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Posts posted by Outrider

  1. 5 hours ago, zapatos said:

    Sticking point for me too, but because I'm not convinced the chemical interactions control me.

    It's more of a moot point for me. If I knew that my gut had made me do everything that I regret I would no longer feel the guilt but then who decided that? It just doesn't change anything. So I choose to act and feel as if I have freewill. Just in case.

    5 hours ago, iNow said:

    Off-topic in our inner pp's... peas... piece... peace thread, though.

    Even though it changes nothing I find the subject interesting and deserving of it's own thread apart from our inner pees thread.:rolleyes:

    8 hours ago, koti said:

    This is outrageous.

    I have been known to fib to prove a point but thanks koti.

    @Eise nailed it!

  2. 15 minutes ago, Arete said:

    Well yes. :P A third of the human population also has golden staph living in their noses.  

    For a normal, healthy adult chance encounters with opportunistic pathogens has a negligible infection risk. The main issue is that when you deliberately grow one of these opportunistic pathogens in a culture, you end up with many many magnitudes more than you would ever encounter in nature, thus the risk of infection from a culture of a pathogen is many times greater than that of a chance encounter with bacteria in the environment.  

    So...I have a wife and daughter with fairly long hair and if you imagine I clean out my drain traps once a year you would be right. How risky is it? Trust me no one has to tell you to wash up after cleaning, what we call in  Alabama, a pee trap. Dosent matter if it's the kitchen sink it's still a pee trap.

  3. MigL

    I thought the mass determinations of distant galaxies  were done in part by luminosity/apparent magnitude so that if the distances are different than our current understanding they might have more or less mass. One of the key indicators that DM exists is that most (all?) galaxies we observe don't have enough visible matter to hold themselves together. So if the distance to a particular galaxy is adjusted I assume it's mass would be adjusted as well. 

    Or I could be wrong.

  4. 22 minutes ago, zapatos said:

    No, I understood your point completely. I disagree with it, and provided examples of the way in which I do have control.


    18 minutes ago, dimreepr said:

    But that control is limited not ultimate, so where on the spectrum do you position yourself and why does that position lead to peace?

    Zap has told you several times and yet you just rinse and repeat as always. Go back and reread the thread if you are honestly confused. 


    11 minutes ago, dimreepr said:

    FFS way to miss the point

    So you refuse to answer my questions?

  5. 1 hour ago, dimreepr said:

    You're going to have to explain yourself here.

    Do you think you can control how drunk you get, after a bottle of whiskey, or do you think you can control what extras others put in your cola? 

    Nice how you ignore all my questions and demand I answer yours. Thank you for an excellent opportunity to exercise my self control. Of many options I choose to answer the question. 

    I choose not to drink any whiskey and to guard what I do drink carefully which makes your question moot.

  6. 1 hour ago, Strange said:

    Actually, those things were evidence for dark matter. I don't know how we got on to that. It hardly seems relevant to the thread topic.

    Ah yes I was wrong...again...sigh.

    But it does stand that we have alot of evidence for a 13.8 billion year old universe and very little for an older or younger universe?

    Also much of the evidence for the age of and the expansion of our universe,DM and DE overlaps?

    I have a related question that I would appreciate your opinion on in just a sec.

    2 hours ago, Mordred said:

    Essentially correct, but keep in mind we never ignore any body of evidence regardless of how few those observations are.

    Well maybe not and I apologize for the confusion I caused. But as I said to Strange I think the point still stands. And yes I understand we must consider all data points.

    Here is my question that I hope both of you will offer your opinions.

    It has been  claimed "estimated that between 18% and 48% of all the Type Ia SN prior to 2013 have been misclassified and should actually be Type Iax SN."

    Any idea as to the accuracy of the claim? If true would this be a real game changer?

    I'm guessing it would definitely change the age of the universe. Remove the need for dark matter and/or dark energy or possibly increase the need. Among other things. 

    T.McGrath made the claim in this thread.  http://www.scienceforums.net/topic/110756-why-do-we-think-there-is-dark-matter-and-dark-energy/




  7. 1 hour ago, Strange said:

    The original observation was the speeds of galaxies within clusters. Since then we have had:

    • Galactic rotation curves
    • The power spectrum of the CMB
    • Gravitational lensing
    • The bullet cluster
    • Large scale structure formation
    • Big Bang nucleosynthesis

    So we have multiple lines of evidence pointing to a 13.8 billion year old universe and thousands (more?) of observed objects that fit very well into that framework. And we have a very small handfull of anomalies that suggest a different age. It should be easy to see where to start the inquiry. 

