' gets its rewards for helping elect them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
imatfaal Posted June 24, 2017 Share Posted June 24, 2017 ... America is so polarized, republicans will always be Republicans and democrats will always be Democrats no matter what policies 'their' party implements, that republicans consider this a good thing, and anything Democrats do a bad thing ( even if good ). The same holds true with good Republican policy. M Romney's health care plan was a 'bad thing' to democrats. Until it was co-opted by B Obama's Democrats.... This old chesnut of they are both as bad is just plain wrong. I think in your country and in mine it is closer to be correct - but in the USA it is simply not true. BTW I think Romneycare was statute which was created by a Democrat legislature under a Republican Governor (he vetoed the left wing dirty socialist stuff). The fact that Romney had worked with Dems was a major negative against him for many of the tea-party faithful that were the ideological core of the modern GOP Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MigL Posted June 24, 2017 Share Posted June 24, 2017 It's also wrong to say that since Republicans are wrong more often, the electorate shouldn't look at policy, and just vote against the Republicans all the time. That is what's happening in the US, whole generations have always voted Republican, and will continue to do so, no matter what their policies, while others have always voted Democrat, even those times when Republicans may have been the better option. This is no doubt, one of the effects ( along with disenfranchised voters who voted against 'traditional' government and politicians ) that helped get D Trump elected; A lot of republican voters simply held their nose and cast a ballot for the Republican party. And look where that got us ! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Phi for All Posted June 24, 2017 Share Posted June 24, 2017 It's also wrong to say that since Republicans are wrong more often, the electorate shouldn't look at policy, and just vote against the Republicans all the time. This is a GOP tactic, not one the Dems practice much. Many more attempts at bipartisanship on smart legislation were met with Republican rejection, even when it was sponsored by one of their own. You remember how they did exactly what you're talking about with anything "Obama" for 8 years, right? In other countries, those elected are supposed to work together to form an effective government. In the US, each party seems to work for different billionaires, and their aims are often at odds because they aren't trying to be effective leaders of a prosperous country, they're trying to be richer. It is disconcerting to think the billionaires no longer care if we're healthy enough to contribute to making them richer. It's as if they've crunched the numbers, and somehow the masses aren't as important to the bottom line any more. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MigL Posted June 24, 2017 Share Posted June 24, 2017 I'm just making the point that voters should inform themselves of a party's platform and not simply vote 'as they always have'. But since you're so eager to find blame, instead of solutions... Are you saying neither side should be 'better' and move on for the betterment of the country ? That because one side does it so often, its justified when the other does it less frequently. An 'eye for an eye' as it were ? I think Israel and her Palestinean/Middle East neighbours have been trying that approach for the last 70 yrs. How's that working out ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
swansont Posted June 24, 2017 Share Posted June 24, 2017 I suspect some Christians believe we are experiencing end of days; thus, there is no reason to be concerned about climate change. Others won't vote for a party that supports planned parenthood and abortion. For the latter, they've bought into the lie, since federal money can't be used that way. The proposed legislation is very much contrary to allegedly being pro-life Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Phi for All Posted June 24, 2017 Share Posted June 24, 2017 But since you're so eager to find blame, instead of solutions... Are you saying neither side should be 'better' and move on for the betterment of the country ? That because one side does it so often, its justified when the other does it less frequently. An 'eye for an eye' as it were ? Actually, I'm leaning more towards why the hell are Americans so hung up on having the freedom to choose from a myriad of products, services, and programs, yet accept a mere two choices for one of the most important aspects of their lives? I say now is the right time for a third party. The Democrats are just serving a more humane, reasonable group of billionaires, but the problems we have now mostly stem from a lack of support for the bulk of those who've committed to civilized living. So much wrong could be righted with so little effort, but not until the influence of wealth over our governing process is better regulated. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Manticore Posted June 24, 2017 Share Posted June 24, 2017 And learn, too late, they grieved it on its way Damn! my brain must be going. I had to check to be sure that was Dylan Thomas. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HB of CJ Posted June 24, 2017 Share Posted June 24, 2017 Here we go again. USA Constitutional law. There is no mandate for Federal Health Care. Let the States take care of it. Or the individual. -2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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