# Eric 5

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162

2. ## Gravity is Time

O.K. Lets get to the basics here. Do objects physically exist? I say yes. If you say yes, then do these objects occupy a location in space? I say yes. If you say yes, then can there be objects that exist in a location without ever being observed? I say yes. What say you?
3. ## Gravity is Time

Originally Posted by Eric 5 Is this whole thing a concept and not a physical reality? Alright, so you believe that length contraction is a physical reality. Right? After reading my post that you were answering, can you give some explaination on how objects will physically contract to fit the frame of reference of the observer? After reading my whole post, the only comment that you can make is that you do not agree that length contraction is a concept. Is that the only point that you disagree with about my post? Can I assume that you only find a disagreement in the first sentence of my post and the rest you agree with. You really did not say much. Did you read the whole post?

5. ## Why does speed time slow down when you go fast then the speed of light

No, I was referring to that site to support your idea of an atom. I went to that site and got the understanding of what you were trying to tell me.
6. ## Gravity is Time

If there are three observers in three different frames of reference observing the same physical object, they will observe that object being at a different length than the other frames of reference. That object is a physical thing. That object is at the effect of the laws of nature. If that object is going to change shape then there are physical forces at work. So if three different observers in three different frames of reference observe the physical object at different lengths from the other frames of reference then are you going to say that the physical object is three different physical sizes at the same time? It does not matter if the observers disagree on the measurement. The object is the size that it is without any regard to what some observer thinks its size is. The object has a size before it is observed. Are you suggesting that objects are deciding what size to be by what frame of reference they are being observed from? Do you realize that by saying that objects are what size they are after being observed is saying that the objects physical size is effected by observation, and that object has to know what frame of reference that the observer is occupying in order to be the size that is appropriate to that frame of reference. In order to observe anything you have to receive light from that object. So, if the object is physically smaller when light was reflected off it, that object has to know in advance what size to be. Or you could just say that the object APPEARS to be smaller, but in actuality it is not physically contracted. So you see the question is; Does the object really contract or does it appear to contract. What do you think?

8. ## Defining time

O.K. Klaynos, We can both agree that time is something that is real to us. So time would have to exist in some way for us. Forget about my either or choice, I am sure that you have some idea of how time exist or is real to you, so I would be interested in hearing from you what you think time is. Thank You. Eric 5 As far as your comparison between time and energy, these two topics are different. Describing energy will not get us any closer to what time is, they are two different things. I have raised the question about the nature of time because you have said that clocks measure time. Since I never really asked you what you meant by that, I will ask you now. In what way do you think a clock measures time? Length is a measurement. A measurement is part of a man made system developed so that man could quantify the dimensions of an object, or the distance between objects. Before man there was no units of length. Before man there was no concept of measurement or length. Man gives specific lengths to objects. Objects exist as they are, man gave them length. Length is not a naturally occurring ingredient that is part of an object. When you say that length is a property of an object, that property was assigned to that object by man, length is not intrinsic to that object. An object will exist whether it was measured or not. Remember, the only way an object can receive a length is after it was measured by man. Length is part of agreed upon system of measurements and did not exist before man. One inch, one foot, seven miles, those are not things that exist in a physical form, they are concepts. The idea of how long something is. Man thought of measurement and then measurements existed. Length started out as a concept and has been thoroughly communicated so as to become an agreed upon idea. Time is just another measurement based on an idea. Man decided what a second of time is. All measurements of time did not exist before man. Now we can measure physical objects and the distance between objects, so the measurement of length is applied to physical things. Physical objects exist, and man can measure these things. The objects are physical, the measurement is a concept. The measuring device is physical, the object that it measures is physical. So, when you say a clock (a physical device) measures time, what do you mean? What is being measured?
9. ## Gravity is Time

Originally Posted by Eric 5 If physical matter really does contract, then physical forces are at work. A physical force would act on this matter to make it shorter, and a physical force would have to bring it back to its original shape Do you think that physical objects physically contract during this phenomenon? All objects have a size and shape whether they are observed or not, agree? Do you think that just by observing an object, that object will change length? You say that length contraction means different observers find lenghts to be different. What makes the length of the object different for each observer? I am interested in finding out more on this subject. Thank You. Eric 5
10. ## Why does speed time slow down when you go fast then the speed of light

Swansont. Do you want to continue this discussion on time here? Or do you want to move it to the thread Defining TIme in the general physics section? I would like to respond to your most recent post, but do not want to have a discussion on time in two different threads.