  8. 25 minutes ago, iNow said:

    It's the same reason I keep rooting for my sports team even when they are losing and really suck. It's tribal and about self-identity

    Yes! But how better to fight that? And even if you convince me to fight my bias and I convince you how do we spread that to a larger audience?

  9. iNow

    I agree freewill is both a fascinating and worthwhile subject. Would you agree that in most (all?) situations it is better to act as if we have it? I mean I wouldn't know how to act as if I didn't. 


    3 minutes ago, dimreepr said:

    That wasn't my question.

    Reframe the question please I apparently don't understand it as asked.

  10. Tell you what dimreepr I'm just going to leave the muddy waters behind. If I have done anything to offend please forgive me. 

    I believe that both you and me have some measure of control over our own physical bodies and also our intellect that is our thoughts, moods and emotions? Do you agree? If not why?

    I believe that by exercising my control over myself I can increase (yet never master) that control. Do you agree? If not why?

    I believe that gaining better control over my thoughts, moods and emotions is a very important (not the only one) component in the road toward inner peace. Do you agree? If not why?

    I also believe I have proved this to myself in my own life and am trying to pass it on. All the while listening to the other commenters hoping to gain new insight. Wimning the argument is trival for me. If I learn and you learn that is more than enough satisfaction. 

    2 hours ago, dimreepr said:

    I realise you're 'trying' to make a joke, but your only able to do this because of your cultural environment which you have no control of; it's ironic that your limited choices are buggering up the environment for everyone else. :P

    Yeah I was trying to be funny and make a point at the same time. I'll not make the same mistake again.

    When a bird builds a nest it is taking some measure of control over it's environment. When a colony of ants builds a hill it is likewise taking some control. And while I my not have the skills to build an a.c. unit from scratch much less build and maintain a power grid to run that unit by myself. With the help and cooperation of my fellow human beings I can. And yes I have a very small bit of control over that process as well. I can pay the power bill or not.

    2 hours ago, dimreepr said:

    Which is it?

    This shows I did a really bad job of explaining myself, sorry about that.


    On 11/7/2017 at 8:07 AM, dimreepr said:

    You talk about controlling your anger when you really mean suppressing it, you still feel the anger

    No I really don't feel the anger at all when I am in control of my emotions. When I am not in control I do feel the anger and in some situations I suppress it. I don't  think it is always a good thing to express our emotions in the heat of the moment depends on the situation. 

    Control of emotion and suppression of emotion are two different things. Do you agree? If not why?

     So anytime you see something happen to another that would make you mad and they don't get mad do you assume they are suppressing? 

  11. On 11/04/2017 at 3:34 PM, Ten oz said:

    Everyone had the same truth. Today parties are defined by different truths. By today's strandards Eisenhower, Nixon, Ford and Bush 41 were all Democrats:

    No they were Republicans back when they really were grand. Ironic considering your first sentence in the quote box. Part of the problem with finding middle ground is that neither party can resist taking shots at each and both find it easy to rewrite history whenever convenient. It's part of the reason I no longer identify as Republican.

    On 11/04/2017 at 3:34 PM, Ten oz said:

    Eisenhower - Pro NATO, Federal Aid Highway Act of 1956 was billions in govt infastructure spending, supported the Civil Rights Act of 57' & 60', placed National Guard members unnder federal control to enforce Brown vsthe board of education, made Earl Warren the Chief Justice of the supreme court, made HI a state, and coined "military industrial complex".

    Nixon - Pro China, sought Vietnam withdraw, created the EPA, supported the Clean Air Act of 1970, supported the Philadelphia plan (affirmitive action),  and expanded medicare in 72'.

    Ford - endoresedan Amnesty program for those who had refuse to fight in Vietnam, WIN program sought tax increases to combat inflation, signed the Education For All Handicapped Children Act, and was openly pro choice.

    Bush 43 - Raised taxes, endorsed the Americans with Disabilities Act, reauthorized the Clean Air Act, increased legal immigration by 40%, resigned his NRA membership, pro NATO, and signed the Strategic Arms Reduction, Treaty.


    Most of this shouldn't be considered partisan issues. The fact that you and others think they are is part of the problem.

  12. 7 hours ago, Ten oz said:

    There are significantly more people employed in solar than there is employed in coal. I feel like you are proving the point that fear of losing what one has isn't actually behind climate denial. Coal only accounts for les than 8% of the total number of people working in energy. That isn'[t enough inidividual people to move the needle on public opinion and yet coal miners and their concerns is a centeral topic of national conversation.