12. ## Gravity is Time

The material objects do not actually contract. Notice that the cars do not actually get smaller. No car is shown to get smaller. You do see that right? It is all based on how the objects are measured and not the measurement of a object that got smaller. Nothing gets smaller as it is moving, look again if you dont believe me. Right! the animation explains how lenght contraction works. It also shows you that nothing gets smaller as it moves. It was explained simply and you can see nothing gets smaller as it moves. What do your eyes tell you? Nothing gets smaller that is my viewpoint. With all the explaination and visuals on the web site that supports my statement and you trying to deny this fact makes me think that either you do not want to accept the facts or you are just trying to be funny and push my buttons. Right! the ruler does not go from one longer lenght to a smaller length while it is in motion. Matter does not experience a lenght contraction. Matter will not and has not been shown to get shorter due to the lenght contraction phenomenon. The math for this does not involve any force on the matter in motion. If a material object is made to get shorter there has to be a force applied to that object. This is a physics forum, you should be familar with basic physics. There is no mention or explaination of force being applied to an object to make it contract, and you want me to accept the idea that it just happens. Why are you accepting this as an actual physical contraction of matter when you see no evidence of this occuring? This does not show how matter will physical change shape, force has to be applied to this matter, yet no mathmatical or visual evidence of this. Matter will not physically change shape, you can see this. There is no mathmatical, visual,or physical evidence that proves that matter physically changes shape due to lenght dilation.
13. ## Gravity is Time

I am saying that matter does not actually get smaller or contract, it only looks that way in the way the measurements are done.

16. ## Defining time

iNOW, in this thread i have asked if you think time is a man-made consideration or some naturally occuring thing that exists in some physical form. You have not responded to this easy question. I have asked thedarkshade if time is a material thing or a concept. No definative response. I have asked D.H. if time is a physical thing or a concept. No definative response. I am sure that all of you can answer this question. You all have an idea of what time is. I will get the whole thing started by saying that time is not a physical thing according to scientific references and observations. Time is a consideration. See it is not that hard to do. Just state your opinion and show me that I am wrong. This is your oppurtunity to put me in my place. You sound like you are a bit angry, use that energy to prove me wrong. Show everyone that I am wrong. Are you up to it or are you just going to continue to avoid the question? It is really easy to do. Time is either a physical thing or a consideration. Eric 5

18. ## Defining time

How do you define space? What is your reference? Use that reference or observation to describe space. There are physics dictionaries, use them.
19. ## Defining time

O.K. So there is air between my face and my hand. The air is real. So what else exists there? If you want to say that space is a real thing that is existing between my hand and my face, then this real thing has a location and can be located and therefore exists in a location. It would have physical properties of those things that can be located. So, again as with time. Tell me what this thing is made of that gives it the properties of being able to exist in a location. You tell me, besides the air between your hand and face, what other thing do you percieve? The term space is used to describe that area of nothing between objects. That area between you and what you are observing, that is space. Space is caused by looking out from a point. The concept of space comes about from the idea that one perceives through something when looking out from our point of view. There are objects that exist other than where we are viewing from, and by looking out to these items we create the idea of space. If space were a real physical thing don’t you think that reference books would state that space is a real thing. If space were a real physical thing it would have to exist in a location in space, that would not be logical. Again, to avoid any misunderstanding, please state if you think space exists as a physical thing or a concept. Thank You. Eric 5 Of course you would not have a problem with YOUR definition of time. But just to be fair, please state what your definition of time is. We have been corresponding on this topic for a while now and I do not recall what your definition of time is. Thank You. Eric 5
20. ## Defining time

These candidates would have to have some firm grasp on the basics in order to get a PhD. They understand the basics of physics (time being one of the basics), and this understanding can be found in any physics reference book. Science prides itself on knowing exactly what is going on in the universe, and science does not have a problem with its definition of time. There is no public outcry from the science community that the definition of time is wrong or incomplete. Just so I know what your view is on this, please state if you think that time is a physical thing or a concept. This will avoid any misunderstandings. Thank You. Eric 5
21. ## Defining time

Good. So you say that time is something that exists. So my question would be, exists in what way and where? Here are some definitions of exist, of course if you want to use different definitions of exist feel free to. EXIST----- to have actual being; be: to have life or animation; live. to continue to be or live: Belief in magic still exists to achieve the basic needs of existence, as food and shelter: Exist--- 1. To be as a fact and not as a mode; to have an actual or real being, whether material or spiritual. 2. To be manifest in any manner; to continue to be; as, great evils existed in his reign . 3. To live; to have life or the functions of vitality; as, men can not exist water, nor fishes on land. So in what way are you saying time exists? For time to exist it has to exist as something that is material or conceptual. Tell me in what way do you think time exists. In order for the whole world to have some idea of time it has to manifest itself in some way that is universal. Break it down, is time a material thing or a concept? You say it exists, so in what way? Material/concept? It is as easy as that.
22. ## Defining time

What are you saying? Do you think the field of physics completely understands time or not?
23. ## Defining time

Very nice. So lets get this straight, do you think that time is a man made consideration or some naturally occurring thing that exists in some physical form?
24. ## Defining time

Are you suggesting that the field of physics does not understand what time is? Are you going to suggest that no one in physics understands what time is. The idea of time is part of the foundation of physics and you think that time is not understood. Physics does understand time and physics does have an exact definition of time. The problem is that some people want time to be more then it is, so they will say that time is not understood or that it is some mysterious thing. The definition of time is all that there is. Physics has defined time and there has been no protest from the physics community, so it is an agreed upon definition of time. It has been suggested that time is a physical thing that clocks measure, or time was created at the Big Bang, or time is part of this thing called the fabric of space-time, or that time is a dimension. All of this depends on time being some physical thing with a structure or energy, yet there is no reference or observation to back this up. Nowhere in standard physics is it stated that time is a thing. I have been saying this for a while now and some say that I am wrong, time is a thing. Well I have been asking for that proof and have not been presented with any evidence. My claim that time is not a physical thing can be backed up with any reference book, dictionary or observation. Those who think I am wrong should be able to simply and easily prove me wrong, but this is not the case. If someone thinks time is a thing than prove it with some evidence. If it is a thing then I am sure someone can show evidence of this. Time is actually a consideration based on our perception of the movement of objects. There is a distance, there is a velocity of the objects travel, and that movement of that object or particle in relationship to its starting point and in relationship to its ending point is what gives us the idea of time. Time is a manifestation which has no existence beyond the idea of time brought about by the motion of objects, where an object may be either energy or matter. Time is not a thing that flows. Time does not move or cause things to move. It is this perception of motion which gives us the idea of time. Take a look at a clock or any of the devices constructed by man to measure time. Are these devices actually measuring a force or thing called time? If you believe that clocks or any such device measures time then ask yourself, how does this measurement occur. If you were to take the batteries out of a clock it will no longer work and therefore no longer “measure” time. Clocks are man made devices that are made to move according to a pre-engineered construction. Man decides how a clock will move, not time.
25. ## Defining time

Still no answer from you on the scientific definition of time. Use any definition or reference that you want to explain that time is a physical thing. All you can do is protest my request for a physics definition of time that states it is more then a mere measurement of motion. Use your technical sources. Give the definition of time that is used in science. You are avoiding the request. Just give or link to some source that states the physics definition of time that supports your view that time is more than a measurement of motion. Time is actually a consideration based on our perception of the movement of objects. There is a distance, there is a velocity of the objects travel, and that movement of that object or particle in relationship to its starting point and in relationship to its ending point is what gives us the idea of time. Time is a manifestation which has no existence beyond the idea of time brought about by the motion of objects, where an object may be either energy or matter. Time is not a thing that flows. Time does not move or cause things to move. It is this perception of motion which gives us the idea of time. Can you provide a physics definition that refutes or invalidates this definition of time?
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