    Why only coal counts? When you add in oil and natural gas it's about 50/50 and thats me letting you have biofuels and nukes. Which while renewable are not really clean. I know I only addressed a small group of deniers but I stand by my proposal. According to your chart above oil, gas and coal represent over 1 million jobs I think their concerns should figure into any middle ground we can find.

    7 hours ago, Ten oz said:

    Clearly tens of millions of more people than those actually associated with the coal industy are taking up strong positions and denying facts. Fear isn't their reason; they don't work in the industry.

    Of course your right and if I came off as proposing a solution to the entire problem that was not my intention.

  13. 19 hours ago, Prometheus said:

    Imagine how empty your life would have to be to never feel grief or anger.

    Thats impossible I am just trying to minimize it.

    19 hours ago, Prometheus said:

    If all roads lead to Rome i'll see you when we get there.

    I am looking forward to it!


    3 hours ago, zapatos said:

    Well, one of us is muddying the water here but I'm not sure it is me. 

    It's not you.

    3 hours ago, dimreepr said:

    Again you've missed my point, we have no more control over ourselves than we do others;

    Of course we do.

    3 hours ago, dimreepr said:

    our environment

    I have the air conditioning running right now.

    4 hours ago, dimreepr said:

    and diet has a major effect on our moods and behaviour (iNow can explain it in far more detail).

    I choose what I consume I am lucky that way not everyone has the same choices I do.

    4 hours ago, dimreepr said:

    You talk about controlling your anger when you really mean suppressing it, you still feel the anger

    No I don't feel the anger. I agree that suppressing emotions is a very bad thing but suppression and control are two very different things. So anytime you see something happen to another that would make you mad and they don't you assume they are suppressing? Maybe they just have a different perspective. That is what control is all about gaining better perspectives. When I am driving and someone cuts me off I can get mad or just bump the brake and let them go. It's my choice. But what if it makes me late to work then I should get mad? Not really I could have left the house earlier. In fact that is an actual strategy by me to cut down on situations that cause me stress. I'm usually 20 to 30 minutes early to work. 

    If someone says I'm wrong I can choose to get mad or I can choose to investigate the claim. If they call me a name I can get mad or I can choose to pity them for their small vocabulary. 

    I can't avoid anger in every situation nor do I want to but I have become fairly skilled at minimizing it and I think that has enriched my life.

    The point about expectations is if you have none you will never be disappointed but I think expectations are a good thing. However many people set them to high. I need to keep my expectations reasonable and realistic. 

    3 hours ago, dimreepr said:

    what I don't concede is that you have ultimate control of yourself

    No one here has claimed this.

  14. 12 hours ago, Sensei said:

    You took my post personally..

    Maybe. You said everybody above the age of 70 was ignorant of climate change and my dad and my mom are in that group so maybe. I would still have problems if you had said the Chinese or any number of other groups on the same grounds. What you said was unfounded discrimination.

    I have shown you where you are wrong.

    12 hours ago, Sensei said:

    Well, make a test. Get modern school books (physics, chemistry, biology etc.), and read them. Make tests they contain, to check how much do you still know and remember from them. Test knowledge from books on your dad, and grandpas, giving them questions from books..

    What? This thread is about climate change and I had assumed you meant our elders were ignorant of that now you implie they are ignorant of everything?

    You make a test get out in the world and talk to some older folks. I have no need of a test I talk to my 70+ parents just about everyday and they are neither deniers or ignorant. 

    "physics, chemistry, biology"

    I am ignorant in quite a few areas on these subjects and so is my dad. But give him any kind of "modern" computer with any kind of soft or hardware malfunction and he will have it repaired before either us is through  troubleshooting.

  15. 11 minutes ago, Butch said:

    That is not true, you had better check your facts, he does not make apologies or change his story for anyone...

    <blockquote class="twitter-tweet"><p lang="en" dir="ltr">If Senate Republicans don&#39;t get rid of the Filibuster Rule and go to a 51% majority, few bills will be passed. 8 Dems control the Senate!</p>&mdash; Donald J. Trump (@realDonaldTrump) <a href="https://twitter.com/realDonaldTrump/status/901029770401546243?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw">August 25, 2017</a></blockquote> <script async src="https://platform.twitter.com/widgets.js" charset="utf-8"></script>

    <blockquote class="twitter-tweet"><p lang="en" dir="ltr">Few, if any, Administrations have done more in just 7 months than the Trump A. Bills passed, regulations killed, border, military, ISIS, SC!</p>&mdash; Donald J. Trump (@realDonaldTrump) <a href="https://twitter.com/realDonaldTrump/status/901032475111116800?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw">August 25, 2017</a></blockquote> <script async src="https://platform.twitter.com/widgets.js" charset="utf-8"></script>

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